78 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

The Jerol, on 16 June 2017 - 10:31 AM, said:

Two months ago, you had 33,000 players on your leaderboards. Now you have 25,000.

I stopped playing after the Skill Tree went live as I just didn't have the desire (or time) to completely re-learn the Mech Lab/game. I understand and accept the premise that skilling up a mech in the new system becomes much easier after you've spent the requisite hours reading up on it, watching videos on it, testing it out in the Testing grounds, etc. I just don't want to do all that right now -- and I'm apparently not alone. Add to that the fact that when the new tech is released a lot of skill builds will need to be radically revised (adding to the time and grind) and it becomes a bit overwhelming.

I'm an ideal customer and a gigantic fan of anything Battletech related. It is my profound hope that I will find the energy (and time) to come back to the game, but many will not. What is the strategy in play here? Alienate a quarter of your player base, while adding zero new players by making an already complex game even more complicated? When I log in and see hundreds of skill points and hundreds of millions of C-bills to allocate, and a skill tree with over 250 choices to make per mech, then multiply that times dozens of mechs to re-skill, I just get depressed, to be honest.

I'm addressing this post to PGI -- though I'm ready and willing to accept the "good riddance, we don't want you to play anyway" responses which are the norm on these forums. When 25% of your player base goes away in a month, your game is in trouble. What are you doing about it?

Post hoc ergo propter hoc

[Cy Mitchell]

Wyald Katt, on 16 June 2017 - 11:25 AM, said:

I'm in Florida, too. But my reaction is more "AUGH THE SUN" and "AUGH RETIREES".

I take comfort that MWO players drive better than they do. Mostly.

I am in Florida too and I take more issue with the yahoos driving in their smokey lifted pick-up trucks and the yuppy types in their "look at me" BMWs.

On topic: I was on break waiting for the ST. I played a few games after it dropped and then they announced there would be adjustments to all energy weapons this patch and in July the new Civil War tech will be released. I have leveled up 14 of my Mechs but I am not playing much until all this other stuff drops and then I can try to adjust to it all at once. It will be like a semi-new game experience!

Oh, and I spend a lot of time sitting out by the pool reading Battleech novels. When I get too hot I jump in the pool. There is that.

I and a lot of others will be back soon.

[Brain Cancer]

Quote

The fear is real... So is the driveling

Perception is more important than truth, if the result is "fewer players". PGI has never been notable for making new things user-friendly to comprehend, and all it takes is enough of a shakeup to get people to drop.

[Bishop Steiner]

Rampage, on 16 June 2017 - 11:50 AM, said:

I am in Florida too and I take more issue with the yahoos driving in their smokey lifted pick-up trucks and the yuppy types in their "look at me" BMWs.

On topic: I was on break waiting for the ST. I played a few games after it dropped and then they announced there would be adjustments to all energy weapons this patch and in July the new Civil War tech will be released. I have leveled up 14 of my Mechs but I am not playing much until all this other stuff drops and then I can try to adjust to it all at once. It will be like a semi-new game experience!

Oh, and I spend a lot of time sitting out by the pool reading Battleech novels. When I get too hot I jump in the pool. There is that.

I and a lot of others will be back soon.

Summer, IRL, other new games launching, specifically 25000 beta keys for battletech (shocking the two playerbases might have overlap.... and it was long prognosticated that the beginning of one would have at least a a temporary impact on the other), etc.

Yup. Hair on fire, Dumpster on Fire, Sky Is Falling, Chicken Littles, still being the same making same claims, 5 years later.

Oddly... MWO is still here. (I'm not ATM due to baked tater computer issues, but hoping to try to play some after patch, anyhow)

[The Pug Commander]

the skill tree is super simple to figure out.

[Bishop Steiner]

The Pug Commander, on 16 June 2017 - 12:02 PM, said:

the skill tree is super simple to figure out.

but not as simple as being butthurt and QQing, obviously.

[JC Daxion]

Ruar, on 16 June 2017 - 11:41 AM, said:

So much this. Thank you for putting into words I can't.

I have spent more time on the forums since the ST release than I have in the game. Which is surprising since I really enjoy playing the Quickdraw, a new mech for me, but the game just isn't as much fun having to deal with the ST.

Maybe it's my favorite mech pre-ST isn't that much fun anymore. I have over 450 matches in my ENF-4R but I barely play it after the ST release because it just doesn't feel as fun to play. Overheats too fast so I spend more time waiting to cooldown than I do actually fighting. Anyway I redesign the build results in something I don't enjoy.

Regardless, the game just isn't the same since they released the skill tree. Which is good and bad because I'm getting other things done in my life, but I no longer look forward to playing MWO most days.

Well any balance change could of done that. People are conflating the skill tree and balance changes far to much.

The skill tree is something you use to tweak your mech in a few directions. The problem is people think the skill tree is used to bring your mech back to what it was. It is not. So a lot of what people are getting overwhelmed with is my mech isn't the same, my mech sucks, there fore it must be the skill tree which sucks and i don't get it and don't have the time to figure it out.


People say they just wanna log in and play and not learn the skill tree. I suggest they do just that. Log in, pick a mech you never played before, Make your build and just start playing. The skill tree teaches itself. You are leveling your mech, and you add points to what you think it needs. does this mech need heat control? Does it need some weapon tweaks? Maybe it could be beefed up a bit with armor, maybe it needs to get movement or sensors. As you add the points you will see what they do and it is natural. Do this with one mech, and all you are doing is logging in and playing and you will understand the whole concept.

after that it takes all of 2 mins.



IMO the biggest issue with the skill tree is they did a ton of changes/nerfs to how mechs work AND added the skill tree system at the same time. People feel they have to learn all over again, which in someways is true. But its the reason is you need to change your thinking/playstyle on your mechs because of the balance changes, not the ST.

Edited by JC Daxion, 16 June 2017 - 12:33 PM.

[Mystere]

cazidin, on 16 June 2017 - 10:34 AM, said:

...What, exactly, do you think PGI can do?

Hmm! Before I start, may I ask: Did you mean "can" or "will" do?

[Cementi]

Prosperity Park, on 16 June 2017 - 11:38 AM, said:

Nobody who really likes this game is quitting over the skill tree. The only people quitting over the skill tree are the "old dogs" who lack the brainpower to chose skills. They can only function if their skills are forced upon them with no choice in the matter.

That way they don't have to worry about somebody "out-mechlabbing" them. The fear is real... So is the driveling.

Hey now I know quite a few old dogs who like the skill tree. Not sure if 37 makes me an old dog but I like the tree as well. Sure nothing is perfect and there are changes I would like but on the whole I like it and expect it to evolve with the game.....if the people on the forums will let it evolve.

Honestly it really does not take that much time to get the hang of it and the 91 clicks complaint is just hilariously pathetic.

PS also I think it is actually 96 clicks if you count the skill menus and stuff. Either way its a trivial thing to whine about. Takes me about 2 mins to skill up a new mech. Who cares and yes I also have to many damn mechs......most of which I do not play anyway so they do not really count.

[Mystere]

Andi Nagasia, on 16 June 2017 - 10:36 AM, said:

i only get on for a couple minutes a day, after all its summer, and i live in Florida,

.. one sec the beach is calling,

Unfortunately, my honey just started a new job and thus needs to first accumulate vacation days ...

which means I can have the penthouse by the beach all to myself, not to mention the pool.

Edited by Mystere, 16 June 2017 - 01:15 PM.

[Gwahlur]

FatDaddyIQuit, on 16 June 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

I already levelled the mechs I enjoy playing. I'm not wasting my time doing it again.

And you don't have to, you've gotten enough skill points to fully level them already

Edited by Gwahlur, 16 June 2017 - 02:19 PM.

[Mystere]

Kendricke, on 16 June 2017 - 11:30 AM, said:

The first concept that supports this is referred to as "friction". If there's too much "friction" at any given time, people suddenly find other things to do with their time and money, whether it's a show, a website, or a game. Everyone's threshhold for friction varies - and it can vary week to week or even minute to minute.

On this I cannot disagree. Good stuff.

Prosperity Park, on 16 June 2017 - 11:38 AM, said:

Nobody who really likes this game is quitting over the skill tree.

But they may be playing less, much less. Get a critical mass of people doing the same at any given time, and you will probably end up with a ghost town.

Just some food for thought.

[A Shoddy Rental Mech]

cazidin, on 16 June 2017 - 10:34 AM, said:

...What, exactly, do you think PGI can do?

Release another mechpack !

[BlueStrat]

The Nerf Bat, on 16 June 2017 - 01:29 PM, said:

Release another mechpack !

Sell MWO to Blizzard, Ubisoft, Gaijin, etc?

Wait, I know! Sell MWO to *Microsoft*!!

Edited by BlueStrat, 16 June 2017 - 01:58 PM.

[rollermint]

I'm in the same boat.

I don't hate the game, I don't feel like I quitted the game. But ever since skill tree, I logged in...twice? thrice? I remember skilling up a dragon and...i think it was a crab and I was done. I simply have no desire or energy to relearn everything from scratch.

I'm not judging or criticising PGI for introducing the new skill system, its a done deal. I still think about the game for whats its worth, thinking about builds and such, a little excited about upcoming new mechs and techs...but yeah, skill tree..oh well, heres me procrastinating again. lol

Quite surprised that 25% of the playerbase are feeling the same.

[cazidin]

Mystere, on 16 June 2017 - 01:04 PM, said:

Hmm! Before I start, may I ask: Did you mean "can" or "will" do?

It's *me* asking! Which do you think?

[Thorqemada]

With some good fate i move soon to a location with good Internet and could start playing again somewhat more if i would but even i had the urge i strongly feel its better to wait for the new Tech and not waste any time on the game and skilltree yet for soon to be outdated weapons etc.

And if the gameplay then is any good is stil to be proven...

Is it strutt or is it trudge we can then say at end of match!

Edited by Thorqemada, 16 June 2017 - 02:13 PM.

[Prototelis]

rollermint, on 16 June 2017 - 01:56 PM, said:

I simply have no desire or energy to relearn everything

Relearn what exactly?

ST didn't change gameplay. Mechlab is still the same.

You hit the button, dance in front of some reds, and maybe get a kill or two.

You can tab over to your loadout without purchasing skills to see how your allocation affects your build. IE, for the first time you actually know what kind of bonuses you are going to get without performing some simple arithmetic.

The absolute horror of it all! How will we ever learn to click hexes connected by lines?

[Ruar]

JC Daxion, on 16 June 2017 - 12:31 PM, said:

Well any balance change could of done that. People are conflating the skill tree and balance changes far to much.

The skill tree is something you use to tweak your mech in a few directions. The problem is people think the skill tree is used to bring your mech back to what it was. It is not. So a lot of what people are getting overwhelmed with is my mech isn't the same, my mech sucks, there fore it must be the skill tree which sucks and i don't get it and don't have the time to figure it out.


People say they just wanna log in and play and not learn the skill tree. I suggest they do just that. Log in, pick a mech you never played before, Make your build and just start playing. The skill tree teaches itself. You are leveling your mech, and you add points to what you think it needs. does this mech need heat control? Does it need some weapon tweaks? Maybe it could be beefed up a bit with armor, maybe it needs to get movement or sensors. As you add the points you will see what they do and it is natural. Do this with one mech, and all you are doing is logging in and playing and you will understand the whole concept.

after that it takes all of 2 mins.



IMO the biggest issue with the skill tree is they did a ton of changes/nerfs to how mechs work AND added the skill tree system at the same time. People feel they have to learn all over again, which in someways is true. But its the reason is you need to change your thinking/playstyle on your mechs because of the balance changes, not the ST.

For me it's the heat changes that really are felt the most. You can't get the same level of heat dissipation from the ST as you could before the ST. Yeah, I know it's not supposed to be what it was in every aspect. No issues there. I understand why they did what they did, I just don't like the outcome which has caused me to play less. I wish we could choose to have the same heat management as previous at the cost of something else.

As for the part about just playing and clicking on whatever to start using the ST.... hell no. Absolutely not. I've already leveled several mechs from 0 SP up to 91 SP. It sucks. I realize it doesn't suck as bad as leveling up three different chassis, but it still sucks. There is just no way I'm going to click all over the place while dragging out the grind for the mech. I'll pick a route, see how it goes, make a few changes, but if I don't like it then I just won't play that mech.

Why should I spend time having not-fun just so I can force myself to learn a system that should be simple and easy to use but isn't?

And honestly, that's what bugs me the most. The ST SHOULD be simple and easy to use. It should be intuitive and something I don't feel like I'm grinding through. The previous skill system only felt like a grind when I had to work through a chassis I didn't like. The new ST feels like a grind on every mech I use, to include the chassis I greatly enjoy.

But it's not fun. And even though I'm fully capable of understanding the nuances of the ST, of doing the research, of learning the best routes and how it's used, it doesn't mean I actually enjoy doing all of that stuff. They forced a crappy design on us and no amount of people saying "but it isn't that hard" changes the fact it isn't that fun to use.

[Mystere]

cazidin, on 16 June 2017 - 01:57 PM, said:

It's *me* asking! Which do you think?

Bummer.