62 replies to this topic

[Novakaine]

I truly fear for human progress of late.

[Brain Cancer]

Quote

Re-arm and repair cost are just a F2P Cancer (at least for me)

As a F2P player, I take offense to that remark!

Seriously, the only legit R&R would be in FP, and it shouldn't be directly tied to player resources. Planets should have supply lines to them that determine how quickly a 'Mech in FP is available for use again, with more isolated planets having weaker supply lines. Mechs destroyed in FP should have an additional lockout penalty, lighter (less parts to repair) 'Mechs getting a shorter base lockout time than heavier ones.

Add in "supply run" missions to improve R&R, "raid supply dumps" to boost R&R by a lesser amount for the winner (and decrease it for the loser) and you'd have an interesting new mechanic.

[Xmith]

Gwei Loong, on 09 June 2017 - 06:45 AM, said:

Ok that makes sense. I was not there so I'll forget about it because this seems like it would be a thing. No one is in favor of the poor getting poorer.

I was here at that time. Repair and re-arm is one type of immersion most don't seem to want though. Match earnings always enabled me to make repairs and re-arm. To be honest, there were times I did not fully repair my mech to save c-bills.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Mech repair and Rearm costs only serve to hurt free players by making them less able to consistently field the same quality of Equipment as paying players. It helps paying players perform better on the field than free players.

[SuomiWarder]

What might be cool is that the higher the cost of your mech used including nodes and consumables the lower your pay out on a win. A tax on the rich so to speak.

[Gwei Loong]

Prosperity Park, on 09 June 2017 - 12:06 PM, said:

Mech repair and Rearm costs only serve to hurt free players by making them less able to consistently field the same quality of Equipment as paying players. It helps paying players perform better on the field than free players.

Yeah but I have also spent very little RL money on this game so the FP2 argument is somewhat lost on me. It's not that I am against spending money on pixels but I found it more meaningful to earn everything in game.
In regards to making more RL purchases another road block for me has been because over the years I have found that it sucks when you spend RL money on a game and then one day there is no more game.
So if you took my approach to the grind you bought a few mech packs and some PT but that was it. I have limits to what I'll spend on in game only content.
Maybe it's just the idea of immersion I that like. I used to pay to play Everquest on Rallozs Zek and we had pvp corpse loot rules and that was fun for me. I am not a whale though so this is not about being a whale or pay to win.

Spheroid, on 09 June 2017 - 09:16 AM, said:

Or better yet build meta decks with duplicates for each gamemode and map in CW for both factions. I think you find that your excessive money problem will resolve itself quickly.

Thanks for that, this is a great idea. C-bill sink solved and at least a few thousand more hours of stuff to work on. That'll keep me busy for the next year and make being able to have multiple drop decks worth while. I might even need some more PT now.
Faction war is kind of dead though. It seems like the way forward but if we do not have a reason like this to continue grinding then what do we have? Whats the new 8v8 mode going to be like?

Edited by Gwei Loong, 09 June 2017 - 12:52 PM.

[Brain Cancer]

You hadn't experienced the joys of R&R from the prior version.

Basically, it meant most players were starting at 75% health and ammo while the richer players could afford full stats. Of course, this meant richer players also won more, meaning they got richer (smart ones just laserboated, zero ammo costs too).

[Kalimaster]

i have a suggestion concerning this. how about FREAKING NO ! ! !

[Agrajag von Butechugge]

As a new player: heck no!

This would quite literally lead me to stop playing from the frustration induced from having to monitor how best to not lose cbills running a mech at as low a cost as possible while all at the same time still learning how to play the game.

You want to know how toxic repair and rearm costs makes a player community? Look no further than World of Tanks.

Edited by Agrajag von Butechugge, 09 June 2017 - 01:39 PM.

[mouser42]

NO

[kf envy]

Gwei Loong, on 09 June 2017 - 06:24 AM, said:

Sense the release of the Skill Tree and with all the refunds we got I find it hard to spend my C-Bills. We no longer have rule of three, I had HSP for everything, I got to sell off loads of modules, I have tons of GSP, GXP, HXP and everything I owned was completely set up the way I wanted it. I don't swap engines and if I had multiple load outs for a mech which required an engine size change I already owned it. We need a new C-Bills sink.
What if we only got rewards for winning and what if PGI also increased the rewards for assists, kmdd, kills, ect but they made mech repair a thing again. This would encourage better game play and discourage people that think sitting back and waiting to die is an option. Let’s say you do not score above 200, you don't get in any assists, no kmdd, no kills and it'll cost you.
Faction war could work the same way but maybe for the hard core crowd it could be even just a little bit more edgy. Wouldn't it be cool if you lost a mech in FW it became the other teams salvage. Then if you wanted to play that mech you'd have to buy a new one while the person who won the salvage was rewarded with it plus the repair cost to make it functional again.
Either way this will become a problem after a awhile because what am I going to spend c-bills on? New tech, ok sure but it's not like we get that much new tech and after a while if we don't have a c-bill sink people will lose interest. This will end up becoming like GXP.
I already don't care if I win or lose anymore. I don't need anything. It's not good for my game and I think I need some consequences, we all do. How do you guys feel about mech repair costs?

I'm all for this it would make PGI tank over night with all the players up and leaving MWO and PGI for good

[Alex Morgaine]

Brain Cancer, on 09 June 2017 - 11:58 AM, said:

As a F2P player, I take offense to that remark!

Seriously, the only legit R&R would be in FP, and it shouldn't be directly tied to player resources. Planets should have supply lines to them that determine how quickly a 'Mech in FP is available for use again, with more isolated planets having weaker supply lines. Mechs destroyed in FP should have an additional lockout penalty, lighter (less parts to repair) 'Mechs getting a shorter base lockout time than heavier ones.

Add in "supply run" missions to improve R&R, "raid supply dumps" to boost R&R by a lesser amount for the winner (and decrease it for the loser) and you'd have an interesting new mechanic.

This right here. Add in faction specific varients get less costs to r&r resources, and add in a scaling cost based on what are used the most vs least parts and chassis wise and you'd have a great resource system, and coffers can be used finally as a resource-cbill sink.

[RestosIII]

Yeah, no thanks. I really don't care for tripling the grind while making non energy weaponry a liability to use. Oh, and I can't wait to see Atlai not pushing because they can't afford to die in their Atlas.

[Wintersdark]

Mystere, on 09 June 2017 - 07:10 AM, said:

The key words are:

• probably
  
• hope they get it right

That's a really tall order given past experience.

To be fair, R&R in a single player game is a totally different prospect. It's pretty easy to get right, and in a campaign style PvE campaign is an important aspect of the game.

It's nothing at all like R&R in a deathmatch arena PvP game.

Totally, vastly different things.

Agrajag von Butechugge, on 09 June 2017 - 01:38 PM, said:

As a new player: heck no!

This would quite literally lead me to stop playing from the frustration induced from having to monitor how best to not lose cbills running a mech at as low a cost as possible while all at the same time still learning how to play the game.

You want to know how toxic repair and rearm costs makes a player community? Look no further than World of Tanks.

What, you don't want to be at a further disadvantage vs. experienced players because they can afford to run better builds and you - already a less skilled player - ALSO are forced to run worse builds (and thus lose more battles, and lose even more cbills)? That doesn't sound fun to you? Sheesh. New players are such wimps these days!

/s

RestosIII, on 09 June 2017 - 04:40 PM, said:

Yeah, no thanks. I really don't care for tripling the grind while making non energy weaponry a liability to use. Oh, and I can't wait to see Atlai not pushing because they can't afford to die in their Atlas.

mmmhmm. People say these things, and they never really consider how it'll result in people playing. I don't expect everyone to have played back when we had R&R, but seriously: Even in regular weekend events these days, people do objectively stupid things that will lead to losing more battles trying to get better results for a tournament even though they'd do better simply playing better and winning more.

People are cowardly enough in this game without there being actual penalties for losing battles.

Brain Cancer, on 09 June 2017 - 12:43 PM, said:

You hadn't experienced the joys of R&R from the prior version.

Basically, it meant most players were starting at 75% health and ammo while the richer players could afford full stats. Of course, this meant richer players also won more, meaning they got richer (smart ones just laserboated, zero ammo costs too).

Well, you could also elect to run Trial mechs, you didn't have to pay to fix them.


And there's nothing that makes you happier than seeing a lot of Trial mechs on your team, right? Right? They've always got great builds! Sure to win.

Edited by Wintersdark, 09 June 2017 - 05:19 PM.

[RestosIII]

Wintersdark, on 09 June 2017 - 05:18 PM, said:

mmmhmm. People say these things, and they never really consider how it'll result in people playing. I don't expect everyone to have played back when we had R&R, but seriously: Even in regular weekend events these days, people do objectively stupid things that will lead to losing more battles trying to get better results for a tournament even though they'd do better simply playing better and winning more.

People are cowardly enough in this game without there being actual penalties for losing battles.

I was around for R&R (Not sure if it was this acc, or an acc that I lost to the ether of time itself) and dear lord it was painful. I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. Same with the price models of games like World of Tanks. It sure was a joy there when I was losing $$$ on my T7-T8 tanks because I wasn't carrying my team.

Oh, and I can personally attest to the fact that I would never pilot an Assault mech ever again if R&R was added. I'm not very good in them, and they're massive targets, and would (presumably) cost more than other mechs to repair. I also would probably have to stop running my Night Gyr due to AC/2 ammo costs. Basically, R&R is the anti-fun in multiplayer games.

[razenWing]

Gwei Loong, on 09 June 2017 - 06:39 AM, said:

Listen, I agree it's a bit sarcastic but at the same time I see it as something that would encourage group play. We could also look at limiting the size of units and making them more regional. I think it'll be better for the game in the long run plus it could make it more group orientated. You know you hear that a lot. I only suggest this as a way to help encourage group play and group ques.

You see a lot of things recently...

PS Where did the old new guy go?

[PhoenixFire55]

Never gonna happen because baddies need their safezones.

[Kasumi Sumika]

Absolutely F-ng NO.

Also what kind Clan Goliath Scorpion drugs you using? Can I hav som?

[Ced Riggs]

[QuantumButler]

Gwei Loong, on 09 June 2017 - 06:24 AM, said:

Sense the release of the Skill Tree and with all the refunds we got I find it hard to spend my C-Bills. We no longer have rule of three, I had HSP for everything, I got to sell off loads of modules, I have tons of GSP, GXP, HXP and everything I owned was completely set up the way I wanted it. I don't swap engines and if I had multiple load outs for a mech which required an engine size change I already owned it. We need a new C-Bills sink.
What if we only got rewards for winning and what if PGI also increased the rewards for assists, kmdd, kills, ect but they made mech repair a thing again. This would encourage better game play and discourage people that think sitting back and waiting to die is an option. Let’s say you do not score above 200, you don't get in any assists, no kmdd, no kills and it'll cost you.
Faction war could work the same way but maybe for the hard core crowd it could be even just a little bit more edgy. Wouldn't it be cool if you lost a mech in FW it became the other teams salvage. Then if you wanted to play that mech you'd have to buy a new one while the person who won the salvage was rewarded with it plus the repair cost to make it functional again.
Either way this will become a problem after a awhile because what am I going to spend c-bills on? New tech, ok sure but it's not like we get that much new tech and after a while if we don't have a c-bill sink people will lose interest. This will end up becoming like GXP.
I already don't care if I win or lose anymore. I don't need anything. It's not good for my game and I think I need some consequences, we all do. How do you guys feel about mech repair costs?