39 replies to this topic

[Jackal Noble]

Bombast, on 01 October 2017 - 12:14 PM, said:

But you didn't fix the Grendel? For shame.

i tried like 3-4 times, for some reason I can't get that link to post right.

[Bombast]

JackalBeast, on 01 October 2017 - 01:43 PM, said:

i tried like 3-4 times, for some reason I can't get that link to post right.

The forum automatically cuts off any ')' if its the last symbol in a hyperlink when directly posted, for some reason.

You can get around this by using the 'Link' function in the tool bar (Looks like a chain), either by highlighting text and turning it into a hyperlink, or just putting the link in there (It will then put the complete link in your post, like so).

http://www.sarna.net...ngrel_(Grendel)

Edited by Bombast, 01 October 2017 - 01:47 PM.

[DaZur]

LT. HARDCASE, on 01 October 2017 - 12:42 PM, said:

Go on, stimulate yourself to your heart's content.

You "look at me I don't play meta" nose in the air people are so self important.

Don't assume.. I've got my meta mechs.

That said, I don't live the lie that one has to indebt oneself to the meta on order to have fun.

Yes, I'm "stimulated" by dabbling in my imagination and the fun of the lore and fluff...

You say that like its a bad thing?

[Chados]

I like the Cou-Prime with ATM6x2 and HLLx2 plus a Laser AMS. Scuttle around with the assaults and hide in ground clutter. Though the H with its ECM probably does it better.

[WrathOfDeadguy]

The BA stock pods are pretty terrible unless you want to do something like dual UAC5s on the shoulders (in which case you don't want the missile arms), or a single 10-class AC with some SRMs. Using those juicy high mounts for MGs would be a criminal waste of potential, IMO. The only stock pods on my BA are the legs... I'm running it with the E shoulders and the H head and RA for a 2xHLL+3xERML ECM gigavomit assassin.

The Cougar as a chassis most definitely does not suck... it has its own strengths and weaknesses, and while there is some overlap with the ADR it isn't similar enough to be redundant. The ADR is faster, but still lacks any option for jets or ECM, can't take more than one AMS, and has two fewer tons to work with (not many builds on either will ever run into crit shortages despite all those locked slots). Slow lights are usually best off sticking with the team, and 81-87kph is plenty fast enough to do that. The COU is also better at sidepeeking because of its H and C arm options, whereas the ADR in any configuration only ever has one hardpoint per body part. Consider the ADR to be an uppercut, and the COU a haymaker. There's a right time to break your enemy's face with either one.

[Mole]

I don't know about the Hero Cougar but my Cougar Prime serves admirably.

[Steve Pryde]

Cougar can be nasty but only if u get ignored. It really needs some armor quirks for its slowness, heck its even slower than a max engine Urbanmech!

[Mystere]

LT. HARDCASE, on 01 October 2017 - 12:42 PM, said:

Go on, stimulate yourself to your heart's content.

You "look at me I don't play meta" nose in the air people are so self important.

As opposed to whom, people who insist on 1:1 balance in a game based on an IP specifically known for quite the opposite? <shrugs>

[Natred]

Everything except ecm and jump jets the adder does better..

[Jackal Noble]

Bombast, on 01 October 2017 - 01:47 PM, said:

The forum automatically cuts off any ')' if its the last symbol in a hyperlink when directly posted, for some reason.

You can get around this by using the 'Link' function in the tool bar (Looks like a chain), either by highlighting text and turning it into a hyperlink, or just putting the link in there (It will then put the complete link in your post, like so).

http://www.sarna.net...ngrel_(Grendel)

Ahh thank you.

I R Baboon

[WrathOfDeadguy]

Natred, on 01 October 2017 - 05:03 PM, said:

Everything except ecm and jump jets the adder does better..

Not so.

Full deadside pulsevomit.

Micro brawler.

Alternate micro brawler.

The Cougar has hardpoints and tonnage that the Adder does not have. Many builds that fit and are viable on the Cougar just don't work on the Adder, either because of tonnage, hardpoint count, or hardpoint locations- or all of the above. ECM and jets are not the Cougar's only tricks.

[JediPanther]

JackalBeast, on 01 October 2017 - 11:11 AM, said:

But speed.
But the panther hero..... no wait he sucks too lol. Katana Kat, such a feminine feline.

KK is the best of them. You can lose that dam right arm and still have two lasers and the ct joke srm 2s. I'm pretty good with the kk but its better builds ditch the ct missiles for better lasers and engine. Solo-ed two asns in comp play by just jogging back wards to the wall and laser-ing off their legs. I was shot up but lived.

I'm waiting for the cou-h for c-bills. I see it mostly as an adr which I have the adr-a with the missile omnis. It'll be fun mech to toy with since I've got roughly 15 million to blow on it for parts and weapons.

[Lykaon]

I run my Blood Adder as a mini LRM support platform.

Cougar H head with ECM
Cougar C right arm with Heavy Medium Laser TAG DHS
Cougar prime left arm with Heavy Medium Laser DHS
Cougar prime side torsos with LRM15s 5.5 tons ammo

[FLG 01]

DaZur, on 01 October 2017 - 12:25 PM, said:

Believe it or not... Yes, lore based products are important to a large contingent of this community

I agree 100%. But then why did we get the Cougar and the Uziel?

As Bombast says, there is not much lore on the Cougar. Allow me to present all its appearences in BattleTech novels e.g.:
"He could see flames, whipped by the wind, coming from a blackened pile that had been a Falcon Cougar." [...] "Archer spotted a green-splotched Cougar rush along one flank of the fighting, seeking a target of opportunity. Twisting the Penetrator's torso, he brought his targeting reticle onto the smaller 'Mech. Anger guided his fingers as he fired his large lasers. One shot missed, but the other bore in on the Cougar's leg, which must have been already damaged. The Jade Falcon hopped two steps and fell. The 'Mech was not destroyed, but at least it was out of the fight for a few minutes." (Operation Audacity)

That's it. And you know the sad part? It's still more important than the Uziel. I don't see how lore can be used to defend those Mechs.

[kuma8877]

FLG 01, on 01 October 2017 - 07:36 PM, said:

I agree 100%. But then why did we get the Cougar and the Uziel?

As Bombast says, there is not much lore on the Cougar. Allow me to present all its appearences in BattleTech novels e.g.:
"He could see flames, whipped by the wind, coming from a blackened pile that had been a Falcon Cougar." [...] "Archer spotted a green-splotched Cougar rush along one flank of the fighting, seeking a target of opportunity. Twisting the Penetrator's torso, he brought his targeting reticle onto the smaller 'Mech. Anger guided his fingers as he fired his large lasers. One shot missed, but the other bore in on the Cougar's leg, which must have been already damaged. The Jade Falcon hopped two steps and fell. The 'Mech was not destroyed, but at least it was out of the fight for a few minutes." (Operation Audacity)

That's it. And you know the sad part? It's still more important than the Uziel. I don't see how lore can be used to defend those Mechs.

The Mechwarrior IP has it's own lore within the BT mythos. Exposure to certain chassis there, makes their inclusion important for many players.

Edited by kuma8877, 01 October 2017 - 07:54 PM.

[Bombast]

kuma8877, on 01 October 2017 - 07:53 PM, said:

The Mechwarrior IP has it's own lore within the BT mythos. Exposure to certain chassis there, makes their inclusion important for many players.

The Cougar has no meanignful position in 'Mechwarrior Lore' either, beyond just being playable. Inclusion based on prior inclusion would fall under a 'nostalgia request.'

Which again, I'm not necessarily against. It's why I was happy to see the Bushwacker show up. But lets be honest about it. I'll beg until my face is blue for a Dervish, but I'm not going to lie and say its because of it's key position in the lore.

[Trenchbird]

I would just run quad SRM-6A+ECM and call it a day. I'd be in it for that 30% CB bonus.

[FLG 01]

kuma8877, on 01 October 2017 - 07:53 PM, said:

The Mechwarrior IP has it's own lore within the BT mythos. Exposure to certain chassis there, makes their inclusion important for many players.

The MW-series does not have "its own lore". There is only the BattleTech lore to which video games adhere to varying degrees individually. And if a game deviates from BT-lore it's simply non-canon, no better than fan-fiction (only that fan-fiction often makes more sense).
I get that some people put MW:4 on a pedestal, but that's not about 'lore' at all. Why not be honest and say it's about MW:4 only?

[VorpalMechBunny]

Steve Pryde, on 01 October 2017 - 04:16 PM, said:

Cougar can be nasty but only if u get ignored. It really needs some armor quirks for its slowness, heck its even slower than a max engine Urbanmech!

Basically agree with this. Being as slow as it is seems to be the trade off for having more weapon space, but the geometry makes it super east to get side torsos blown off, sometimes in one hit. Exact hitboxes are something that are PC game specific and feel like they could be compensated for some with either survivability bumps, specifically on the side torsos. I "like" the mech, but across a variety of builds it feels very weak in most games I've played vs. my other mech and other lights specifically due to how easy it gets shredded.

[DaZur]

Bombast, on 01 October 2017 - 12:36 PM, said:

The Cougar kind of fails the lore test too, though - It's an unimportant mech, known for pretty much nothing. Even it's TRO entry is boring as hell, its only notable feature being that it's an unabashed copy of another mech. It's even more redundant than the "And Now With No Aspartame!" IIC mechs.

The only reason to include the Cougar is to appease a nostalgia need, which apparently there was, as small as it may have been. Personally, I don't generally have a problem with that, but something else really was needed, and there were other options that would have been more interesting.

FLG 01, on 01 October 2017 - 07:36 PM, said:

I agree 100%. But then why did we get the Cougar and the Uziel?

As Bombast says, there is not much lore on the Cougar. Allow me to present all its appearences in BattleTech novels e.g.:
"He could see flames, whipped by the wind, coming from a blackened pile that had been a Falcon Cougar." [...] "Archer spotted a green-splotched Cougar rush along one flank of the fighting, seeking a target of opportunity. Twisting the Penetrator's torso, he brought his targeting reticle onto the smaller 'Mech. Anger guided his fingers as he fired his large lasers. One shot missed, but the other bore in on the Cougar's leg, which must have been already damaged. The Jade Falcon hopped two steps and fell. The 'Mech was not destroyed, but at least it was out of the fight for a few minutes." (Operation Audacity)

That's it. And you know the sad part? It's still more important than the Uziel. I don't see how lore can be used to defend those Mechs.

To be honest "lore" and "fluff" can be distilled from the actual IP, the novels that use it as a vehicle, the (albeit sometime skewed) nostalgia of previous MW iterations... Or quite frankly, the exaggerated fragments of one's imagination. The reality is, for many players, like myself, the IP and our memories of it regardless of its origin, is what keeps us here... I mean aside from mech on mech gratification.

N0ni, on 01 October 2017 - 01:29 PM, said:

If min/maxing the most efficient way to take a mech out of the game is defined as a "meta crutch", i'll be happy to use that any day of the week while others continue to give themselves an unnecessary challenge making use of terrible hardpoints. Nothing against anyone that does that for fun, but if you do it just to be "anti-meta" then you can't really complain when you get taken out by someone better equipped.

There is nothing wrong with "meta"... Meta is a given constant when the shallow end goal is to inflict the most damage and rack up the most kills. The issue with min/max and using "meta" synonymously is when players are brainwashed into believing it's the only ends to a means.

Believe it or not... There are more players like myself who seek challenge and revel when we can be relatively competitive while using marginal mechs that one might think. And yes... I quite often find myself losing to a player with superior equipment. That said, it's so flipping enjoyable when you best a player despite their superior equipment.

Makes one wonder about the inferred prowess of some of these elite players... Is it the man (woman) or the equipment they lean on?

Edited by DaZur, 02 October 2017 - 06:31 PM.