69 replies to this topic

[PewPew2]

Wasnt it called ferro-glass? Seems too simple though.

[Undead Bane]

Well, about books and headshotting - the targetting systems did not allow that. Thay made mistakes, barrels drifted, did not point to the correct target's location at various distances etc. Seeng the same in the game may be fun for some time, but may be gamebreaking the same time.

[Squigles]

Undead Bane, on 21 July 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:

Well, about books and headshotting - the targetting systems did not allow that. Thay made mistakes, barrels drifted, did not point to the correct target's location at various distances etc. Seeng the same in the game may be fun for some time, but may be gamebreaking the same time.

In an ideal world, I think being able to blow someones head clean off in a salvo or 2, displaying good targeting skills, would be just fine. Unfortunately any kind of weak spot like this makes aimbot cheats even more painful then they'd usually be, so long as PGI can find a means to keep client side cheating under control, the vulnerable heads are just grand imo.

[Undead Bane]

Squigles, on 21 July 2012 - 04:31 PM, said:

In an ideal world, I think being able to blow someones head clean off in a salvo or 2, displaying good targeting skills, would be just fine. Unfortunately any kind of weak spot like this makes aimbot cheats even more painful then they'd usually be, so long as PGI can find a means to keep client side cheating under control, the vulnerable heads are just grand imo.

Well, if a "targetting system failure" was implemented into the server mechanics (and they are currently not implemented at all, as far as I could see) - this alone would be a superp anti-aimbot protection. Otherwise, any part slightly more vulnerable, than the others would be a 100% target to aimbot.
However, right now I don't see any means to counter aimbots being implemented... We'll see.
Just doubling armor won't solve the issue with bots

Edited by Undead Bane, 21 July 2012 - 04:36 PM.

[Grey Weasel]

aresfiend, on 21 July 2012 - 12:17 PM, said:

All of those features are built into the neurohelmet..... Why would you need to replace ferroglass (I forgot the name originally) with cameras to accomplish what the neurohelmet can do anyway?

Except they are not. Nowhere has that ever been stated that I can find, and Sarna gives a good description of what to expect.

[Artimus]

Great thread! To answer the original questions, I'll have to say that I'll wait to see how the game play reacts.

One thing about reading the novels is that you rarely see Mechwarriors targeting a specific region of the Mech, at least in this timeline, or unless they have personal reasons to do otherwise. I believe that even in the tabletop you would take a roll penalty if you called a shot. Generally, Mechwarrior seem pretty happy to score a hit, wherever it may fall. Unfortunately, I believe due to computing power, many of the previous MW PC/Video games made it quite easy to target a head or leg. It would be great if MWO made it possible to better replicate the fiction/tabletop Mechwarrior experience of this timeline, making it somewhat challenging to even score a hit, let-alone a called shot.

Lets say you can develop the skill to make some decent called shots. Then I would hope that there would be reasons to not always target the head or legs. I'd like to be able to use knowledge and experience to exploit weakness in a given opposed load out, like if someone skimps on armor to pack in a few more rounds of AC ammo into a certain body section.

[Alex Wolfe]

Guys, some of you really seem to be overthinking the whole "WHY windows and not cameras" issue.

Same reason why they are piloted, giant robots and not unmanned drones: it's the style of the genre. It has no logical justification other than "a visible cockpit conveys the sense of scale and serves as a throwback to WWI/II style of dogfighting, romanticized version of which the "giant robots" genre emulates in a way". Thus... windows are here to stay.

Bipedal tanks the size of a building make no sense either. It's a matter of style over substance... because sheer substance would likely be pretty dull.

Edited by Alex Wolfe, 21 July 2012 - 04:52 PM.

[Squigles]

Grey Weasel, on 21 July 2012 - 04:41 PM, said:

Except they are not. Nowhere has that ever been stated that I can find, and Sarna gives a good description of what to expect.

http://www.sarna.net...Mech_Technology

Lot to absorb in there, so here's the important bit for you.

The massive neurohelmets of the succession wars, which sat on the shoulders and inhibited the MechWarriors ability to turn their head, compressed a 360-degree view from external cameras and sensors into a 160-degree HUD display in the helmet with the different firing arcs deliniated and having their own reticules for weapons in those firing arcs.

All that said, I'm not saying you'd not want a transparent viewport for the pilot to look out of, as I've stated in an earlier post, the transparent canopy is just as protective as regular battlemech armor, the heads weakness is simply a product of being a small object, it can't mount all that much armor from the get go, even if it was completely opaque a gauss round would still tear it to shreds.

[Taxtripelsix]

Hi everybody , very interesting discusion , but.......... As I can see most of the Mechs have "Windows" all i can see on Blueprints ist a seat behind Windows where the Pilot is Looking throu a Type of clear compound Material . As far as I remember the main Reason for the Neurohelmet was to adoped the Pilots balance to the Mech...what ever was aded to this in all Cockpits there are still Joysticks. This ist not the Movie "Firefox" with Clint Eastwood. No Pilot would ever trade clear Vision throu his Eyes to a Monitor. If you ever tried to manuver someting big in Motion only throu Cameras you woult preaty fast find out why there is nothing superior to direckt Vision.

An aircraft canopy is a protective cover used over the cockpit. Typically constructed of a clear or composite material, the aircraft canopy allows the pilot to be protected from the elements while offering a clear view. Fighter aircraft are aided by the inclusion of a bubble-type aircraft canopy in their design which offers the same unobstructed view. Military aircraft canopy construction is typically made of bulletproof or bullet-resistant materials.

The single-seat cockpit is protected by all-round armour, with a titanium 'bathtub' structure to protect the pilot that is up to 3.8cm thick. The cockpit has a large bulletproof bubble canopy, which gives good all-round vision. A10 Wartog <----
A-10 Thunderbolt (Warthog) this is a Tank Killer , so they are aware that there would be a lot of defence fire.

Lets go to that Point. The Material of the "Windows" in a Battletech MWO Cockpit is as strong or close to the Armor he carries. The only thing I could Imagine that it has to be thicker as regular Armor and it would be much more expensive than regular Armor.......

Still the Pilot is the weakest Part of any Machine on the Battlefield. So a Headshot ,if possible would take out the whole Machine , if you destroy/kill the driver of a modern Battletank the tank possible still could fire but is dead meat because it wont be abel to move.....

I think we should accept that the Pilot is nessasery and thats why we like to play the game , but its the most important Component in a Mech. He is best Protected and not easy to kill directly. But if you Manage to do this the Mech is gone.

In reality it would be much easyer to cut of a Leg because the Pilot Area is very hard to hit. And he wont sit there just waiting that you make a second shot. That all to the circumstances that you and your Target are moving and you will get a lot of Fire on your own Mech a Headshot would be possible but very unlikely .

Sorry fo my bad english but I`m a little out of praktice .

Edited by Taxtripelsix, 22 July 2012 - 03:46 AM.

[CW Grayson]

Guys, you should relax and see the truth about cockpits. When all that started, the mech models looked cool and all. Catapult and Timberwolf for example have a really big glass cockpit. When trying to explain that obvious weak-spot, they came out with this "ferroglass" deus ex machina, to balance sh*t out.
Just accept the mechs look cooler with cockpits, but the damage-behaviour is like all mechs have no window (ok, a REALLY small hitbox) you can shoot at. Otherwise it would be a sniping fest.
Too much reality isn't always good for a good gameplay, otherwise an LB20-X shot to the head would always mean instant kill, we don't want that.