259 replies to this topic

[Ghogiel]

Gas Guzzler, on 31 May 2017 - 08:52 AM, said:

Soon to be no options for assaults then?

Negative. Mrs gargles has the highest KDR increase or something. clearly it's the meta.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Ghogiel, on 31 May 2017 - 09:04 AM, said:

Negative. Mrs gargles has the highest KDR increase or something. clearly it's the meta.

Well he was in the Star League tourney, so there is something to that, but that is a rare scenario so yeah.

[Mazzyplz]

please. my dragon now has 138 ct armor. and my awesome has a lot less than that with armor skills
the orion is up to 165 armor on ct.

how are my heavies more resilient than my slow moving assault???? please explain.

my aws9m was negatively impacted by the mobility decrease, can i get a small buff to aws9m in any way? acceleration, anchor turn, heat generation.. anything is welcome pretty much. (or velocity, something minor, 2% of something)
the other variants i'm fine with but still their armor is a little blah in comparison to orion, dragon... remember those are heavy mechs, and the armor is INSANE. i have 91 armor on the dragon's gun arm. 91.
i am not complaining about the dragon to be sure, but the skill tree's results seem a bit all over the place and arbitrary.

oh and the night gyr really needs a nerf, i hope you don't mean you are going to buff it. i would really lose my shot

ps> lrms are very difficult to deal with now because the locks take forever to break. radar derp is 5 nodes that i realy cannot afford thanks to the mobility nerf i received and all 91 are needed to make up for the pilot skills that don't exist anymore (and even have to spend one node on a ballistic skill that is no use to me, and i have to spend like 8-10 nodes on range just out the gate on the weapons tree). so you are forcing me and maybe other people to take ams. ummm. can you do something like buff LRMS but decrease the lockon time a little bit? i would be fine with being hurt more if hit, but having no choice but to get hit is really frustrating

Edited by Mazzyplz, 31 May 2017 - 11:20 AM.

[R Valentine]

Nomad One, on 31 May 2017 - 06:44 AM, said:

Did Night Gyrs and Marauder IIC's not already get slammed by the nerf bat by giving them worse mobility than most other options?

They're built to be glass cannons, and the meta in the higher echelons of public and competetive gameplay is pin point front loaded damage. Two mechs that excel at that particular meta. What exactly is there left they can take off to appease the incompetent and the ignorant?

Reduce the set of 8 quirks on the Gyrs to be practically worth nothing? That only means people just further mix and match the omnipods to optimize them. They're not exactly major to begin with. 5-10% cooldown, 5-10% range, 10% velocity. Only the Jade Kite gets 25% velocity for ERPPCs, and that's it particular niche. Thats the only one that could possibly be dropped to 10-15% ERPPC velocity as part of the set of 8.

Further cripple their mobility? That just hits all other play styles for the chassis unfairly. Not to mention forces marauders to further front load their damage potential to smash their target without having to trade pokes too often, and forces night gyrs into poptart roles. Or worse, turns them into extremely niche long range turrets like the Dire Wolf...

You, PGI, intend to rework energy weapons already. Shouldn't it behoove you to do that and observe the changes for a month or two before you start slapping mechs with negative values like the TBR-A's left torso pod that make it just downright terrible to put on.

Not really sure what you're on about. Clan 85 tonners took some of the smallest mobility nerfs on the clan side. The biggest losers were the Kodiak and the Mad Dog, because Mad Dog OP, right? The MADIIC feels better than ever, and I don't even use the mobility tree. All gank and tank, 2 cool shots, 2 arties. Even as slow as the Night Gyr is, I don't feel the need to add mobility. Once again, all gank and tank. If you really want to go a few KPH faster you can drop the survival tree, since it doesn't add a ton, and slap on some speed tweak, but the difference is minimal. Just fit 2 guass, 2 ERPPC and embrace the meta.

[MadRover]

Kiran Yagami, on 31 May 2017 - 10:25 AM, said:

Not really sure what you're on about. Clan 85 tonners took some of the smallest mobility nerfs on the clan side. The biggest losers were the Kodiak and the Mad Dog, because Mad Dog OP, right? The MADIIC feels better than ever, and I don't even use the mobility tree. All gank and tank, 2 cool shots, 2 arties. Even as slow as the Night Gyr is, I don't feel the need to add mobility. Once again, all gank and tank. If you really want to go a few KPH faster you can drop the survival tree, since it doesn't add a ton, and slap on some speed tweak, but the difference is minimal. Just fit 2 guass, 2 ERPPC and embrace the meta.

But not everyone runs the meta all the time. Honestly this game has always came down to builds and skill. If the pilot has the right build but is absolute crap at playing going against someone with the same or very similar build but is better, then the better pilot will win. At the same time, if you're a good player running a bad build going against someone who has a good build but not isn't as good as you, then the better build will win.

Also, while that is one way to run a MADIIC it's not the only way which is good. Me personally I like to brawl so your build wouldn't work for me although when I do play the mec I constantly remind myself that I need to watch my aggression and my positioning to the point it becomes automatic pilot for me. Then I have to keep turning that automatic switch off so I don't blunder into 2 man fire squads and get steam rolled or face palmed.

[warner2]

Summon3r, on 29 May 2017 - 11:56 AM, said:

lol, standard clan nerf incoming............ btw how in the h3ll is the BLR-2C not in ultra over perform category? i mean i dont mind rolling around with 5LPL and durability quirks out the wazoo ticking off 5-600 dmg a match in it. makes me want to switch to IS for CW.

I don't actually think 500-600 damage in an assault is over performing?

PGI have the data. If it's over performing it'd be on the list.

I would like to understand why the 2C has all the structure quirks when the other Battlemasters don't. The quirk system seems adhoc and inconsistent.

[Requiemking]

warner2, on 31 May 2017 - 12:12 PM, said:

I don't actually think 500-600 damage in an assault is over performing?

PGI have the data. If it's over performing it'd be on the list.

I would like to understand why the 2C has all the structure quirks when the other Battlemasters don't. The quirk system seems adhoc and inconsistent.

Why does Jenner Oxide have durability quirks most Lights can only dream about? This is PGI we are talking about, half of what they do only makes sense if you assume they spend 90% of their workday drunk, and are severely hung over for the last 10 %.

Edited by Requiemking, 31 May 2017 - 01:09 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 31 May 2017 - 09:06 AM, said:

Well he was in the Star League tourney, so there is something to that, but that is a rare scenario so yeah.

Yeah... sorry guys I'm not paying as much attention to detail as much these days.

Gargoyles were brutal in the Star League tourney, no question. Curious what Warhawk you have been referring to? Just the quad ER PPC build?

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 31 May 2017 - 01:08 PM.

[Kaeb Odellas]

I've actually had a lot of fun revisiting old mechs after the patch. Sure the UI for the skill tree is cumbersome and the process a bit tedious, but it's not too bad as long as you don't just do a bunch of old mastered mechs at once.

[Vxheous]

Gas Guzzler, on 31 May 2017 - 01:08 PM, said:

Yeah... sorry guys I'm not paying as much attention to detail as much these days.

Gargoyles were brutal in the Star League tourney, no question. Curious what Warhawk you have been referring to? Just the quad ER PPC build?

Probably the Warhawk C....shhhh...it'll probably get hit with the nerfbat next. The low slung arms make it situational though

Edited by Vxheous Kerensky, 31 May 2017 - 01:14 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Gas Guzzler, on 31 May 2017 - 01:08 PM, said:

Gargoyles were brutal in the Star League tourney, no question. Curious what Warhawk you have been referring to? Just the quad ER PPC build?

Vxheous Kerensky, on 31 May 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

Probably the Warhawk C....shhhh...it'll probably get hit with the nerfbat next. The low slung arms make it situational though

^ This C is the best option for both quad cLPL and quad cERPPC now thanks to the Prime nerfs. For only a loss of 7.5% velocity I get 9% less heat gen? Sold.

[MadRover]

warner2, on 31 May 2017 - 12:12 PM, said:

I don't actually think 500-600 damage in an assault is over performing?

PGI have the data. If it's over performing it'd be on the list.

I would like to understand why the 2C has all the structure quirks when the other Battlemasters don't. The quirk system seems adhoc and inconsistent.

500-600 damage in the MADIIC (considering it is an assault mech) is decent to good. That interprets as playing the mech properly. Any higher is what helps you determine how good the other pilots were. So if you scored 700 damage they were probably ok. 800 means they were bad. 900 if you can get that high means you were just in a potato match when everything went your way throughout the whole match (or didn't if you still somehow lost despite carrying the team) and don't take the result too seriously.

Honestly the fact it's on the list is a bit shocking considering the spots to shoot at are very easy to spot and hit. So either people don't know how to kill it because not enough were in the battlefields or a bunch of noobs are complaining to complain instead of learning how to play.

If I can kill a Dire Wolf while taking all the damage in a Marauder (Bounty Hunter), which is silly hard considering it was a dakka build, pre skill tree then don't come complaining about something being too much or over performing here. Also, I did kill that Dire Wolf while being so beaten up every mech after that were stripping parts off of me until a sniping medium finally puts me out of my misery.

[Natred]

Hope they have a way to take in air and artillery stike damage into their balancing.

[Mazzyplz]

Mazzyplz, on 31 May 2017 - 09:34 AM, said:

how are my heavies more resilient than my slow moving assault???? please explain.

whoops, keshav murali actually explained this to me - the reason i got only a tiny boost like +9 with aws is that i should have been investing in structure instead of armor with that mech. it had structure quirks so it stacks nicely and each node is much more hefty than the armor nodes. i was initially worried about crits, but you click so many reinforced casing nodes it doesnt even come up.

now the mech is better and i only had to switch around a couple of nodes.

[Aramuside]

Gyrok, on 30 May 2017 - 06:27 PM, said:

The agility quirks were rolled into the base values....it did not lose them. It might even be better, because you can run it without mobility tree at all, and it feels like a TW with full mobility.

TBH you can but it feels a lot better with agility quirks though.

[Aramuside]

Requiemking, on 31 May 2017 - 12:18 PM, said:

Why does Jenner Oxide have durability quirks most Lights can only dream about? This is PGI we are talking about, half of what they do only makes sense if you assume they spend 90% of their workday drunk, and are severely hung over for the last 10 %.

Because it was very easy to kill due to its CT magnet problem.

I know you didn't really want an answer unless it was self validating but there you go.

[Aramuside]

MadRover, on 31 May 2017 - 03:28 PM, said:

500-600 damage in the MADIIC (considering it is an assault mech) is decent to good. That interprets as playing the mech properly. Any higher is what helps you determine how good the other pilots were. So if you scored 700 damage they were probably ok. 800 means they were bad. 900 if you can get that high means you were just in a potato match when everything went your way throughout the whole match (or didn't if you still somehow lost despite carrying the team) and don't take the result too seriously.

Honestly the fact it's on the list is a bit shocking considering the spots to shoot at are very easy to spot and hit. So either people don't know how to kill it because not enough were in the battlefields or a bunch of noobs are complaining to complain instead of learning how to play.

If I can kill a Dire Wolf while taking all the damage in a Marauder (Bounty Hunter), which is silly hard considering it was a dakka build, pre skill tree then don't come complaining about something being too much or over performing here. Also, I did kill that Dire Wolf while being so beaten up every mech after that were stripping parts off of me until a sniping medium finally puts me out of my misery.

As much as I like my BH... not fond of someone basing their views on a one off match.

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 31 May 2017 - 08:55 AM, said:

The Warhawk is good in certain situations, just not as many as the Wubmaster or Mauler.

Is the Mauler good post skill tree? Not seen any in game confirmation so curious.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Aramuside, on 01 June 2017 - 12:44 AM, said:

Is the Mauler good post skill tree? Not seen any in game confirmation so curious.

Its always been pretty solid, and with the Dakka Kodiak nerfed hard with agility, the Dakka Mauler can pick up where it left off.

[Mawai]

DAYLEET, on 29 May 2017 - 11:35 AM, said:

So the FS9 is getting buffed, thats nice. But how? They run super hot because they have too much firepower for a light but thats fine. JJ still are a trap for lights with as much as 5jj and skilled up. Speed/mobility nerf still hurts, they are mandatory in the tree which is kind of a nerf in itself.

I wouldnt mind an increase in speed/mobility to spare the points in the tree. Or some armor/structure quirks.

Life in a light sucks when there's 5 assault and 4 heavies per game, reinstate 3/3/3/3. It sucks for everyone else too, assault arent assault anymore and you end up with campers everywhere because pushing is way more costly now and you cant rely on your team 75% of the time.

"reinstate 3/3/3/3"

You simply don't understand the matchmaker do you?

The game ALWAYS tries to do 3/3/3/3 ... that is the preferred result. However, if it can't make a match in a reasonable time (like a minute) it relaxes the 3/3/3/3 constraint. WHY does it do this? Because there aren't enough players in light mechs. If 25% of the players queued in each weight class then you would get 3/3/3/3 ALL the time. However, people don't. A more typical distribution is 10%, 20%, 45%, 25% ... L/M/H/A ... if you forced only 3/3/3/3 for every match then a person entering the queue in a heavy would be waiting for more than an hour for a match after the queue had been up for 20 minutes and it would only get longer.

Fixed 3/3/3/3 does NOT work if the players drop in any non-perfect distribution of mechs and the queue times get absolutely HUGE for the typical weight class distributions in MWO.

This is a situation where idealism and reality collide and simple math can show exactly how unrealistic the ideal situation is ... don't worry Russ didn't understand it either.

[DAYLEET]

Mawai, on 01 June 2017 - 08:02 AM, said:

"reinstate 3/3/3/3"

You simply don't understand the matchmaker do you?

The game ALWAYS tries to do 3/3/3/3 ... that is the preferred result. However, if it can't make a match in a reasonable time (like a minute) it relaxes the 3/3/3/3 constraint. WHY does it do this? Because there aren't enough players in light mechs. If 25% of the players queued in each weight class then you would get 3/3/3/3 ALL the time. However, people don't. A more typical distribution is 10%, 20%, 45%, 25% ... L/M/H/A ... if you forced only 3/3/3/3 for every match then a person entering the queue in a heavy would be waiting for more than an hour for a match after the queue had been up for 20 minutes and it would only get longer.

Fixed 3/3/3/3 does NOT work if the players drop in any non-perfect distribution of mechs and the queue times get absolutely HUGE for the typical weight class distributions in MWO.

This is a situation where idealism and reality collide and simple math can show exactly how unrealistic the ideal situation is ... don't worry Russ didn't understand it either.

my bad, my bad, i really meant ENFORCED. Ofcourse it would take longer for a heavy to drop, not literally 20min like you say. Im perfectly fine with that. There will be a greater distribution across weight with time as the drop time increase so you have to account for that. The problem is the valve system that automaticaly release so theres no need for any one to even try. I wouldnt be surprised with the valve being stuck open again. I think we're due for another "oh the vavle system got stuck and we fixed them" statement from pgi like we often had already. Until then we will keep getting shity 5assault + 4heavy per game.

Edited by DAYLEET, 01 June 2017 - 09:27 AM.