124 replies to this topic

[Vellron2005]

Leone has a point.. although, I've lurmed to death plenty of mechs trying to do just that.. cose' when I don't have friendly spotters, my own UAV's and locks work good too.. Sure, I have to expose myself and take damage, but once I have you locked, I can retreat behind cover and damage you without taking damage myself. It's all very situational.

And I can always dumb-fire my LRMs..

Also the LRM boats that you CT-hit were doing it wrong. They should have positioned better and waited for more reliable locks, or simply call you out as a primary target.

If you're getting CT-hit in a LRM boat, something's wrong. You're support, not a brawler.

[Kroete]

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

I don't know what you did to them in the last patch but this is insane! It now feels like every map is Polar or as I like to call it, Lurmageddon Hell.

Lurmageddon?
This kids today! There is a little drizzle and they call it flood ...
If you have been there, you would know that the sky was dark and every little step out of cover was your doom.
Pretty spiraling artemis lrms doing 180 degree turns hitting your torso or cockpit with 100 accuracy ...

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

Off the top of my head, a few things that can be done...

*Limit the amount of Lurm Boats per team

*Increase the loading time... the more LRMs the longer the loading time... For Example, maybe LRM20s have a 20 sec reload time while LRM 5s have a 5 sec reload time

Then please also limit the ppcs, gauss and everything the metawhores are using.
LRMs are, after flamers, mgs and narc, the least used weapons ....

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

*If 40 LRMs are shot, not all 40 of them have to hit. It would be logical that there would be a spread, even if the target is standing still.

LRM spreads, some patches ago lrm 20 were reduced to lrm15 spread and lrm5 were increased to lrm10 spread. (Thats why most lrm users have only around 30-40 accuracy with them).

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

*Make AMS more effective. Sometimes it doesn't seem like mine is doing anything at all.

AMS were buffed the last patches,
more range, modules cheap in the tree and not blocking other weaponmodules, rewards for ams.
AMS mitigates missililedamage, more ams mitigartes more,
you cant expect that 1,5 tons of ams+ammo can counter 20+ tons of lrms.
(4,5 tons of ams+ammo can do that and you can spread it over some mechs).

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

Anyway, just my opinion. I now stand ready to receive the wrath of all those Lurm Boat pilots.

It seems you have never played a lrm-boat.
Do it and then try to do it good, on all maps against all tiers.

Edited by Kroete, 05 July 2017 - 01:35 AM.

[Radbane]

LRM's need to be buffed a notch. Boating them needs to be nerfed tremendously. Most canon mechs that come with many missile slots do so because they have a mix of LRM's and SRM's, not to be able to launch 100's of LRMs at once. Anything beyond two launchers should suffer a severe penalty in my opinion. Note that I said "most" so no need to post about exceptions.

[chucklesMuch]

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 02:44 PM, said:

Wow... glad I made your day... Posted my opinion and got attacked for having one. Great bunch of jerks around here. I'm glad you're so great at this little free game. That must help you out so much in real life. Do you get proud of yourselves for running new people off the forums(which surely must be your intent)? I'm guessing when you were a kid you got beat up and now you've decided to be a "cyber-bully" to compensate? L-O-L! You can attack me or my opinions all you want. It wont keep me from having or stating them.

For any who actually had something constructive to say. Thank you.

I understand the concepts but hiding behind a building all day is not fun and not fair to your team. Neither is trying to move out from behind cover and getting locked on by four lurm boats... especially if you are in a slow moving mech. Thats what I call dying time in less then 30 seconds. and thats no fun at all.

Maybe its just me and I've been getting the short end of the stick lately but the LRMs have seemed to be more powerful in the last couple of weeks but I've talked to others in the game that think the same thing so.....

Hello Goggles,

Guessing you are new to the forums, if not the game. Lurms are regularly, like every other week it seems, popping up on the forums as OP. It's not general consensus though.

Lurms are often considered OP at the lower tiers but not at the higher tiers. Where they are seen as one of the weakest, most situational weapons in the game. (lrm boats can be considered detrimmental to your own team, not always; there some exceptional lurmers and sometimes the stars align). They rely too much on the enemy making a mistake and not having one of the many counters.

[Ruccus]

I may be wrong, but there seems to be a different thought process going on between the new and veteran players with regards to LRMs.

It seems to me that when a new player gets an 'incoming missiles' prompt they want to hide from, block, or otherwise prevent the missiles from doing damage to them and that becomes their main concern. When a veteran player gets an 'incoming missiles' prompt, they know the missiles themselves are just a secondary symptom of the actual problem. The real problem is that an LRM boat has them targeted.

That means a veteran player will immediately start doing the things that they need to do in order to shake the lock instead of concerning themselves too much with the incoming missiles. If you were in the open it could be line-of-sight, so it's about getting out of line of sight then taking a few steps away from where you think the LRM boat lost lock (because that's where his missiles are going to hit). The next thing is UAVs. It's sometimes as simple as looking up to realize that enemy who just died was able to launch a UAV just before he was killed and that's why you're being targeted.

If you've broken LOS, don't see any UAVs, and are still being targeted, then look around because you've likely got an enemy light mech on the flank or rear spotting for the LRM boat. If you see a light mech peeking from the sides or rear, target them and call it out, either on comms or with the radial menu 'target spotted' prompt.

For the OP, what I'd suggest is that you take a pen and paper and use a fast light or medium mech to scout some of the 'lrm friendly' maps in the Training Grounds. Check areas where you've previously had LRM troubles, then scout around there for possible cover. Write down the grid locations for potential cover, grid locations that have no cover so should be avoided, and drop in your bigger mechs and see if the cover will be useful in a fight, and try to get around the map without straying into the areas that don't have cover where you can bail.

For a map like Polar Highlands, you may actually be surprised at how much cover it has when you scout it out in the Training Grounds. The problem is that while it does have cover, it also has areas in which you have nowhere to bail if you get caught out in the open.

[MrMadguy]

El Bandito, on 04 July 2017 - 11:19 AM, said:

LRMs are one of the least efficient weapons, so more you opponents bring them, higher your chance of success.

LRM15 and LRM20 both have enough spread so some missiles can miss a stationary mech.

AMS is semi-effective, especially with Overload nodes. But you simply can't expect to put on a 1.5 ton worth of equipment to completely counter 20 tons worth of weapons. Unless that equipment is called ECM.

I don't know, where this myth comes from. If you play selfish Light, that is immune to LRMs, or don't know, how to use them - then it doesn't mean, they're ineffective. When properly used, they won't let you rise your head out of cover. And when there are lot of LRMs in match - there is always risk of being caught out of cover and lurmed till death in a matter of split second or at least severely damaged.

[Bongo TauKat]

I think I big reason that LRMs are discounted is due to the range that people engage them at. Firing multiple salvos from 900m away is fool hardy IMO. I keep my range at around 400-600m at max. Add to that proper use of UAV and TAG makes them all the more deadly.

[El Bandito]

MrMadguy, on 05 July 2017 - 01:50 AM, said:

I don't know, where this myth comes from. If you play selfish Light, that is immune to LRMs, or don't know, how to use them - then it doesn't mean, they're ineffective. When properly used, they won't let you rise your head out of cover. And when there are lot of LRMs in match - there is always risk of being caught out of cover and lurmed till death in a matter of split second or at least severely damaged.

The "myth" comes from people who actually know how to deal with LRMs. It is not hard as long as you have basic understanding of the game.

Once you get better at the game you will see. You and OP will both see. Meanwhile take advice from players who already know how to deal with LRMs.

Edited by El Bandito, 05 July 2017 - 02:41 AM.

[vandalhooch]

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 10:05 PM, said:

Yes, abuse.. Yes attack.. A quick look back in the thread has me being called names, being called clueless, cute little videos of people laughing(at me I guess)... thats not being attacked? Do you call that constructive criticism or civilized discussion?

I just went back through the first 30 responses to your original post. The only one that is even slightly like you describe is the one with the gif of the three "explorers" synchronizing their laughter.

All the rest are filled with explanations for why you are mistaken, observations about how this topic is continuously brought up by inexperienced players, or suggestions for how the mechanics can be altered to make LRM's more effective as weapons.

It seems that you view anyone who expresses disagreement with your opinion as attacking you. That's your problem, not this community's.

Quote

Humor? Attacking someone is funny only to the bully doing the attacking

I didn't lash out with abuse, I returned fire.

You just claimed that you received abuse and that you returned fire . . . but some how what you did isn't abuse?

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The dozen or so posts that said, "No you're wrong stupid"? Well, that is a compelling argument. Let me study that a little more in detail... Nope

Provide a link to a single post that says that.

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Funny, I just had a conversation in game about this subject and people outside of the Our Crap Don't Stink Penthouse up here seem to think differently. Of course their wrong because.... reasons.

You've played just over 2,000 matches and you are still dying to waves of LRM's? How about instead of thinking you're right and everyone else is wrong, you take the time to read through and implement some of the advice offered by pilots who aren't dying to LRM's?

Quote

I get the feeling if I told you the sky was blue you would tell me I was wrong.

Where did you get that I suddenly realize that people have jobs and lives and blah blah? I said that I thought they lived in their Mom's basement playing video games all day waiting for the cheesy poof delivery. I did admit that I might be wrong but still, how did you get what you got out of that?

Because this isn't my first Internet rodeo, cowboy.

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So, according to "netiquette" how far am I required to look back for a similar thread?

Well, when you first posted your thread, there were two similar threads on the front page, so . . . not very far at all.

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Do I have to read every msg in that thread to make sure it covers what I wanted to bring up or is skimming OK?

You didn't even do that. LRM's and their affect on the game seems to creep into just about every single thread on this forum.

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What if the thread is actually about my topic but had a weird title like, "I like breakfast cereal" and I skipped over it? Am Is still wrong? What am I saying? Of course I'm wrong but apparently I'm wrong for breathing in the eyes of my supposed "betters"

LRM's. It's Just Getting Ridiculous.

LRM Boat Proliferation Grows

Here's two I found within less than five seconds by using the search function.

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So I was "dressed down" for creating another post you guys didn't want to hear or didn't agree with? So in other words I was attacked(yes I was) because someone else made you mad? Man I hope you guys don't come home to kids or pets if you have a bad day in the real world!

1 - It's not us that didn't want to hear about it. It's you who blew up when a couple dozen posters basically copy pasted the same explanations they've used over and over again for years.

2 - Stop trying to feign some sort of concern for how our personal lives are going. You don't know any of us and you are just coming off as a petulant child.

Quote

Never had a temper tantrum... still just stating my opinion and not taking your crap today or ever

Temper tantrum.

Edited by vandalhooch, 05 July 2017 - 03:21 AM.

[chucklesMuch]

MrMadguy, on 05 July 2017 - 01:50 AM, said:

I don't know, where this myth comes from. If you play selfish Light, that is immune to LRMs, or don't know, how to use them - then it doesn't mean, they're ineffective. When properly used, they won't let you rise your head out of cover. And when there are lot of LRMs in match - there is always risk of being caught out of cover and lurmed till death in a matter of split second or at least severely damaged.

Sheesh... Who plays lights anymore...

It's not just lights that can be immune to missiles... rocks > lurms in every weight class. And there is only a risk of getting lurmed to death, caught away from cover when one makes a mistake positionally. (Or some combination of uncommon situational events conspire against you)...

I think the myth is lurms killing anything in a split second... Perhaps you meant ppfld

[Bishop Steiner]

chucklesMuch, on 05 July 2017 - 03:48 AM, said:

Sheesh... Who plays lights anymore...

It's not just lights that can be immune to missiles... rocks > lurms in every weight class. And there is only a risk of getting lurmed to death, caught away from cover when one makes a mistake positionally. (Or some combination of uncommon situational events conspire against you)...

I think the myth is lurms killing anything in a split second... Perhaps you meant ppfld

well the actual death can still happen in a split second...it you are standing in the open in a beat to death mech........... how long it takes for it to arrive is of course a different story, but one rather akin to comparing a fall to the abrupt stop at the end...

[chucklesMuch]

Bishop Steiner, on 05 July 2017 - 03:53 AM, said:

well the actual death can still happen in a split second...it you are standing in the open in a beat to death mech........... how long it takes for it to arrive is of course a different story, but one rather akin to comparing a fall to the abrupt stop at the end...

Kek - well I can't argue that...

[Birthright]

Idk man, since the spirit bear is so ****,
i turned mine into a LRM 75 boat, no other weapons equipped.

I won 8 out of my last 10 games, getting 600+ dmg in each + tier up in every match, even the losses.
In the end i only need 3 full salvos at 300-500m to erase any mech, in that short amount of time no other mech can kill a kodiak, unless he is a DIRESTAR.

From my point of view LRM are overpowered, because they are to easy to use, and really inflate your match score.

Tier 1 players are really not suited for this discussion, the problem with LRMs being to strong happens in lower tier play where there is no communication, no teamplay, no pushing.

You cannot counter LRM spam by urself, your team has to support you and do the same thing, if they dont, then you are screwed, thats why LRMs are overpowered.

You dont need coordination or communication for spamming LRMs on every red triangle that shows up,
you do need it for tho for pushing a LRM heavy team.

So there is a imbalance.

And in lower tier games the team with MORE LRMs wins, not the other way around.

The fact that you will win more than 50% of your games playing a Kodiak LRM boat is alrdy ridicoulous enough...

Edited by Birthright, 05 July 2017 - 04:22 AM.

[KekistanWillRiseAgain]

Birthright, on 05 July 2017 - 04:16 AM, said:

Idk man, since the spirit bear is so ****,
i turned mine into a LRM 75 boat, no other weapons equipped.

I won 8 out of my last 10 games, getting 600+ dmg in each + tier up in every match, even the losses.
In the end i only need 3 full salvos at 300-500m to erase any mech, in that short amount of time no other mech can kill a kodiak, unless he is a DIRESTAR.

From my point of view LRM are overpowered, because they are to easy to use, and really inflate your match score.

Tier 1 players are really not suited for this discussion, the problem with LRMs being to strong happens in lower tier play where there is no communication, no teamplay, no pushing.

You cannot counter LRM spam by urself, your team has to support you and do the same thing, if they dont, then you are screwed, thats why LRMs are overpowered.

You dont need coordination or communication for spamming LRMs on every red triangle that shows up,
you do need it for tho for pushing a LRM heavy team.

So there is a imbalance.

And in lower tier games the team with MORE LRMs wins, not the other way around.

The fact that you will win more than 50% of your games playing a Kodiak LRM boat is alrdy ridicoulous enough...

Keep doing it then... as you rightfully pointed out, your Tier will rise (since it is nothing but an XP Bar anyways that can be manipulated with LRMs being the easiest way), you will be put more consistently with higher Tier players, your "playstyle" will no longer work as well, problem solved.

Sidenote- Why waste a great mech like a Spirit Bear for that? SNV-A can carrying x4 LRM20s and is not nearly as big of a crime against humanity as doing that build on an innocent Spirit Bear.

[Ngamok]

Been awhile on this topic.

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

I don't know what you did to them in the last patch but this is insane! It now feels like every map is Polar or as I like to call it, Lurmageddon Hell.

Off the top of my head, a few things that can be done...

*Limit the amount of Lurm Boats per team

*Increase the loading time... the more LRMs the longer the loading time... For Example, maybe LRM20s have a 20 sec reload time while LRM 5s have a 5 sec reload time

*If 40 LRMs are shot, not all 40 of them have to hit. It would be logical that there would be a spread, even if the target is standing still.

*Make AMS more effective. Sometimes it doesn't seem like mine is doing anything at all.

Anyway, just my opinion. I now stand ready to receive the wrath of all those Lurm Boat pilots.

Can we increase load times on Ballistics and Lazorz as well?

[Eirik Eriksson]

From learning how easy the LRM´s are to avoid I have have never really used them to any extent, they are not very effective as well as that I dont get any real action feeling running them.

There was however one occasion I found them useful. A Saturday night I got home from a party and really felt like playing a few games. Turned out I have had a little too much and couldn´t even hit mechs standing still with my lazers. I took a Hunstman and loaded it full of LRM´s, and now I actually started to hit something.

Still have him loaded with LRM´s - in case of emergency - I have named him Mr Crutch.

[Natred]

Lrms are one of the things wrong with this game. Hold on let me hit r and the 1 button. Move a little so they dont hit the building in front of them.

[Ngamok]

Natred, on 05 July 2017 - 06:51 AM, said:

Lrms are one of the things wrong with this game. Hold on let me hit r and the 1 button. Move a little so they dont hit the building in front of them.

What do you suggest? Remove them? Then everyone can just rush each other and see you can put colored lights and lead into each other first? TBH they are fine. It makes people move around in cover when the opposing team has them. You can get teammates to go harass them for easy kills. You can take out their teammates so they can't press R for them.

[Roadbuster]

Nerf lazorz!

They deal too much damage!
Reduce the maximum ammount of lazorz which can be fired at a time to 4!...No wait, to 2!! HA!
We also need a way to completely negate lazor damage like AMS can destroy missiles. But it shouldn't require any tonnage or ammo.

Oh and autocannons are even worse! And SRMs too! Nerf! Nerf! NERRRRF!!!


/sarcasm

I mean...really? LRMs?
Get AMS running and either get under minimum range or use cover. If someone can shoot you with LRMs, it means there's either a UAV or enemy who can see you. If it's an enemy, it means you can see him too. Shoot him.
LRM boats can never win trading against any direct fire mech because of missile flight time, if you use cover.
EDIT: If you have limited or no cover, like on Polar for example, you will have to act, except you have more AMS than the enemy got missiles. If you wait and hide, you will get flanked, and at that moment, you lost.

You should complain that LRMs are so uneffective that you have to boat them to make them somewhat usefull. Or would you use a single LRM5 or LRM10 in your loadout?

Edited by Roadbuster, 05 July 2017 - 07:18 AM.

[Roadbuster]

Natred, on 05 July 2017 - 06:51 AM, said:

Lrms are one of the things wrong with this game. Hold on let me hit r and the 1 button. Move a little so they dont hit the building in front of them.

Lrms Direct fire weapons are one of the things wrong with this game. Hold on let me hit r and the 1 button. Move a little so they dont hit the building in front of them.

If LRMs are such an easy weapon to use, why do I always see people who struggle to keep a target under their crosshair to get a lock? Or people who keep firing round after round into a building, or into a tunnel wall, without hitting anything.

Goggles Paesano, on 04 July 2017 - 10:05 PM, said:

Man I hope you guys don't come home to kids or pets if you have a bad day in the real world!

Edited by Roadbuster, 05 July 2017 - 07:40 AM.