675 replies to this topic

[Wintersdark]

FireStoat, on 17 July 2017 - 04:49 PM, said:

I, as well as MANY other Clan players would CHEERFULLY, with a huge SMILE on our face, click a button that locks an omnimech FOREVER to its original 8/8 omnipod stock loadout if it would turn it into a Battlemech. Clan battlemechs even with their locked hardpoints are so much better than Omnimechs due to full equipment customization it's not even funny. Don't even taunt me or other players with such a thing - we're literally dreaming it could happen.

There's a reason I almost exclusively run Clan Battlemechs. They are, frankly, just better.

The ability to swap omnipods makes mechs better able to adapt to changing metas, but I have lots of mechs. Locked ES/FF just randomly nerf some mechs and buff others - whether or not they have the "ideal" set of upgrades for their weight/loadouts or not. It's a TERRIBLE balancing method, as it doesn't buff/nerf based on how good the mech is.

I figure locked engines are a good enough exchange as - particularly post again desync - a smaller engine or a bigger one tends to define a mech's "type" or role, without arbitrarily wrecking some and making others great.

Locked engines keeps Omnimechs having flavour and differentiation - keeps your Timberwolf different from your Night Gyr. Locked ES/FF don't do that - they're effectively invisible on the battlefield.


Put another way:

When I see an IS mech, I don't know it's loadouts but can guess based on knowledge of it's hard points, but I've no idea how quick it'll be. My
When I see a clan Omnimech, I know exactly how fast it'll be, but have little idea of what it's loadouts will be.

This why locked engines is important.

ES/FF doesn't contribute to that. It's just arbitrarily nerfs random.mechs.

---

In short: With locked upgrades, I'd convert EVERY Omnimech I own into a battlemech with it's base pods in an instant, and feel I got much stronger mechs as a result.

[Alexander Garden]

Hey everyone,

We've made some changes to the Patch Notes to reflect a couple of things, which I'll summarize here.

The first is that we have moved the Season 1 section header to the beginning of the Timeline Advancement section; prior to the header stating the new Invasion Era - Year 3057 map condition. This was done to better convey that the stated timeline advancement to 3057 was framed more within the context of this first Season, and is not the only Faction Play timeline advancement you may see.
While some of the new technology and 'Mechs being introduced in this patch are from beyond the 3057 Era, and while the tech update was framed in the context of the Civil War era, in the time following their initial announcements we started to consider more acutely what would be lost if we were to apply such a significant, single jump to the Faction Play environment.
Bringing Faction Play into a new Season and timeline, set initially within 3057, gives us the opportunity to use or be inspired by some of the notable periods prior to the Civil War as marquee Faction Play events or Seasons, and gives you the opportunity to play those out. The use of specific timelines in future Seasons isn't something we're prepared to set in stone just yet, however; for now we're very much interested to see how this initial Season of FP may play out with the stated victory conditions, and what kind of opportunities the progress of this season may unlock for us to provide a greater sense of permanence and consequence to Faction Play, its events, and more specifically, your participation and actions within it.
The disconnect between the past Seasons of Faction Play and the new, lore-derived 3057 map was well-highlighted in this sentence from the Patch Notes: "Five years have passed since the defeat of the Clans at the Battle of Tukayyid."
This was a statement derived from the events of lore, where the Clans were defeated and the Truce signed. However, the Clan forces won the last Battle of Tukayyid in MechWarrior Online, and for that matter, won all previous instances of Tukayyid in previous seasons. It's these kinds of distinctions, between established lore and the results of your actions in Faction Play, that we are starting to evaluate more deeply as we look toward potential, future seasons in Faction Play.
And yes; a deeper, better integrated Faction Play event system within the MWO client itself, mentioned in previous Roadmaps and messaging, is still in the works.

The second change to the Patch Notes is a new addition within the Faction Play section covering some changes we're rolling out in the patch to the weighting method used for determining which Game Mode is selected for a Faction Play match in the Conflict Tug of War. In that section we've added a table conveying all the new weighting percentages for each Game Mode across all six Tug of War phases. The goal here was to simply increase the chances of encountering Siege throughout the whole duration of a Conflict, rather than just weighting it more predominantly into the later phases.

I'd also like to take a moment to highlight that we have heard and are continuing to monitor all feedback in regards to the content and changes coming in this upcoming patch. We're very much looking forward to seeing everyone's thoughts once the patch is out and you've had an opportunity to really dig in.

[Commander A9]

Well, it's a start...

...Civil War Update delayed in 3, 2, 1...

Edited by Commander A9, 17 July 2017 - 09:33 PM.

[WeekendWarrior]

Oh well, back to the weapons.
I think the snubbie should have its projectile speed doubled to represent its phenomenal "short range bracket" accuracy. It's one of the most unique weapons on TT, here it's just a standard PPC thats saves you one ton and one slot in exchange for half the range and no minimum. With the increased velocity of the ER PPC, that one is now actually a lot more accurate at the range the snubbie should be better...

There is also no mention of whether the Heavy Peeper still has the reducing damage min range, or is useless within 90m now.

[Zergling]

Jep Jorgensson, on 17 July 2017 - 10:00 AM, said:

I can handle pretty much any Clan weapon fairly well, I just do my best work with LRM's. Took me quite a while to truly master them, but master them I did.

You'll have to excuse my scepticism.

Jep Jorgensson, on 17 July 2017 - 10:00 AM, said:

Only to the overload nodes that not everybody uses.

Those overload nodes was one of the buffs that AMS received.

Grus, on 17 July 2017 - 11:47 AM, said:

agreed, the lighter h eavys and meds will I think benefit the most from the heavy Las line.

Now back to the ER vs heavy

Yes the trade is there, but why would you want to be at that range anyways? You're in the prime range to get murdered by IS laser vomit.

That's like asking 'why do Clan mechs run Small Pulses or ER Smalls, when it is in prime range to get murdered by IS laser vomit?'
The answer is: Clan laser vomit is better than IS laser vomit at close range, and Heavy Lasers are going to be the same.


Eg, take hypothetical 50 tonners, IS and Clan, both moving at 81 kph with no lower or hand actuators.

At equal alpha damage of 48 damage, the IS mech has 2x Large Laser and 6x Medium Lasers, while the Clan mech has 1x Heavy Large and 3x Heavy Medium.

The IS mech uses a 250LFE with endo-steel, and has 15 double heatsinks in total. In MWO, this results in 2.75 heat dissipation per second versus 8.56 HPS, for 32.11% heat efficiency, producing a max DPS of 11.98 and a sustained DPS of 3.85.
The Clan mech uses a 250XL with standard structure, and has 25 double heatsinks in total. In MWO, this results in 4.10 heat dissipation per second versus 6.05 HPS, for 70.25% heat efficiency, producing a max DPS of 7.12 and a sustained DPS of 5.00.

So at equal alpha damage, the Clan mech ends up running cooler thanks to its far greater number of heatsinks, resulting in greater sustained DPS.
The Clan mech is however, clearly outclassed in maximum DPS output.


The Clan mech can also run a higher alpha / higher max DPS build, of 2x Heavy Large and 4x Heavy Medium, which requires adding endo-steel and only 22 double heatsinks.

In MWO, this results in 3.80 heat dissipation per second versus 9.62 HPS, for 39.51% heat efficiency, producing a max DPS of 11.13 and a sustained DPS of 4.40.
And the alpha for such a build is a ridiculous 76, far better than the IS mech at 48.


Further, even if the IS mech has a -10% heat generation quirk, it is still going to be worse than the Clan mech, only reaching 35.68% heat efficiency and 4.27 sustained DPS.

So either way, a Clan Heavy Laser vomit build is better than an IS standard laser vomit build.

Grus, on 17 July 2017 - 11:47 AM, said:

Add to that if I read the numbers right, fireing 4 heavies will push you above 50% heat all on their own? That's damn hot! And now you have to wait for cool down till next week before you fire again.

Heavy Small and Heavy Medium are actually more heat efficient than Clan ER Small and ER Medium.

Edited by Zergling, 17 July 2017 - 10:14 PM.

[Marius Evander]

Alexander Garden, on 17 July 2017 - 09:13 PM, said:

I'd also like to take a moment to highlight that we have heard and are continuing to monitor all feedback in regards to the content and changes coming in this upcoming patch. We're very much looking forward to seeing everyone's thoughts once the patch is out and you've had an opportunity to really dig in.

Tonnage still 240 vs 265? Resetting to 250 v 250 sounds more logical to me.

Contracts reset ? With 2 new factions and russ hinting at possibility in tweets it makes sense to do so. please clarify.

[NocturnalBeast]

Clan Mechs are supposed to be better at this time, although IS tech is starting to advance past lostech and is near parity with Clan tech. It is not until Clan Wolf in exile starts to give Clan Tech to IS factions that the tech is mostly equal.

[Kaptain]

Alexander Garden, on 17 July 2017 - 09:13 PM, said:

The disconnect between the past Seasons of Faction Play and the new, lore-derived 3057 map was well-highlighted in this sentence from the Patch Notes: "Five years have passed since the defeat of the Clans at the Battle of Tukayyid."

A sentence that is contrary to the Civil War Announcement text.

Everyone would have probably been fine with this change had it been an actual announcement with an explanation as apposed to just being thrown into the patch notes a few days before patch. The timeline has been advertised as 3060s for several weeks at this point.

[Thomasso]

Zergling, on 17 July 2017 - 10:02 PM, said:

So either way, a Clan Heavy Laser vomit build is better than an IS standard laser vomit build.

Well.. but you have to remember that Clan equipment/components have less HP than IS counterparts.
Clan tech is more fragile.
Everyone is talking about fire power, range and at the same time they forget about component's HP.

[mad kat]

It is amusing that PGI is insisting of having some relation to lore but the game itself never has been nor ever will be true to lore. So why don't they just accept this and move on.

It would be nice however if they spent some time sat down reading these forums thoroughly and concentrating at least a couple of months on just ironing problems out that have been around for far too long. I'm damn sure player retention will jump up when people see that things have slowed on the "look more mechs, ooh shiny" front and some pointless arbitrary tweaks that no one asked for often actually breaking something that was ok in the first place.

When was the last map release?

Please for the love of God (from an atheist) fix the horrendously broken 'matchmaker'. The PSR introduction was the single worst idea this game ever had.

[Sucy Manbavaran]

Thomasso, on 17 July 2017 - 11:50 PM, said:

Well.. but you have to remember that Clan equipment/components have less HP than IS counterparts.
Clan tech is more fragile.
Everyone is talking about fire power, range and at the same time they forget about component's HP.

And Heat or CD

Edited by Sucy Manbavaran, 17 July 2017 - 11:57 PM.

[GweNTLeR]

A quick thought on current state of SRM's.
I dont really see any role for non artemis SRMs-6 after the new patch. Before, it was your ONLY option(and thus, the only way of usefully using them) for mechs such as QKD-4H or GRF-3M if you wanted to have some alpha strike power.Now however, they are completely outclassed by MRM 10s.
Why? Lower spread, MUCH MORE damage per ton (300 vs 215), and much bigger range.I think, that PGI should consider boosting(decreasing spread by like 10%) SRM's in general(since boosing SRM-6 will require boosting SRM-4s) and changing artemis bonus (from -33% spread to -20% spread and like 7% velocity boost).

Edited by GweNTLeR, 18 July 2017 - 12:17 AM.

[Kaptain]

Thomasso, on 17 July 2017 - 11:50 PM, said:

Well.. but you have to remember that Clan equipment/components have less HP than IS counterparts.
Clan tech is more fragile.
Everyone is talking about fire power, range and at the same time they forget about component's HP.

While component HP is something to think about one must not forget that larger weapons are more likely to take damage in the first place.

[Wintersdark]

Kaptain, on 18 July 2017 - 12:19 AM, said:

While component HP is something to think about one must not forget that larger weapons are more likely to take damage in the first place.

but a clan heavy laser mech has the same size or larger weapons than the IS mech too.

Still doesn't matter, though, as both builds weapons would be heavily padded by dhs and very unlikely to be destroyed significantly before the component housing them is destroyed.

[Zergling]

Just be glad we aren't getting IMPROVED Heavy Lasers, which blow up like Gauss Rifles when they are crit.

[Kaptain]

Wintersdark, on 18 July 2017 - 12:29 AM, said:

but a clan heavy laser mech has the same size or larger weapons than the IS mech too.

Still doesn't matter, though, as both builds weapons would be heavily padded by dhs and very unlikely to be destroyed significantly before the component housing them is destroyed.

No argument from me there. I'm simply pointing out Crit Size plays a role in component destruction as the person I quoted was saying clan tech is universally more fragile. My point is that you cant just look at HP numbers, crits should be considered also as they determine how likely something is to take damage in the first place.

[X Player]

I will have to comment on the MCII running animations. These appear to be copied straight from the DWF animations. That is a bad thing because while they look ridiculous even on the original, slow, 52 kph max Mech, they do look even more so on a 70+ kph Mech like the MCII. I find this unacceptable and require new animations for this otherwise beautiful Mech as soon as possible.

It's breaking my heart </3

[Gasoline]

GweNTLeR, on 18 July 2017 - 12:17 AM, said:

A quick thought on current state of SRM's.
I dont really see any role for non artemis SRMs-6 after the new patch. Before, it was your ONLY option(and thus, the only way of usefully using them) for mechs such as QKD-4H or GRF-3M if you wanted to have some alpha strike power.Now however, they are completely outclassed by MRM 10s.
Why? Lower spread, MUCH MORE damage per ton (300 vs 215), and much bigger range.I think, that PGI should consider boosting(decreasing spread by like 10%) SRM's in general(since boosing SRM-6 will require boosting SRM-4s) and changing artemis bonus (from -33% spread to -20% spread and like 7% velocity boost).

Consindering that this is the reason behind the minimum range of ATMs... There was the fear, that ATMs would outperform SRMs, which I highly doubt considering the weight, heat, facetime, spread, et cetera. Now we get MRMs which have no minimum range and clearly outperfom SRMs... GG...

[Thomasso]

X Player, on 18 July 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

I will have to comment on the MCII running animations. These appear to be copied straight from the DWF animations. That is a bad thing because while they look ridiculous even on the original, slow, 52 kph max Mech, they do look even more so on a 70+ kph Mech like the MCII. I find this unacceptable and require new animations for this otherwise beautiful Mech as soon as possible.

It's breaking my heart </3

Ahh.. When i saw it yesterday on snek peak stream by NGNGTv I was like... "WTF?!?"
Walking animation for MC MK2 is totally broken :/ It look ridiculous and.. awful.

[Sigmar Sich]

I'm very much excited about this update. I think i'll return to regular play because of it. Drunk runs do not count.. (stopped playing after UI 2.0 update, realising game needs some a lot of time to evolve).

P.S. One thing bugs me - how this war is civil, if FedCom never existed in MWO?
P.P.S. I hope there will be some choise in Civil War events, like subfactions, for example steiners who fight against archon, but still steiners. Would hate to fight for that snake, but would also hate to lose steiner affinity or to not participate..