9 replies to this topic

[Mycroft000]

It's unnecessary, after optimizing my skill tree selections, I only have 4 nodes I can put into anything outside of Agility, Armor Structure, Mech Operations, and Sensors.

[Jikil]

I think the firepower tree kind of limits what you can do on a chassis without respeccing it. On omnimechs its especially bad meaning I can't just change my timberwolf from goosepepsi to srm brawling on the fly like I can currently.

It probably would be for the best if it was removed altogether. Then at least you could run different loadouts without your mech losing too much effectiveness.

Most people probably want it to stay because it directly improves your ability to destroy other mechs, while most the other skills just help make your mech better at everything else.

[Mycroft000]

All the firepower tree does in its current state is promote boating. The moment you spend a single point on an energy skill, it pushes you toward using more energy weapons.

Remove the weapon specific skills, and boating becomes less inherently beneficial. Remove the Firepower Tree and TTK goes up(which is a stated goal), those skill points become available for increased survivability(also increases TTK), and many other benefits become clear.

[Monkey Lover]

mycroft000, on 26 April 2017 - 09:23 AM, said:

All the firepower tree does in its current state is promote boating. The moment you spend a single point on an energy skill, it pushes you toward using more energy weapons.

Remove the weapon specific skills, and boating becomes less inherently beneficial. Remove the Firepower Tree and TTK goes up(which is a stated goal), those skill points become available for increased survivability(also increases TTK), and many other benefits become clear.

People boat because it works. Nothing is going to change this. No one is buying the best mixed point mechs they're looking for the mechs with 6m slots to put on 6srms. They dont want 2srm+4small lasers because this doesnt work. This is all without quirks.

You have to specialize in this game or you will die. You can mix all the quirks and i would still boat.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 26 April 2017 - 09:31 AM.

[Nicodemus Rosse]

I run a lot of Omnis and I'm starting to think that the skill tree design, especially the combination of respec costs and the structure of the firepower tree, is really designed to discourage heavy use of the firepower tree for Omnis.

I'm...not sure that specific part is a bad thing for balance, tbh. Unless you're really attached to a specific omni config (cough 4lpl ebon jag cough) you'd be better off focusing on the non-firepower trees and letting the inherent strengths of Clan weapons be enough on their own. That leaves weapon specialization as a thing that IS players can (maybe?) leverage more easily to offset some of the clamgear advantages. Clanners can still do it, but it's not going to be XP-efficient or time-efficient to constantly respec an omni's firepower tree.

OTOH I've lost count of the number of times I've monkeyed with the weapon loadouts on my Jenner IICs and HBK IICs to see what works for me, and I'd have wanted to try the firepower tree as part of that process. Much cursing would likely ensue.

I really wish some of these specific balance considerations were being addressed by PGI in a transparent way. If they are, I'm missing it.

[Ruar]

I think they need a firepower tree in order to promote options. Some people want to make glass cannons with the focus on weapons. That needs to be there for them. They just need to detangle the whole thing, go linear, and make skill selection easier/simpler while still having a high cost on the more effective options.

[Mycroft000]

Why does it always come back to a desire for linear trees? (EXTREMELY RHETORICAL QUESTION)

[Gazbeard]

Looking forward to the Civil War mech releases and 3 of the 4 are battlemechs with only 1 omnimech. Look back through the other releases this year and omnimechs are very much in the minority too.

Lump that in with the above comments about the firepower tree and boating, and it "seems" clear that PGI are trying to push people away from boating ... particularly when you look at the mixed weapon hardpoints on mechs like the Bushwacker series.

Hopefully it will also nerf the viability of the (especially Clan) metabuilds (2 PPC + Gauss, or 2 Gauss + PPC - on almost everything). It will also nerf poptarters as they'll have to expend skill points on their jumpjets and have less for firepower, which is good news for the mainly jumpjetless IS mechs.

[Cato Phoenix]

Gazbeard, on 26 April 2017 - 10:46 AM, said:

Looking forward to the Civil War mech releases and 3 of the 4 are battlemechs with only 1 omnimech. Look back through the other releases this year and omnimechs are very much in the minority too.

Lump that in with the above comments about the firepower tree and boating, and it "seems" clear that PGI are trying to push people away from boating ... particularly when you look at the mixed weapon hardpoints on mechs like the Bushwacker series.

Hopefully it will also nerf the viability of the (especially Clan) metabuilds (2 PPC + Gauss, or 2 Gauss + PPC - on almost everything). It will also nerf poptarters as they'll have to expend skill points on their jumpjets and have less for firepower, which is good news for the mainly jumpjetless IS mechs.

Nope, sorry.

1. Doesn't nerf gauss/PPC. Yes, some of the cooldown/heatgen/range is blocked if you want to max it out, but not greater than other builds. Plus, velocity is super easy to get to and this actually makes it quite easy to skill out a gauss/ppc mech.

2. The jumpjet quirks are not really necessary for poptarting. The jumpjet tree is completely additive. Poptarts will function exactly the same if they take no additional quirks.

[Shadowspawn42]

I am hoping for the opposite direction. I'd like them to buff the firepower tree to make up at least some of the ground we are losing. If I could invest all my points in firepower to keep my mechs the same offensively on live, I would do it in a heartbeat.