24 replies to this topic

[DjPush]

There doesn't appear to be any point to it. Everything can detect you now at any range. I have filled parts of the pilot tree to extend the coverage. It doesn't matter. So.. So long ECM. Calling time of death at 17:02 on 8/1/2017.

[JediPanther]

sesmic sensor still op. Also all those targeting computers boosting sensor range suck. Wish I could shove a mk7 tc on my jenner or locust. Never die again to a mech within 900m.

[Alexander of Macedon]

On the other hand, there's this nifty new thing called stealth armor that's an instant no button to hostile locks.

[Suko]

Yeah, nope. At 1.5 tons it's still worth it, if only to keep your Doritos hidden from the enemy hive mind at longer distances. You can strip it off your mech if you want, but I don't see what else you'll be able to put in its place that will be hands-down better on any given map or situation.

Edited by Suko, 01 August 2017 - 03:44 PM.

[Monkey Lover]

You have to get both ecm skill points to make it as good as it used to be or spend tonnage and get stealth armor.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 01 August 2017 - 03:47 PM.

[Baba Yogi]

I think OP forgot to take the ECM nodes in skill tree. Without them you will be detected at 560m, with both, at 200m.

[VitriolicViolet]

i find its still worth it on most mechs that can carry it. my OXP seems to do well still.

[Nik Reaper]

Lordhammer, on 01 August 2017 - 03:48 PM, said:

I think OP forgot to take the ECM nodes in skill tree. Without them you will be detected at 560m, with both, at 200m.

That's before any sensor range enhancements ( nodes, bap, mech quirks ) and a lrm boat will have both ( the quirks goes through them to get target retention and bap to counter close ecm ) , but yes ecm still makes lock on time longer so even that helps, with 2 nodes it's just a bit less than it used to be as most now have inbuilt radar range module ( if they want seismic ) and ecm is % decrease of radar range rather than a fixed range.

Edited by Nik Reaper, 01 August 2017 - 04:02 PM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

ECM is still one of the most useful pieces of equipment in the game. At past 200m your not flashing a big, red "Shoot Me" sign like everyone else and more often than not if there is anything at all else to shoot at WITH the big, red "Shoot Me" sign they will shoot at it and not you. Also I can't count the number of times I have stood motionless in a bush or against some dark backdrop and shoot at and enemy just outside his cone of vision and watch him turn toward me, look right at me and not even see me. I have killed mechs like this on quite a few occasions.

[Wintersdark]

DjPush, on 01 August 2017 - 03:03 PM, said:

There doesn't appear to be any point to it. Everything can detect you now at any range. I have filled parts of the pilot tree to extend the coverage. It doesn't matter. So.. So long ECM. Calling time of death at 17:02 on 8/1/2017.

There's a lot of variety in which sensor tree nodes people have taken, both ECM user and for the guy firing at him.

But even assuming you've taken the nodes yourself, *and* the guy who wants to fire at you took them too, there are only two cases where you actually need ECM to work:

1) You're in a light, and there's a streakboat around
2) Someone wants to hammer you with ATM's.
Note I don't mention LRM's. Because LRM's are trivial to avoid otherwise. Even here, if you're standing out in the open where people can hold a lock on you for that long at range, if all that's coming at you is LRM's you're fine.


In both of these cases, even though they WILL eventually be able to get a lock, getting that lock will take a long time and all you need to do is break LOS for a bit to break that lock. Making it harder to lock onto you reduces the number of volleys you're going to eat... and that may reduce that number to zero, given ATM minimum range.

If someone's got a pair of ATM9's, for example - not a huge boating loadout, just a pair of 9's - that's a solid 54 point hit. If it takes him a couple seconds longer to be able to lock and fire, and I only eat one volley or can move in and out of cover on my approach and eat zero missiles, then that's just wonderful.

Given how cheap ECM is logistically, it's almost always worth taking if you can (with a couple small exceptions in the case of Clam mechs where there's substantially better hardpoint options via omnipods for some builds).

ECM is fine.

[Asym]

the whole point of ECM is lost..... It's not needed in a brawling only game. The skill tree was phase one of the "neutering" of many of the mech lines, the huge increase in light survival as accomplished by the survival skills and the degradation of the lethality of many weapons systems andweapons systems effectveness (ECM included) and the introduction of larger and larger brawling mechs...

I'm not a brawler and it seems my days in MWO are numbered.

[Aggravated Assault Mech]

ECM is fine where it is.

It shouldn't be so powerful that you absolutely must have it.

[El Bandito]

DjPush, on 01 August 2017 - 03:03 PM, said:

There doesn't appear to be any point to it. Everything can detect you now at any range. I have filled parts of the pilot tree to extend the coverage. It doesn't matter. So.. So long ECM. Calling time of death at 17:02 on 8/1/2017.

My Hellbringers disagree.

[Bigbacon]

Still worth it..especially on lights.

[DjPush]

Lordhammer, on 01 August 2017 - 03:48 PM, said:

I think OP forgot to take the ECM nodes in skill tree. Without them you will be detected at 560m, with both, at 200m.

If you had read the 2 lines of text, you would have seen the "I have filled parts of the pilot tree to extend the coverage" statement.

Edited by DjPush, 01 August 2017 - 05:37 PM.

[Jun Watarase]

Its the same tonnage as an AMS except way more useful. The downside is that you need to invest SP into it whereas its easy to get the AMS overload skills just by going into the survival tree, which most people do anyway.

[LT. HARDCASE]

That is a statement full of madness.

[Wintersdark]

Aggravated Assault Mech, on 01 August 2017 - 04:29 PM, said:

ECM is fine where it is.

It shouldn't be so powerful that you absolutely must have it.

I like it where it is, to be honest. I really hated how simply having ECM made a mech good, and you'd be bats**t crazy not to bring it if it were an option. While this made a lot of otherwise poor chassis "good", it also presented a serious problem when actually good chassis got ECM. Became somewhat of a balancing nightmare.

Now, ECM is at a point where if you can take it, you probably want to, but there are many cases where you may elect not to without being crazy or taking a really oddball build. That's a good place to be. Where it's a choice, not a default. Still a strong choice, though - even if that dude will still be able to get a lock, it'll take a long time. That's less damage taken, and THAT is a damn good thing.

[Wintersdark]

Jun Watarase, on 01 August 2017 - 05:58 PM, said:

Its the same tonnage as an AMS except way more useful. The downside is that you need to invest SP into it whereas its easy to get the AMS overload skills just by going into the survival tree, which most people do anyway.

Particularly as if you're tucking into the survival tree, you MUST take either the AMS skills or other utterly useless skills, so it literally costs you nothing. I take AMS skills on every single mech with survival skills, simply because the alternative is equally useless so if I elect to put AMS on, I don't need to respec.

[DaMuchi]

Radar dep plus ecm pretty much makes you impossible to lock onto. You as a pilot don't realise this because it's harder to notice the lack of missiles flying to you and the time the lock took to occur. But any case, even with ecm, you should still play as if you didnt, it's not invisibility, people will still shoot at anything that moves, I don't really know what you are expecting.