30 replies to this topic

[The6thMessenger]

Cumulative -5% UAC jam chance isn't really that great. Sometimes it's trivial putting two points to it at all.

But what if it's -5% UAC Jam Duration? 12s Jam Duration? Now 11.4s.

If it needs buff, maybe +5% Jam Duration per node instead?

[DGTLDaemon]

Yeah, the jam chance reduction is barely noticeable, if at all. UACs definitely need more love from the skill tree, especially compared to lasers that really benefit from the reduced burn duration.

[cazidin]

Shouldn't the jam chance be reduced by 1-2% at least, rather than 0.1-0.2%?

[sneeking]

maybe on my good old 2x uac wang but i cant think what els id even buy into it for other than that tastey tastey troll build i loved so much.

[Humpday]

eh even 30% doesn't seem to do much, i tried it on my roughneck wiht 25% base + 5%ST - jamchance% and on my first doubletap it jammed... I was like ok...that was just bad luck.

4,5,6,7 double taps later i was still jamming hard...i was like...eff these uacs5s and took them off. Not a fan. I only like the dual uac5, ac5 black widow so at least something is firing instead of all weapons getting stuck.

Edited by Humpday, 26 May 2017 - 07:41 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

I swear to the one true RNGesus that UACs are not on the true path. If I click that button as fast as possible, it jams hard. If I pace it with the weapon group blips by the crosshair, it is much more forgiving.

[Humpday]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 May 2017 - 07:45 AM, said:

I swear to the one true RNGesus that UACs are not on the true path. If I click that button as fast as possible, it jams hard. If I pace it with the weapon group blips by the crosshair, it is much more forgiving.

Along those lines, i do notice, if a get into a slow cadence 1,2,1,2 the jamming goes down. But if i button smash, clickety clickety crazy they do appear to jam frequently.

I'd love to know the actual algo that determines rate of jam, it does not appear to just be a flat rate jam chance.

[HGAK47]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 May 2017 - 07:45 AM, said:

I swear to the one true RNGesus that UACs are not on the true path. If I click that button as fast as possible, it jams hard. If I pace it with the weapon group blips by the crosshair, it is much more forgiving.

I could be very wrong but with IS Ultras, you fire 100% if you stay at usual shooting speed, its only when trying to get the extra shot out that you have a chance to jam.

Now like I say I could be wrong but I swear the clan autos sometimes jam when only firing the first volley, sometimes they seem to jam and I dont even fire any shots!

It was my understanding that you only risk jamming when you try for the roll on the "ultra" part of the dakka fire. (The extra round / volley)

Ive recently been using the huntsman with a ultra ac/20, ive got it built like a Yen Lo Wang basically, im trying to practice for IS ultra / ac20 (assuming IS UAC/20 will be similar to Clan UAC/20)

Edited by HGAK47, 26 May 2017 - 08:02 AM.

[- World Eater -]

The UAC needs more love from the skill tree. It's the 31st century for ***** sake, a weapon shouldn't jam every other shot.

[Reno Blade]

I would love to get some "new" skill effects into the existing tree:
- burst duration reduction (for burst fire ACs/UACs/RACs - they should all have bursts, stream fire LRM/MRM or beams for lasers)
- Burst fire extra bullets (1 more bullet per uAC burst, 1 more pellet for LBX, 1 more missile)
- splash increase (increasing splash damage of all PPCs - they should all have some)

but in general, I'd like to have the ability to go "really deep" into one aspect of the tree to get some special "Elite" skills.
so you can only choose one attribute that you can spec 2x deeper.
e.g. spec 20% range instead of 10% max

[Ade the Rare]

The -5% jam chance per node is a joke; the weapon is broken unless you can field at least three of the damn things, and even then it's a lottery.

And who the hell fields 3x UAC5's that have a few seconds of working, front-facing dps when for the same tonnage you can take (less a single ton) 2x AC20's you can obliterate a target with and then turn to spread dmg from the inevitable return fire... Hell even one AC20 and a lot of ammo is a better choice.

Honestly, -5% jam cooldown wouldn't convince me to take it either.

[Murphy7]

I really like the idea of trading the reduced UAC Jam chance for UAC / RAC jam clearing speed. That would be a great quality of life improvement.

[Y E O N N E]

HGAK47, on 26 May 2017 - 08:01 AM, said:

I could be very wrong but with IS Ultras, you fire 100% if you stay at usual shooting speed, its only when trying to get the extra shot out that you have a chance to jam.

Now like I say I could be wrong but I swear the clan autos sometimes jam when only firing the first volley, sometimes they seem to jam and I dont even fire any shots!

It was my understanding that you only risk jamming when you try for the roll on the "ultra" part of the dakka fire. (The extra round / volley)

Ive recently been using the huntsman with a ultra ac/20, ive got it built like a Yen Lo Wang basically, im trying to practice for IS ultra / ac20 (assuming IS UAC/20 will be similar to Clan UAC/20)

Ultra jamming behaves identically between IS and Clan flavors: the chance to jam is only on the double tap, the shot during cool-down. Clan Ultras *will not* jam if you just fire at the conventional rate, but you may mess it up by thinking you can click at the same rate as the IS version for that. You cannot, IIRC, because the cool-down doesn't start until the burst is finished. That can lead to many misinterpretations of jam occurrence . That, and network latency making the server think you fired too early if you are too accurate with the timing.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 May 2017 - 09:02 AM, said:

You cannot, IIRC, because the cool-down doesn't start until the burst is finished. That can lead to many misinterpretations of jam occurrence. That, and network latency making the server think you fired too early if you are too accurate with the timing.

All the more reason to change how they function imo.

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 26 May 2017 - 09:04 AM, said:

All the more reason to change how they function imo.

IMHO, I would prefer a system where there is a negligible, but uniformly random, chance to jam that increases with heat. I like that small gambling element, but tying it to heat gives you some measure of control both as a player and a developer.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 May 2017 - 09:19 AM, said:

IMHO, I would prefer a system where there is a negligible, but uniformly random, chance to jam that increases with heat. I like that small gambling element, but tying it to heat gives you some measure of control both as a player and a developer.

I'd prefer to leave that for RACs and UACs just be a consistent burst fire version of standard ACs. Just to have a niche for each.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 26 May 2017 - 09:53 AM.

[Mechteric]

100% agree with this change, those UACs are pretty going to jam and reducing that jam time would be more efficacious.

[Shifty McSwift]

ThoseWhoFearTomorrow, on 26 May 2017 - 08:10 AM, said:

The UAC needs more love from the skill tree. It's the 31st century for ***** sake, a weapon shouldn't jam every other shot.

See the problem is if you make UAC too reliable you completely obsolete ACs. This is one of the main reasons I believe their functionality and range of potential damage should be changed, dealing at max 1.5 damage and min 0.5 damage of their AC equivalent, a "jam" resulting in a 0.5 shot and perhaps doubling the next cooldown.

Currently it is literally a double or nothing gun, if you make it too much of either of those things it breaks the concept entirely.

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 26 May 2017 - 09:53 AM, said:

I'd prefer to leave that for RACs and UACs just be a consistent burst fire version of standard ACs. Just to have a niche for each.

I would rather RACs have a hard-cap to how long you can fire. There is no randomness to it, you can fire until that bar hits the top and then it has a forced cool-down period. There is potential there for UACs to be the better choice boated en masse for a lengthier push, while the RACs are superior for a quick one.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 May 2017 - 12:36 PM, said:

I would rather RACs have a hard-cap to how long you can fire. There is no randomness to it, you can fire until that bar hits the top and then it has a forced cool-down period. There is potential there for UACs to be the better choice boated en masse for a lengthier push, while the RACs are superior for a quick one.

I suppose that's fair given that RACs present the most problematic DPS and adding randomness to it might break things.