150 replies to this topic

[justcallme A S H]

Oh are we talking about the "dead zone" for AMS?

If so that exists on all AMS mechs, not just a BLR. That has been tested, can confirm.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 19 April 2017 - 11:00 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Mcgral18, on 19 April 2017 - 09:57 PM, said:

Science has been satiated

What the actual ****. Well, that's good science right there.

EDIT:

Right so calculating that (mind you this is theoretical, and i am not a statistician nor mathematician), 6230 missiles and 1802 match score = 3.4-ish missiles per match score. That means, each match, you need to down 850 missiles without doing anything at all, to break even (at 250 match score) despite a losing game.

Quote

If a LRM is moving towards you at a speed of 120m per second and you are standing still, it will take them 1.67 seconds to reach you once they are with in range of the AMS. In that time, the AMS will lock onto and destroy 3 missiles, expending 27 ammo to do so. In this case seven Allied AMS would be able to shoot down a LRM20 volley.

It makes no difference whether four LRM 5s or a single LRM 20 is fired at you. Missiles that are fired in a series of volleys will give AMS more time to destroy more missiles. If you are running away from the LRM launcher, your AMS will have more time to destroy incoming missiles. If a LRM is moving at 120m / sec at and you are stationary, the AMS will ideally shoot down 3 LRMs in that volley. Therefore, 7 Allied AMS should be able to shoot down an entire LRM20 volley.

http://mwo.gamepedia..._Missile_System

Now, even if 3x AMS of kitfox and Nova is not that completely efficient in downing entire volleys. Though at 3.5 DPS, + 2.5 DPS of the Overload, that means 71.43% increase in efficiency, a single AMS with overload would down 5.142857142857143 or rather 5 missiles. The 3x AMS + overload kitfox would have downed 15.42857142857143 missiles, or an LRM15 volley. With the Nova at a total of 30% bonus ROF, increases that to 6.685714285714286, and 3x AMS, a Nova with 3x AMS + overload would down 20.05714285714286 missiles, or just a single LRM20 volley.

Then again, that was using the radius of the AMS due to the target being the AMS-er. Now there's only score when protecting allies, so the AMS protection can be put in a way that maximizes the area of Missile-genocide, to 240m, that literally doubles the available missiles destroyed. Which means, that is already an LRM40A TBR shot that's not chainfired.

850 missiles isn't exactly hard to bring, though of course an AMS couldn't possibly down all those. But still considering the LRMpocalypse that is Tier 5, there will be lots of idiotic lurm-boats that has around 1440+ ammo reserves, which is plenty to farm 850 missiles, to get 250 match score. And that is not including the other means of getting a score, like dealing damage or spotting.

Considering this, boosting the use of 3x AMS Kitfox and Nova, or just a whole bunch of AMS shutting down LRM batteries, this move probably killed LRMs even more due to the potentially abusable AMS, and obviously made PSR even more invalid. Now i gotta rub elbows with pilots that neglected to improve their positioning skills.

My. *******. God.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 19 April 2017 - 11:38 PM.

[Mcgral18]

It made quite the show





And in condensed GIF form

Spoiler

I would seriously like to get 12 Mad Dogs with LRM5s to see what happens...
Or 12 cLRM60s (isLRMs almost break through, cLRMs noticeable weaker)

Edited by Mcgral18, 19 April 2017 - 11:22 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Mcgral18, on 19 April 2017 - 11:21 PM, said:

It made quite the show





And in condensed GIF form

Spoiler

I would seriously like to get 12 Mad Dogs with LRM5s to see what happens...
Or 12 cLRM60s (isLRMs almost break through, cLRMs noticeable weaker)

So, any opinions on the scoring, considering the work you've put?

[Mcgral18]

The6thMessenger, on 19 April 2017 - 11:39 PM, said:

So, any opinions on the scoring, considering the work you've put?

Perhaps a touch high

Maybe 1 for every 5 missiles, but this is a quirked AMS system as well (meaning more effective)

[Khobai]

it should be more like 1 per 50 missiles shot down

shooting down hundreds of missiles in a match isnt exactly hard

[Athom83]

Mcgral18, on 20 April 2017 - 08:33 AM, said:

Perhaps a touch high
Maybe 1 for every 5 missiles, but this is a quirked AMS system as well (meaning more effective)

And how would AMS Overload and/or AMS range affect the rate of missile defense.

[Rhialto]

Finally I was able to play maybe 15 matches in a KF to test that out and I don't think it's a problem for now. First LRM are not in every game and when I was finally in a game where I could test this out and running to catch LRMs (not targeted at me) I endend up with a OK score, not an exagerated highscore but just a normal bump from doing my duty of protecting and that's a nice welcome.

Of course video like above specially crafted to show the problem is different but other than that I don't think current values are an issue. I don't see everyone suddenly running 3 x AMS because of this. It's new so you may see more for now but all will go back to normal shortly.

Move along, there is nothing to see here.

Edited by Rhialto, 20 April 2017 - 08:59 AM.

[Mcgral18]

Athom83, on 20 April 2017 - 08:57 AM, said:

And how would AMS Overload and/or AMS range affect the rate of missile defense.

More get destroyed, because you hit them sooner, and hit them harder
And in the Nova's case, 20-30% more often


That results in more destruction, and higher scores VS Vanilla systems.

[Mystere]

Saving your team's collective *** by downing 6200 missiles worth of potential damage should reward you handsomely one way or another.

Other than the c-bill payout. I don't see the problem.

Edited by Mystere, 20 April 2017 - 09:14 AM.

[justcallme A S H]

I just had a 600 match score / 728dmg match - 258 missiles/AMS (kept screen of this if anyone wants to disect)
Normally that'd be ~500 match score.

Earlier I 400 match score / 350dmg - killed 250 missiles/AMS
Normally that'd be ~250-300 match score

AMS is padding, hard, even with the component increase/dmg decrease for match score points.



I LOL'd hard when I saw 600 match score. CLOSE THE GATES! The T4s are about to invade T1.

[Mystere]

justcallme A S H, on 20 April 2017 - 09:48 AM, said:

CLOSE THE GATES! The T4s are about to invade T1.

It's too late! They're already inside. <maniacal >

Edited by Mystere, 20 April 2017 - 10:54 AM.

[Baulven]

Khobai, on 20 April 2017 - 08:37 AM, said:

it should be more like 1 per 50 missiles shot down

shooting down hundreds of missiles in a match isnt exactly hard

While it needs to be toned down that is probably a little too far. 1:5 would be decent I think. With your recommendation you would get 10 points for 500 missiles, and without cbills rewards that puts them back into the meh lineup pretty firmly for most folks. Hell even now people don't really want to mount it since it still doesn't give yoy anything tangible.

[Bud Crue]

Mystere, on 20 April 2017 - 10:53 AM, said:

It's too late! They're already inside. <maniacal >

Yup...be there soon!

[Mystere]

Bud Crue, on 20 April 2017 - 03:32 PM, said:

Yup...be there soon!

Save yourself! Get a joystick!

[Baulven]

So with the change to AMS what would the suggested LRM buff be to make the weapon system still worth taking?

[Mystere]

Baulven, on 20 April 2017 - 03:37 PM, said:

So with the change to AMS what would the suggested LRM buff be to make the weapon system still worth taking?

2x-3x the speed.

[Bud Crue]

Mystere, on 20 April 2017 - 03:33 PM, said:

Save yourself! Get a joystick!

I couldn't take it. I tried for about the first 6 months that I played (and playing almost exclusively lights). No I am bad enough without that sort of "help". If someone as bad as me is progressing through t2, I figure t1 is an inevitability no matter how badly I perform.

[Mystere]

From today's patch notes:

Quote

Destroying an Enemy Missile with AMS (when targeting an ally)
• Match Score contribution decreased

Meh! I wanted T1 flooded.

Edited by Mystere, 20 April 2017 - 03:53 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Did i just pissed PGI off?