361 replies to this topic

[Valdarion Silarius]

We finally got it in game! Hooray! This thread is dedicated to anything Rifleman IIC, it will clear up any misconceptions that people might have, and will serve to educate any players in the community about what exactly this mech is. I will be doing a lot of copying and pasting from a few past threads. Don't forget to scroll down to the TL:DR. So let's begin!


So what exactly is the Rifleman IIC? Copied directly from Sarna.net:


http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Rifleman_IIC





RFL-IIC

65 Tons

Clan Battlemech

"The Rifleman IIC is an upgrade of the venerable Rifleman BattleMech. Five tons heavier than the design it is based on, the Rifleman IIC is also slower. This creates a great deal more room with which to mount other equipment. Further weight savings are found in the use of an Endo Steel frame. One of the first upgrades to the design was maxing out its protection, with eleven tons of Ferro-Fibrous armor. The vaunted anti-aircraft 'Mech is aided in its role by the inclusion of an Active Probe. To compensate for the loss of speed, the IIC mounts three jump jets that can propel the 'Mech up to ninety meters in one leap."


So let's clear up a few things about the RFL-IIC. I made some frequently asked questions usually asked about the RFL-IIC from the community. The following Q&A will help people understand the mech and what it could bring to MW:O.


Q: Isn't this mech a direct copy of the IS Rifleman? Why would we want a clan version of it in game?

A: It is NOT a direct copy of it's distant IS cousin. Let me clarify to everyone that most of the IIC counterparts are COMPLETELY new mechs redesigned from the ground up by the clans. The only thing that it shares with the IS version is that they share similar roles as AA support mechs.


Q: So it's a dedicated anti-air mech. Why exactly should we have an anti-air mech in a game that has well, no aircraft in it?

A: The Rifleman IIC platform goes above and beyond it's anti-air role and is a formidable clan battlemech. Some label it as a pocket assault since it's prime armament has a powerful quad clan large pulse laser build. When this mech was first introduced by Victor Musical Industries in table top, the mech's original loadout consisted of 20 DHS and simply 4 cLPL's. The mech was so powerful that they had to remove 1 DHS, in favor for a clan beagle active probe and a single back up ER small laser in the head. The 19 DHS's now prevent it from successfully alphaing without any heat penalties per round.


Q: I get it. Is this another clan cheese meta mech?

A: Not at all. In all of it's clan glory the Rifleman IIC has one major drawback. It's speed. On tabletop it has a meager 3/5/3, or basically a top speed of 54 kmph. This is largely due to the fact that the clans figured that the mech doesn't need a lot of speed since it serves as a defensive second line sentry mech. With 11 tons of ferro-fibrous armor it can tank quite easily for it's weight bracket.


Q: 54 kmph on a clan 65 ton heavy? Are you kidding me? That is dangerously slow for a clan heavy!

A: Not quite true at all. This rule only applies to the standard default engine of the mech. The jump jets on the RFL-IIC prime gave it extra mobility when needed on the battlefield. However since this is a clan battlemech, the standard engine can be swapped out for an XL. This will bump up the speed to 64.8 kmph to as much as 72+ kmph depending on what PGI decides it's engine cap will be for the mech. A safe bet would be somewhere around XL 320-340 since we had a large engine bump with the Annihilator (whom suffered from movement mobility as well).


Q: It's another 65 ton clan mech. Don't we have enough clan heavies in the game already?

A: It would be the 4th clan heavy battlemech to be introduced to the game. While we have the Hellbringer, Ebon Jaguar, and the Linebacker, the Rifleman IIC offers something unique to the plate. It would be the second available clan heavy battlemech in the game. The only other clan heavy battlemech that exists in game is the Orion IIC.


Q: We already have the Night Gyr and the upcoming Nova Cat for clan heavy energy mechs. Why should we have another clan laser vomit mech?

A: The Rifleman IIC would be unique to these mechs in the fact that it has 5 high energy hard points. That is two for each arm, and one in the head. The other fact is that the Nova Cat and Night Gyr are clan omnimechs makes the Rifleman IIC unique that it has more customization options vs locked omnipods. Not only that, but it has 2 lore friendly variants that already use civil war era tech. Leaving the RFL-IIC to have 4 MW:O lore friendly variants for mechpacks + whatever hero PGI designs for the chassis.


Now let's review:


- It's a clan 65 ton battlemech. With the standard stock engine it acts more like a 65 ton pocket assault mech. It can dish out some mean damage and tank for it's weight class.

- High arm mounts. The standard configuration offers 4 x Clan Large Pulse Lasers, while a single ER medium laser in the head. That gives the prime a grand total of 5 high energy hard points with Jump Jet capabilities.

- Upgrading engine capabilities. Throw a clan XL engine in this bad boy and now it can go up to 64.8 kmph to possibly 70+ kmph. Want to tank more? stick with the clan standard engine and support your assault buddies. IMO, the community acts like the 54 kmph will kill this mech. I guarantee it won't by any means.

I say 70+ kmph as loosely as possible because this will all depend of the engine cap that PGI will decide to give the mech. I have high hopes for this since they gave the Annihilator a decent engine cap, so expect an XL 340 at the very most.

- Jump Jets. This was supposed to help with the slower mobility of the original concept of the Prime. In the world of MW:O, this will make it an effective hill peaker. Remove the JJ's for more heatsinks or throw in a targeting computer.

- Multiple lore variants to choose from. The Rifleman IIC has 4 different canon friendly variants that syncs nicely with the Civil War era timeline. Variant 3 introduces a nice mix of ballistics + energy hard points (2 x Heavy Large Lasers + 2 Ultra Auto Cannon 2's). Variant 4 mixes energy with missiles ( 2 x c Large Pulse Lasers + 2 ATM9's). Don't forget to include whatever hero PGI makes up for the mech.

- A viable option for drop decks in FW. Since the mech fills in the 65 ton slot, you can now decide to save the extra tonnages with a clan battlemech as opposed to the Orion IIC, which is locked at 75 tons. The only other options in the heavy bracket now are all clan Omnimechs. The Rifleman IIC would be the second clan heavy battlemech in game.


Edit: Thanks to Will9761 for the follow tech specs for the Rifleman IIC variants 1 through 4:

RFL-IIC
Debuted - 2845

Head - ER Small Laser
Center Torso - Active Probe, Jump Jet
Right Torso - Jump Jet
Left Torso - Jump Jet
Right Arm - 2x Large Pulse Lasers
Left Arm - 2x Large Pulse Lasers

Engine: 195 STD = 54 KPH

Estimated Hardpoints -

HD - 1E
RA - 2E
LA- 2E


RFL-IIC-2
Debuted - 2997

Head - N/A
Center Torso - Jump Jets
Right Torso - Jump Jets
Left Torso - Jump Jets
Right Arm - 2x Ultra Autocannon 2s
Left Arm - 2x Ultra Autocannon 2s

Engine: 260 STD = 64 KPH

Estimated Hardpoints -

RA - 2B
LA - 2B


RFL-IIC-3
Debuted - 3062

Head - Active Probe
Center Torso - Jump Jets
Right Torso - Jump Jets
Left Torso - Jump Jets
Right Arm - Heavy Large Laser, Ultra Autocannon 2
Left Arm - Heavy Large Laser, Ultra Autocannon 2

Engine: 195 STD = 54 KPH

Estimated Hardpoints -

RA - 1E, 1B
LA - 1E, 1B


RFL-IIC-4
Debuted - 3065

Head - N/A
Center Torso - Jump Jet
Right Torso - Jump Jet
Left Torso - Jump Jet
Right Arm - Large Pulse Laser, ATM 9
Left Arm - Large Pulse Laser, ATM 9

Engine: 195 STD = 54 KPH

Estimated Hardpoints -

RA - 1E, 1M
LA - 1E, 1M


Now for the TL:DR.


A great, viable clan battlemech with jump jets, BAP and high weapon mounts. What more could you want?


If you like what you have read here, be sure to head over to Twitter and like this tweet from Roderick Steiner. Making a Twitter account is easy, and Russ Bullock will surely see that people want this mech in MW:O.



https://twitter.com/...802799837630464


A fun little fact:

The original IS Rifleman has a Garret T11-A radar tracking system, similar to an IRL US naval warship's radar system array.






While in contrast, the Rifleman IIC's radar dish "hat" is more akin to a Boeing E3 Sentry's aerial radar dish. Both radars on each mech function in circular rotation (while the IS Rifleman's is clearly more visible, the Rifleman IIC's is enclosed in the disc that rotates on two support pylons on it's head).






I made a promotional video of a Rifleman IIC in Dakteks mod in Garrys mod. I made a thread about Daktek awhile back, but decided to post it here since it's a double promotional video that links back to this specific thread.



Last but not certainly least, here it finally is in all of it's nostalgic glory. The Rifleman IIC in Mechwarrior Online. Big props to Alex and the art team on this design. It's a perfect blend of classic Rifleman IIC with just the right amount of MW:O touch to it. It does the classic artwork justice:

Edited by Arnold The Governator, 05 February 2019 - 07:09 PM.

[xVLFBERHxT]

i am with you!

[Kanil]

Arnold The Governator, on 13 June 2017 - 08:40 PM, said:

A safe bet would be somewhere around XL 320-340 since we had a large engine bump with the Annihilator (whom suffered from movement mobility as well).

I'm still curious as to where you got your 320-340 number from. That seems extremely optimistic. A 330+ would make it the second fastest 65 tonner in the game, second only to the freakin' Linebacker.

PGI might give it a break, but expecting it's engine cap to start with a 3... does not seem likely.

[Snowbluff]

I wonder if there is a more advanced sensor we can model it off of? Like a Wedgetail's rectangular sensor?

[Johnny Z]

The Rifleman is an Inner Sphere mech we don't want a Rifleman IIc.

[An Innocent Urbie]

I am still waiting for Urbanmech IIC

[Valdarion Silarius]

Kanil, on 13 June 2017 - 09:02 PM, said:

I'm still curious as to where you got your 320-340 number from. That seems extremely optimistic. A 330+ would make it the second fastest 65 tonner in the game, second only to the freakin' Linebacker.

PGI might give it a break, but expecting it's engine cap to start with a 3... does not seem likely.

It was suggested a few threads back. The ball is in PGI's court with what they want to do with the mech. I really think it shouldn't exceed 320 imo.

Johnny Z, on 13 June 2017 - 09:13 PM, said:

The Rifleman is an Inner Sphere mech we don't want a Rifleman IIc.

Good thing that 'we' doesn't include me and many others . Also I think the MAD-IIC in game would like to have a word with you on that statement.

[Johnny Z]

First time I liked my own reply this topic.

[Kanil]

Arnold The Governator, on 13 June 2017 - 09:29 PM, said:

It was suggested a few threads back. The ball is in PGI's court with what they want to do with the mech. I really think it shouldn't exceed 320 imo.

That would still be super high, considering a stock 4/6 65 tonner gets an engine cap of 315. It'd be faster than Thunderbolts/JagerMechs/etc.

The Annihilator's base speed is 2/3 and it ended up with a 3/5 cap. Alternatively, it goes from a 1.2 multiplier to 1.5. The Bounty Hunter is 3/5 stock and gets a 4/6 cap.

If you assume they're just going to bump the cap up to one move point more (as they did with the Annihilator, and Bounty Hunter) then a 260 cap seems reasonable. If you assume they're going to give it the full Annihilator 50% boost (I highly doubt this) then it'll be 295.

I mean, I guess PGI could theoretically do whatever the hell it wants (such as nothing, in the case of the poor Cataphract 4X), but a 260 cap seems likely (and a 320-340 is completely absurd.)

Edited by Kanil, 13 June 2017 - 09:37 PM.

[Will9761]

I can get behind this idea, count me in. I've always though that the Mechwarrior 2 line up of mechs should be in the game like the Warhammer IIC and Rifleman IIC.

Make it happen PGI!

[Yellonet]

Arnold The Governator, on 13 June 2017 - 09:29 PM, said:

Also I think the MAD-IIC in game would like to have a word with you on that statement.

Yeah, and how many IS Marauders do you see these days compared to MAD-IIC's?

No, let's replace all IS mechs with their OP clam cousins, good idea...
Once I get IS vs IS battles, you can have any clan mech you want.

[Juodas Varnas]

To hell with your silly Sombrero mech!

Gib Scorpion instead!

[Will9761]

Juodas Varnas, on 13 June 2017 - 09:59 PM, said:

To hell with your silly Sombrero mech!

Gib Scorpion instead!

That will never happen.

[Kasumi Sumika]

I'm still waiting for Warhammer IIC.

[Tincan Nightmare]

Arnold The Governator, on 13 June 2017 - 08:40 PM, said:

Q: It's another 65 ton clan mech. Don't we have enough clan heavies in the game already?

A: It would be the 4th clan heavy battlemech to be introduced to the game. While we have the Hellbringer, Ebon Jaguar, and the Linebacker, the Rifleman IIC offers something unique to the plate. It would be the second available clan heavy battlemech in the game. The only other clan heavy battlemech that exists in game is the Orion IIC.

Umm so did the Mad Dog, Timber Wolf, and Summoner get removed from the game, pretty sure they are all heavies as well. Not to mention the Night Gyr, and the soon to be released Nova Cat, which would hit before any Rifleman IIC since it's already being put in the game while the Rifleman IIC hasn't even been announced yet. That's more like 10 Clan heavies that are in the game. If you mean non-Omnimech heavy, well then yes it would be the second 'standard' battlemech for the Clans, but it's not exactly a low populated weight class.

Not that I'm against the Rifleman IIC, though it's ironic that you would actually see this mech being played with it's Clan tech versus the scarcely seen IS models.

edit* Oh and the only thing it offers is just pretty much more laservomit, nothing unique about that.

Edited by Tincan Nightmare, 14 June 2017 - 12:20 AM.

[Ced Riggs]

Okay.

[Dr Mlem]

That would be cool. Rifleman IIC and Warhammer IIC would be great mechs to have. The more mechs in the game, the better imo.

[TheArisen]

Well if you're lucky it'll get a cap of 300 which is still good for it's weight.

But I do hope you get your mech. +1

[Battlemaster56]

I support this mech coming in, as it help round out the IIC of the reseen mechs. The only ones that we don't have to worry bout like the wasp, stinger, thunderbolt, archer etc. Either from the og not been released yet or tech haven't came yet.

[General Pete]

I remember the Rifleman IIC being a terror on the tabletop back in the day. It would be more laser vomit in MWO, but I agree it should be included. It's not the original Rifleman at all, and people who enjoy their Rifleman can still pilot the old reliable.

But howabout the Glass Spider??