34 replies to this topic

[RAM]

One queue and one queue only!


RAM
ELH

[Vellron2005]

Nik Reaper, on 09 May 2017 - 03:16 PM, said:

Also IS mechs "many choices , most bad for CW" and clans "few choices but 75% viable" , now add a lot of casual players drawn by rewards and we see the choices they make... not even touching player skill, on both sides.

I strongly disagree with this..

On an average FP game with clan mech, I do 1000+ damage.. then My GF asked me to win her some stuff since she's new, only has clan mechs, and is, by accident, stuck in Marik contract.. So I jumped into TRIAL IS mechs, still did 1000+ damage..

If you know how to use your gear, regardless of what you use, you will play it to it's strengths, and you will do well..

Even in an urbanmech.

[Spitfire 03]

I'm actually not a fan of the trial builds, but I drop 3025 tech all the time. I mean, yeah, I drop with 228 or some other unit and I'll switch out to something with double heatsinks to try an keep up, but it's not so much the builds as it is the demeanor.

Just today I tried getting some pugs together for a gate defense on Emerald Taiga. We had some negative nancy chatting about how it wouldn't work, and we should all sit back at the gens, like it was some sorta winning strategy. So half the team sat back until we stalled their push. And you know what, we wiped the first wave, and then again second.

Finally folk started talking about how great we were doing because the score was tied, never mind that half our team was on their second mech and half on their last... At least we made em work for that win.

MWO is based offa a table top strategy and tactics game. Why is it so hard to find folk willing to put a bit of tactics and strategy into their gameplay?

Edited by Spitfire 03, 10 May 2017 - 02:21 AM.

[Bud Crue]

I can't tell you what Tukkayid 3 "really shows".
Sorry, I can't confirm with real data or proof that more good teams went clan than stayed in IS.
I can't prove that Smoke Jags had far more mercs than any other faction, other that to say that then numbers suggest it.
I can't state with 100% assurance that the tech balance favors Clan.
I can't guarantee that the only sure fire way to get the greater community interested in this disaster of a mode is through outright bribery.
So no, I can't tell you what this event "really shows".

I can tell you however, that based on what we have seen thus far, that only a complete idiot would suggest that the the event supports they hypothesis that IS is OP and is need of a "drastic reduction" in offensive quirks.

[Valhallan]

Yea i agree, hard limiting the bandwagon brigade is totally something that should happen (largest faction by at least 25%). It's frankly ridiculous that faction dogpiling is allowed, since we've moved to 1 bukkit the payout calculation should reflect that by factoring in the overall population too (also instead of just a cbill penalty there should be a tonnage penalty for overpop, that would certainly spread the mercs more). Though i can't totally blame the bandwagoners since it's partly PGI's fault for making MERCS have better rewards than loyalists most of the time.

As for balance, Your right in that tuk3 itself is useless for that, but we already know that ton for ton Clan is better full-stop. We saw that in WC and other comp matches, to argue otherwise is just being in denial, now some could argue that the +25 tons IS has compensates for this in FW but this is again questionable (pretty sure ngyr ppc+gauss fireline is better than a fattlemaster 2c lpl line despite being 10t lighter), not to mention balance was never the intent of the +25 tons and is likely to get tossed when they feel like it, like the mass quirk nerf IS is getting for some reason.

[El Bandito]

Vellron2005, on 10 May 2017 - 01:44 AM, said:

I strongly disagree with this..

On an average FP game with clan mech, I do 1000+ damage.. then My GF asked me to win her some stuff since she's new, only has clan mechs, and is, by accident, stuck in Marik contract.. So I jumped into TRIAL IS mechs, still did 1000+ damage..

If you know how to use your gear, regardless of what you use, you will play it to it's strengths, and you will do well..

Even in an urbanmech.

The issue lies in the fact that IS has much less "strengths" than Clan. Mid-range is only strength IS has over Clans thanks to IS LPLs. Clans have noticeable advantage in long range trades and brawls.

Also, IS has extra 25 tons per drop deck--which already proves that Clan tech is superior. At least back when IS heavy mechs were not nerfed, IS and Clan decks had equal tonnage.

Finally, doing 1000 damage in a CW game with trial mechs is not hard--for veterans. For newbies, Clan mechs are far easier to play and do decent damage, than IS mechs.

Edited by El Bandito, 10 May 2017 - 04:43 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

CK16, on 09 May 2017 - 03:02 PM, said:

PGI needs to set hard merc limits and control them....

Fact is looking at the leader boards 2 of the 3 top factions are IS, as said before if Clan was truly over the top over powered.....all the Clans would be blowing the scores out of the water.


Just saying people, look at more than just the tug of war bar....

You are totally wrong. Scouting counts as much as FW when it comes to leaderboard score. Scouting matches are played entirely different than regular FW.

The problem is that the tech may even be balanced overall. However, when it comes to the playstyle of a lot of FW maps clans have simply the edge.

Add to this the ST problem caused by XL engines...and well...

[El Bandito]

Bush Hopper, on 10 May 2017 - 04:41 AM, said:

The problem is that the tech may even be balanced overall. However, when it comes to the playstyle of a lot of FW maps clans have simply the edge.

Add to this the ST problem caused by XL engines...and well...

Tech is definitely not balanced overall. Otherwise, we would see top IS mechs performing without any quirks. Which is not the case. Just look at how many quirks are needed to prop up the BLR-2C. The mech would not even be used in CW, if it did not have quirks.

Edited by El Bandito, 10 May 2017 - 04:45 AM.

[Ryllen Kriel]

This event shows...um...uh...ah...It shows...PGI can still lure me with prizes?

I was originally going to troll this event with a Vindicator drop deck. That's about it.

Edited by Ryllen Kriel, 10 May 2017 - 04:46 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

El Bandito, on 10 May 2017 - 04:44 AM, said:

Tech is definitely not balanced overall. Otherwise, we would see top IS mechs performing without any quirks. Which is not the case. Just look at how many quirks are needed to prop up the BLR-2C. The mech would not even be used in CW, if it did not have quirks.

Sorry, I used a wrong expression: I meant across all play modes and play styles. But yes, you are most likely right

[skorpionet]

MWO needs player's roles.

Months ago I tried CW as PUG... sincerely was really frustrating because CW needs strategy and in a long time match. PUGs don't want strategy and, above all, no for long time match. PUGs only work in a 15 minutes deathmatch. I'm not in a team then I stopped to play CW (now FP).

We need of the PUG-Commander role, people that has experience, love for this game and the will to lead a match. They need a special marker in pre-match screen and in game. In this way PUGs can know that they have to follow orders from this player.

[El Bandito]

skorpionet, on 10 May 2017 - 05:13 AM, said:

MWO needs player's roles.

Months ago I tried CW as PUG... sincerely was really frustrating because CW needs strategy and in a long time match. PUGs don't want strategy and, above all, no for long time match. PUGs only work in a 15 minutes deathmatch. I'm not in a team then I stopped to play CW (now FP).

We need of the PUG-Commander role, people that has experience, love for this game and the will to lead a match. They need a special marker in pre-match screen and in game. In this way PUGs can know that they have to follow orders from this player.

Pugs usually listen to those who take charge using VOIP, in CW. They are, however, mech less effective in actually carrying out the commands, compared to veteran unit players. Which is why I tend to get a lot of thanks from pugs I lead in CW, but we still lose to decent pre-made teams.

[R Valentine]

CK16, on 09 May 2017 - 03:02 PM, said:

PGI needs to set hard merc limits and control them....

Fact is looking at the leader boards 2 of the 3 top factions are IS, as said before if Clan was truly over the top over powered.....all the Clans would be blowing the scores out of the water.


Just saying people, look at more than just the tug of war bar....

Meanwhile, the other 4 IS factions are all below every clan faction. Just saying people, look at more than just the top three.

[Johnny Z]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 09 May 2017 - 03:07 PM, said:

Except those leaderboards are worthless at judging tech balance just like looking at the win metric of the QP leaderboards by itself is worthless (I mean, that is like saying Johnny Z is a great pilot because he was near the top of the win leaderboards a few times).

It aint easy being the best pilot.



Yep I am acting like an idiot again.

I was 15 at the time, except it wasn't the air force it was hockey, and yes girls did quote lines from the movie to me. I still look pretty good now considering.



Ya think what you want. At that age it was an awesome time. Tough though. How times change. Most of the fights I got into was from jealous boyfriends even though I never made a move on their girl or what girl they liked. Been in countless fights. I seriously wouldn't even bother trying to count. I do laugh about it. Good ones to, broken nose twice, broken ear, broken cheek bone, many scars, broken ribs. I heal well though. All from sucker punches mostly, when I am not even looking.

Edited by Johnny Z, 10 May 2017 - 07:26 AM.

[R Valentine]

Valhallan, on 10 May 2017 - 04:32 AM, said:

Yea i agree, hard limiting the bandwagon brigade is totally something that should happen (largest faction by at least 25%). It's frankly ridiculous that faction dogpiling is allowed, since we've moved to 1 bukkit the payout calculation should reflect that by factoring in the overall population too (also instead of just a cbill penalty there should be a tonnage penalty for overpop, that would certainly spread the mercs more). Though i can't totally blame the bandwagoners since it's partly PGI's fault for making MERCS have better rewards than loyalists most of the time.

As for balance, Your right in that tuk3 itself is useless for that, but we already know that ton for ton Clan is better full-stop. We saw that in WC and other comp matches, to argue otherwise is just being in denial, now some could argue that the +25 tons IS has compensates for this in FW but this is again questionable (pretty sure ngyr ppc+gauss fireline is better than a fattlemaster 2c lpl line despite being 10t lighter), not to mention balance was never the intent of the +25 tons and is likely to get tossed when they feel like it, like the mass quirk nerf IS is getting for some reason.

'Cause PGI are tardos. I love how they like to pile on the "mah lore" excuse, then let merc units fight for clans. Uhm, that isn't even remotely lore. Lore clanner despise mercenaries. Mercs and clanners have exact opposite mentalities. But somehow, letting them fight for clans makes sense in MWO world. Not like the clans are hurting for players. And giving them the best rewards was just stupid. They options. Loyalists don't. Seems pretty obvious who should make out better to me.