54 replies to this topic

[Ced Riggs]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 01:28 AM, said:

If it rains 364 out of 365 days a year where it is then it tells you all you need to know about people who built said park ...
But sure, blame rain. I mean not like the price of land in that particular monsoon swamp was cheaper and all ...

The trouble with ignorance is, that it self perpetuates.

The park is fine. The area the park is in is fine. The highway is being rained on. You are wet at the park because it rains on the highway. Look up. There is multiple posts, and even pictures, explaining this. I am running out of crayons here.

I don't know how to fix a car. I take it to the shop, because I lack the skills to determine what and how is broken. When the shop provides me with an explanation, I listen - and ask another source for confirmation. I don't tell the mechanic he is wrong, the car doesn't need the brakes changed, it's his fault for not making them work. Because I accept when my knowledge is limited and rely on others to independently verify the statements made.

You, obviously and without insult intended, no next to nothing about IT. Why don't you ask someone who does, rather than spouting this nonsense?

Edited by Ced Riggs, 13 June 2017 - 01:58 AM.

[PhoenixFire55]

Ced Riggs, on 13 June 2017 - 01:55 AM, said:

You, obviously and without insult intended, no next to nothing about IT. Why don't you ask someone who does, rather than spouting this nonsense?

Or perhaps I know more than enough to be able to tell when I'm being lied to. But then again, my opinion is different from yours, so I *must* be clueless. After all you are sitting inside the exact hub that is causing said problems so you *know* everything first hand.

As I've said elsewhere, frankly I don't give a damn whos fault it is. If I'm having trouble playing your game I will simply stop playing your game. Especially so when I (and others) raise a concern about our troubles playing your game and the developer answers with "All is Fine^TM, gfys".

[Ced Riggs]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 04:07 AM, said:

Especially so when I (and others) raise a concern about our troubles playing your game and the developer answers with "All is Fine^TM, gfys".

Please point out where PGI said "all is fine, gfys". Your impression of what PGI said keeps moving further and further from what they said. Their statement reads: "We are aware something is broken, we'll try to help as much as we can, but we cannot reach the point of failure ourselves." Your interpretation of it is just that. Your interpretation.

Just like I said to Vellron elsewhere: Please provide a source where PGI made such statements.

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 04:07 AM, said:

Or perhaps I know more than enough to be able to tell when I'm being lied to.

The greatest weakness man has is understanding how easy he can be lied to when he is ignorant. Many think themselves smarter than they are, and the very thought of being less smart than they assume causes an instant reaction of rejection. I do not mean to tell you "you're dumb for not knowing this". You are not. I am sure you are a well-versed, life-experienced person with their fair share of knowledge in a great many fields. Yet, from your posts it is rather easy to tell that networking, especially on the larger WAN/GAN level, is not such a topic. And it does not have to be.

You can assume malice, treachery, laziness, neglience all you want. That is called projection. Or you could allow the very thought of PGI being damaged by these events and having no interest in perpetuating it. The thought where it is in the utmost interest of a company that their customers can use and purchase their products. Where the opposite is detrimental to their financial success, and being neglient about it harms their bottom line. That is called common sense.

[LowSubmarino]

Ced Riggs, on 13 June 2017 - 04:18 AM, said:

Please point out where PGI said "all is fine, gfys". Your impression of what PGI said keeps moving further and further from what they said. Their statement reads: "We are aware something is broken, we'll try to help as much as we can, but we cannot reach the point of failure ourselves." Your interpretation of it is just that. Your interpretation.

Just like I said to Vellron elsewhere: Please provide a source where PGI made such statements.


The greatest weakness man has is understanding how easy he can be lied to when he is ignorant. Many think themselves smarter than they are, and the very thought of being less smart than they assume causes an instant reaction of rejection. I do not mean to tell you "you're dumb for not knowing this". You are not. I am sure you are a well-versed, life-experienced person with their fair share of knowledge in a great many fields. Yet, from your posts it is rather easy to tell that networking, especially on the larger WAN/GAN level, is not such a topic. And it does not have to be.

You can assume malice, treachery, laziness, neglience all you want. That is called projection. Or you could allow the very thought of PGI being damaged by these events and having no interest in perpetuating it. The thought where it is in the utmost interest of a company that their customers can use and purchase their products. Where the opposite is detrimental to their financial success, and being neglient about it harms their bottom line. That is called common sense.

Epic speech.

But the problems arent recent problems haha!

Mwo has been unstable for as long as humanity exists.

Theres hardly ever a game where not at the very least one person cannot connect or discos or crashes.

Calling it recent problems is ridiculous on a level that there a new word has to be invented to describe just how ridiculous such a statement ist.

So, you can actually argue that by saying 'recent' issues it is implied before that time all is well.

So, yes....you can definitely argue that pgi said 'prior to these - in our opinion recent - problems all was fine'.

Which simply isnt true. It just isnt.

Edited by oneda, 13 June 2017 - 04:35 AM.

[PhoenixFire55]

Ced Riggs, on 13 June 2017 - 04:18 AM, said:

Yet, from your posts it is rather easy to tell that networking, especially on the larger WAN/GAN level, is not such a topic. And it does not have to be.

And the only thing that is rather easy to tell from yours is that you actually know exactly what the problem is, since you are such a big expert on networking of any level. But you see, the problem is ... you don't. And since you don't, you do the same thing as me ... share your clueless opinion.

I'm not going to go into a battle of wits over who knows more about whatnot, this is already off-topic as it is. Your opinion isn't any better or worse than mine unless you present facts. So far I've seen zero facts presented by PGI, you, me or anyone else on the forum. I.e. this is nothing but exchange of opinions based on anything and nothing.

Right now you and PGI decided to go along the line of "Its not our fault, russian haxxors hacked our elections". Sure, suit yourself. It only makes you look silly and puts you further and further away from actually solving the problem.

[Ced Riggs]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 04:41 AM, said:

Your opinion isn't any better or worse than mine unless you present facts.

Right now you and PGI decided to go along the line of "Its not our fault, russian haxxors hacked our elections". Sure, suit yourself. It only makes you look silly and puts you further and further away from actually solving the problem.

Have I not provided facts and explanations? If you refuse to acknowledge those, what would you have me do? Here, have another forum poster provide some data he produced himself. Additionally, I refute the suggestive language that I am somehow in cahoots with PGI. If you cannot accept an honest response, do you want to be lied to? Should PGI plead guilty for something they aren't guilty of, just so you have a scapegoat?

"Solving the problem" means that the highway between clients and servers needs to be cleared. PGI can't do that, clients can't do that. The solution is nothing PGI can cause. How far does responsibility of a company go? Do you expect FedEx to hire a fleet of snowplows so they can serve Northern Canada, or do you expect the state to do that?

Where does all this entitled hostility come from? I am at a loss.

[Gwahlur]

For reference, here's PGI's first post on the matter:

Alexander Garden, on 07 June 2017 - 03:36 PM, said:

Hey all,

Our servers appear healthy so far; it looks like something weird is going down with some key backbone services in the US, and it's cascading into issues for various ISPs. This could also be impacting you if you're connecting to the North American servers from outside the continent, depending on how your ISP connection is being routed.

As a result of this we've extended the Group Victory and Faction Play Participation Challenges by one day; they now end Thursday at 11:59:59 PM UTC. The event calendar has been updated to reflect this.

Due to the nature of the event I can't guarantee we'll be able to keep shifting stuff around if any regional connection issues persist or crop up again after today, so hopefully things return to normal soon

[Ced Riggs]

Gwahlur, on 13 June 2017 - 06:12 AM, said:

For reference, here's PGI's first post on the matter:

Looks fine to me.

[PhoenixFire55]

Ced Riggs, on 13 June 2017 - 05:06 AM, said:

Have I not provided facts and explanations? If you refuse to acknowledge those, what would you have me do?

I refuse to acknowledge these because a map of NA networking has nothing to do with me and others rubberbanding while playing from Europe on EU server exclusively. Or what does it have to do with anything at all, if these were the case, then why people who play other games only report having issues with MWO? Either all other games have their servers somewhere in Oregon where there aren't any outages (which then raises questions why MWO servers aren't there as well), or all other games simply have a far better netcode that is able to handle jitter and packetloss better.

Ced Riggs, on 13 June 2017 - 05:06 AM, said:

Here, have another forum poster provide some data he produced himself. Additionally, I refute the suggestive language that I am somehow in cahoots with PGI. If you cannot accept an honest response, do you want to be lied to? Should PGI plead guilty for something they aren't guilty of, just so you have a scapegoat?

They are responsible for the quality of their services. If they can't figure out where the problem is and can't make the people responsible for said problem fix it then they should migrate their server to a different location. This isn't a problem that occurred yesterday, it has been present for ages. But I've said all that several times already, if you cared about anything but your own superior viewpoint you'd known the answer already.

Additionally these problems correlate with an amount of people playing MWO as we've seen during the latest Tuk.3 event - more people on MWO servers means more rubberbanding up to a degree of a total fkn disaster. But feel free to tell me how the influx of our huge MWO population during events causes a full scale level 3 outage in half of NA internet infrastructure.

Its you and not me who is looking for yet another scapegoat. IGP is gone after all. Now its level 3 outages. Already not too far from russian haxxors ddosing poor MWO servers.

[Gwahlur]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 06:38 AM, said:

I refuse to acknowledge these because a map of NA networking has nothing to do with me and others rubberbanding while playing from Europe on EU server exclusively. Or what does it have to do with anything at all, if these were the case, then why people who play other games only report having issues with MWO? Either all other games have their servers somewhere in Oregon where there aren't any outages (which then raises questions why MWO servers aren't there as well), or all other games simply have a far better netcode that is able to handle jitter and packetloss better.



They are responsible for the quality of their services. If they can't figure out where the problem is and can't make the people responsible for said problem fix it then they should migrate their server to a different location. This isn't a problem that occurred yesterday, it has been present for ages. But I've said all that several times already, if you cared about anything but your own superior viewpoint you'd known the answer already.

Additionally these problems correlate with an amount of people playing MWO as we've seen during the latest Tuk.3 event - more people on MWO servers means more rubberbanding up to a degree of a total fkn disaster. But feel free to tell me how the influx of our huge MWO population during events causes a full scale level 3 outage in half of NA internet infrastructure.

Its you and not me who is looking for yet another scapegoat. IGP is gone after all. Now its level 3 outages. Already not too far from russian haxxors ddosing poor MWO servers.

Why are you repeating questions that have been answered and bringìng up "points" that have been refuted several times already?

[PhoenixFire55]

Gwahlur, on 13 June 2017 - 06:39 AM, said:

Why are you repeating questions that have been answered and bringìng up "points" that have been refuted several times already?

Quotes or it didn't happen. Nothing have been answered or refuted.

[Gwahlur]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 06:44 AM, said:

Quotes or it didn't happen. Nothing have been answered or refuted.

Read the thread you're posting in, especially "why does it only happen when connecting to some servers/games, and not even all the time then" has been spelled out for you

[Ced Riggs]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 06:44 AM, said:

Quotes or it didn't happen.

Please provide the quote where PGI said "everything is fine" or that customers can "gfts", then.

[Jay Leon Hart]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 06:38 AM, said:

I refuse to acknowledge these because a map of NA networking has nothing to do with me and others rubberbanding while playing from Europe on EU server exclusively.

AMAZING! With less than 30 seconds of internet "research", you too can discover that parts of Europe are also affected.

[PhoenixFire55]

Gwahlur, on 13 June 2017 - 06:46 AM, said:

Read the thread you're posting in, especially "why does it only happen when connecting to some servers/games, and not even all the time then" has been spelled out for you

And once again, quotes or it didn't happen. Because nowhere in this thread there is anything that answers the questions I've raised.

Ced Riggs, on 13 June 2017 - 06:49 AM, said:

Please provide the quote where PGI said "everything is fine" or that customers can "gfts", then.

Sure. Here you go.

[TKSax]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 06:38 AM, said:

I refuse to acknowledge these because a map of NA networking has nothing to do with me and others rubberbanding while playing from Europe on EU server exclusively.

I would agree that the problem we have been talking about has nothing to do with European servers but this is the first you have mentioned you are having the problem with European servers, we have been discussing and the problem PGI was all about N/A servers. However many people have mentioned that during the issues with the NA servesr they were able to play on the European servers, and in fact talking to some of the people I play who live in Europe with they have said they only have had issues with the NA servers and that the europe servers have been great, so this really points to an issues with your computer and or connection.

[PhoenixFire55]

Jay Leon Hart, on 13 June 2017 - 06:52 AM, said:

AMAZING! With less than 30 seconds of internet "research", you too can discover that parts of Europe are also affected.

You know what is even more amazing? ... That people who have 15ms ping and literally live 50km away from the server experience the same issues. Or that supposed level X outages happen at 4am local time when everyone (obviously) is browsing internet and playing games.

[PhoenixFire55]

TKSax, on 13 June 2017 - 06:59 AM, said:

I would agree that the problem we have been talking about has nothing to do with European servers but this is the first you have mentioned you are having the problem with European servers, we have been discussing and the problem PGI was all about N/A servers. However many people have mentioned that during the issues with the NA servesr they were able to play on the European servers, and in fact talking to some of the people I play who live in Europe with they have said they only have had issues with the NA servers and that the europe servers have been great, so this really points to an issues with your computer and or connection.

And that actually has a logical explanation, since if a person from NA plays during NA prime time, it means it is a low-population time on EU server and visa versa. I do have issues with both NA and EU servers, QP I launch into EU exclusively and rubberbanding is frequent, FP is obviously all on NA servers, and it is still same.

The usual "its you" comment is just plain dumb since for some "magical" reason MWO is the only thing that displays any issues.

[Jay Leon Hart]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 07:08 AM, said:

The usual "its you" comment is just plain dumb since for some "magical" reason MWO is the only thing that displays any issues.

For you, perhaps. You should look at the comments here to reralise that no, actually, there are problems all over.

[Ced Riggs]

PhoenixFire55, on 13 June 2017 - 06:59 AM, said:

Sure. Here you go.

The link you provided doesn't contain the information you implied it would. Have another link?