61 replies to this topic

[Baba_Yaga]

If you don't like the way PGI is developing the game, Cancel your prepacks! they are in this for the money! if that does not get their attention, then they are even bigger fools then they appear to be!

[cazidin]

We did that, and PGI only delayed their efforts. They won't change how the skill tree looks, they'll just re-arrange it a bit.

[fat4eyes]

If you have to rely on blackmail instead of reason to make your case, then you've lost the argument. The skill web is not going to destroy the game, the same way 3rd person did not destroy the game, the same way escort and incursion did not destroy the game. Observe, adapt, MAKE REASONED ARGUMENTS, and move on.

[cazidin]

fat4eyes, on 29 April 2017 - 10:56 AM, said:

If you have to rely on blackmail instead of reason to make your case, then you've lost the argument. The skill web is not going to destroy the game, the same way 3rd person did not destroy the game, the same way escort and incursion did not destroy the game. Observe, adapt, MAKE REASONED ARGUMENTS, and move on.

While I agree with you, we've tried and have been ignored.

[SuomiWarder]

Well duh, it goes without saying that you walk away from a product you don't like. To hold off at the moment to enforce a change you desire does not really say you are done with the product though - only that you are throwing a little temper tantrum and will likely crawl back soon enough. Making it an ineffective tactic.

[Nesutizale]

I agree. The skilltree might not be optimal and you will very likely not be able to play the way you did before but then its not that bad. Adapt to it....just imagne that you never had a skilltree and this is the first time we have one...in fact it is as the other one wasn't a tree.

[R Valentine]

fat4eyes, on 29 April 2017 - 10:56 AM, said:

If you have to rely on blackmail instead of reason to make your case, then you've lost the argument. The skill web is not going to destroy the game, the same way 3rd person did not destroy the game, the same way escort and incursion did not destroy the game. Observe, adapt, MAKE REASONED ARGUMENTS, and move on.

Hahahahahahaaha! "Blackmail". It's called a free market. What exactly are we black mailing them with? Our own money? Sorry, we get to spend that however we choose, or not spend it as it were. If you have to lie to make your case, then you've lost the argument.

[Bulletsponge0]

fat4eyes, on 29 April 2017 - 10:56 AM, said:

If you have to rely on blackmail instead of reason to make your case, then you've lost the argument. The skill web is not going to destroy the game, the same way 3rd person did not destroy the game, the same way escort and incursion did not destroy the game. Observe, adapt, MAKE REASONED ARGUMENTS, and move on.

Sir, this is the internet. Reason and logic have no place here.

[Moonlight Grimoire]

And here I am okay with the skill "web" coming even with it's drawbacks and nerfs because no more rule of three. I am okay with having to manually sell my modules if it comes down to it, even though I hate having to do it, going to be a pain in the rump but whatever. And here I am considering picking up the standard pack Annihilator tonight after several months of thinking about it. PGI is mostly doing right imo, the GSP refund not being optional is the only major beef I have because the rest can be changed with later patches and SP in effected trees refunded with ease. Is it perfect? No, but, it is a good change from the rule of 3 and the OP nature of current version of radar derp in game now.

[Lukoi Banacek]

cazidin, on 29 April 2017 - 10:52 AM, said:

We did that, and PGI only delayed their efforts. They won't change how the skill tree looks, they'll just re-arrange it a bit.

Well regardless of how clicky it is, and just a bit painful to deal with, at the core most complaints about the ST could actually be fixed with re-arranging a bit -- less useless nodes, streamlined approach to specialization (even with gateways etc).

The ST brings more to it than the tree tho: engine desync, dequirkening of alot of mechs that need it, a reimbursement plan that could probably use more player choice in the form it takes etc.

[R Valentine]

Moonlight Grimoire, on 29 April 2017 - 11:11 AM, said:

And here I am okay with the skill "web" coming even with it's drawbacks and nerfs because no more rule of three. I am okay with having to manually sell my modules if it comes down to it, even though I hate having to do it, going to be a pain in the rump but whatever. And here I am considering picking up the standard pack Annihilator tonight after several months of thinking about it. PGI is mostly doing right imo, the GSP refund not being optional is the only major beef I have because the rest can be changed with later patches and SP in effected trees refunded with ease. Is it perfect? No, but, it is a good change from the rule of 3 and the OP nature of current version of radar derp in game now.

The refund is just one many failings with the skill tree. Balance, useless nodes, respec costs, imperceptibly small bonuses from nodes, it all has to go. The tree if flawed from its very foundation. Not just a minor concern with the refund.

[4rcs1ne]

I'm getting kind of sick of these "Adapt and overcome" arguments. The fact is, the IS is going to take a massive hit and the Clan vs IS disparity will increase even further.

[Bishop Steiner]

cazidin, on 29 April 2017 - 10:52 AM, said:

We did that, and PGI only delayed their efforts. They won't change how the skill tree looks, they'll just re-arrange it a bit.

And Russ told y'all at the time that he wasn't going to cave to changing the skill tree to a more easily minmaxed model. I hope he sticks to that.

[Cy Mitchell]

I am not cancelling my pre-orders. I want my Uziel. I also promised to buy the Mad Cat MKII if it was put in the game. I stick to my word. Oh Yeah, and they are finally including one of the additional Clan decals that I wanted in the May 16th patch so I will be buying MC too to redo the camo on a lot of my Mechs.

And I am OK with the Skill Tree and better than OK with the refund I am getting.

[Monkey Lover]

I agree , if you don't like it don't buy them. When they changed thier pay2balance hero I went ahead and bought one because I liked how they fixed this.

As for skill tree, I'm fine with it. Not the greatest but they did improve it a lot on the last pts.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 29 April 2017 - 11:44 AM.

[Mcgral18]

fat4eyes, on 29 April 2017 - 10:56 AM, said:

If you have to rely on blackmail instead of reason to make your case, then you've lost the argument. The skill web is not going to destroy the game, the same way 3rd person did not destroy the game, the same way escort and incursion did not destroy the game. Observe, adapt, MAKE REASONED ARGUMENTS, and move on.

3rd person was gimped from the start
Thankfully
That was because of outrage

Escort and Incursion both remove the likelyhood of seeing the ever decreasing number of good maps
That hurts my enjoyment of the game
That seals my wallet

Skill Web
If I need to click 91 times to level each and every robot I'll ever play, I won't play other robots
I won't buy new robots
I won't buy new mechbays, camos, GrabDeals, etc...
Wallet still sealed, because the game was made less enjoyable


You can only adapt so far, until the game is no longer fun
You leave, when there's nothing left

Bishop Steiner, on 29 April 2017 - 11:27 AM, said:

And Russ told y'all at the time that he wasn't going to cave to changing the skill tree to a more easily minmaxed model. I hope he sticks to that.

#TreeTraversal

Edited by Mcgral18, 29 April 2017 - 11:47 AM.

[LordNothing]

but i want my spheroid dire whale.

[Spheroid]

Boycotts need to be very simple and direct to convey who is dissatisified and for what reason. Unfortunately that will never be the case with MWO because many facets of the game are implemented poorly.

Its no mystery why Montgomery bus ridership was down or why North Carolina tourism is currently suffering.

There is no foundation for the empirical deduction of specific greivances based on coarse raw sales data of mech pack preorders. If there is please outline what this method is.

Edited by Spheroid, 29 April 2017 - 11:52 AM.

[Rogue Jedi]

for the record I do not have any preorders at current, this is due to cashflow problems nothing to do with game developement choices, if I could afford it I would have 6 heroes and the basic packs for Uziel and the Mad Cat MK II on preorder (and despite my distaste for slow Mechs I would be seriously considering the other 2)

Player backlash has already cost us several improvements which PGI had spent months working on but the backlash convinced them to drop them rather than spend a few more weeks fixing them.

I will not be happy if the skill tree is delayed further, is it perfect? no. is it better than what we currently have? yes significantly.
the most serious problem I have seen is the need to get "cooldown" rate of fire skills to get "heat gen" heat reduction skills meaning heat gen is worthless for hot running Mechs and only viable for increased rate of fire with the same heat level, not improving cooling on a hot running Mech

Just because it is not exactly what you want is no reasion to try to have it canceled.

[Battlemaster56]

Sorry already invested into the Javelin, Resistance Heros, and Cougar and Mad Cat mk II, and PGI haven't done anything to urk me with any of the gamemodes really, and the skill web™ is not perfect but still eat beats it's first interpretation of being the ultimate min max machine. If they keep up a nice pace and be somewhat consistent I'll get me a Gargoyle and Hellbringer Hero just for cosmetic purposes.