I recently returned to the game to try out the new tech and skill trees. As I own a good number of both clan and IS mechs across all weight tiers, I didn't find myself all that impressed with the new toys or possible configurations. Being most dissappointed by the RAC system, I decided to start looking for alternative "damage stream" options.
It was on that whim that I stumbled across the MLX-G. For its weight, it's not a very fast light mech, but has the benefit of being extremely small, and capable of sharp direction changes rather quickly, not to mention a solid JJ system. What makes this little guy shine however, is it's 8 ballistic slots. I myself pile in 8x C-MG's, 4x micro er lasers, and 3 and a half tons of ammo. The end result is 49.6 damage rating, and when skilled, a workable range of 150m~.
This build excels at stripping components. In a decent game, not even a "good" one, it's nothing to net 6-8. My personal best in this mech was 13 IIRC. While this mech is definately a shredder, it excels against other lights and most mediums. The only "light" that seems to present any trouble 1v1 is the Urbanmech. In the end though, even Urbies will turn and attempt escape, only to die tired.
It needs noting that my skill tree is heavily firepower/survival oriented. So I'm toting the max armor/structure I can on the little beast. The rest of the points are in jump jets and auxillery, just for the added manuverability/utility.
The only downside of this build, and is only applicable when in poor position, is the face time you have to endure because of the MG's. Thankfully, the little guy can take some hits and keep on rolling. Honestly, at this point in time, I've been so spoiled by the MLX-G that I can't play anything else effectively.
In closing, I can't recommend the MLX-G enough. Agility, toughness, and buldging epeen! Go out and get yourself one today, and experience the revolution.
2
The Mist Lynx, Mlx-G
Started by Nava LaCrosse, Oct 08 2017 10:34 AM
20 replies to this topic
#1
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Posted 08 October 2017 - 10:34 AM
#2
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 08 October 2017 - 06:03 PM
Yeah, that thing has been the bane of many a players' existence ever since it dropped...
Edited by CFC Conky, 08 October 2017 - 06:04 PM.
#3
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Posted 10 October 2017 - 10:50 AM
Having made it further into tier 3 since I made this thread, and encountering more players that can actually shoot. I've come to a conclusion after some testing. People either really, really hate enemy MLX-G, or far less likely, have a personal grudge against me in particular.
The moment I show up on radar, it seems the call goes out to focus my MLX down asap. I'm not kidding when I say it's common to see a third to half the team change targets and try to bust me down. If nothing else, it does make life interesting on maps like polar and plexus. Open spaces and LRM rain have become the bane of my existence.
Obviously, my first responce was to counter this counter. Thing is, I love my MLX-G build, and wasn't willing to sacrifice anything for either AMS or ECM. Thankfully, there is the arctic cheetah prime varient with omni E arms. It's a downgrade in firepower, as you only get 2 lasers and 6 ballistics. You do however get a speed boost and ECM, with kinda compareable toughness, if a somewhat larger stature.
It's possible I just haven't found the arctic's rythym yet, but even with ECM and the boosted speed, I still go down just as fast, if not faster. It also feels as though I don't accomplsih as much in the uptime that I do have. The only noticeable benefit I felt in the arctic was a reduction in LRM rain. However, as arctic's have been out forever, and given their increased size over the MLX, it seems they attract laser and ballistic fire like magnets.
In the end, my counter to the MLX's counter didn't pan out. So, here's the question. When you end up on maps like polar or plexus while in an MLX-G, any suggestions on how to stay relevent for the entire match? Note: sticking to your assaults bum and waiting for the last few minutes of brawling to become relevent doesn't qualify.
The moment I show up on radar, it seems the call goes out to focus my MLX down asap. I'm not kidding when I say it's common to see a third to half the team change targets and try to bust me down. If nothing else, it does make life interesting on maps like polar and plexus. Open spaces and LRM rain have become the bane of my existence.
Obviously, my first responce was to counter this counter. Thing is, I love my MLX-G build, and wasn't willing to sacrifice anything for either AMS or ECM. Thankfully, there is the arctic cheetah prime varient with omni E arms. It's a downgrade in firepower, as you only get 2 lasers and 6 ballistics. You do however get a speed boost and ECM, with kinda compareable toughness, if a somewhat larger stature.
It's possible I just haven't found the arctic's rythym yet, but even with ECM and the boosted speed, I still go down just as fast, if not faster. It also feels as though I don't accomplsih as much in the uptime that I do have. The only noticeable benefit I felt in the arctic was a reduction in LRM rain. However, as arctic's have been out forever, and given their increased size over the MLX, it seems they attract laser and ballistic fire like magnets.
In the end, my counter to the MLX's counter didn't pan out. So, here's the question. When you end up on maps like polar or plexus while in an MLX-G, any suggestions on how to stay relevent for the entire match? Note: sticking to your assaults bum and waiting for the last few minutes of brawling to become relevent doesn't qualify.
#4
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 10 October 2017 - 11:58 AM
Hi Nava,
I don't run lights too often but I do play the Blackjacks a lot. They can go pretty fast but are squishy so I will often play the 'fireman' for the team. I runback and forth along in second line and try to add some firepower to engaged friendly engaged mechs. I'm sure the assault mechs appreciate cover from enemy lights too. By staying in second line you become less significant to the enemy and an active defence is usually more effective than hiding behind your teamates.
This won't guarantee you'll win or even survive but at least you are doing something and you might find yourself in an advantageous position.
Good hunting,
CFC Conky
I don't run lights too often but I do play the Blackjacks a lot. They can go pretty fast but are squishy so I will often play the 'fireman' for the team. I runback and forth along in second line and try to add some firepower to engaged friendly engaged mechs. I'm sure the assault mechs appreciate cover from enemy lights too. By staying in second line you become less significant to the enemy and an active defence is usually more effective than hiding behind your teamates.
This won't guarantee you'll win or even survive but at least you are doing something and you might find yourself in an advantageous position.
Good hunting,
CFC Conky
Edited by CFC Conky, 10 October 2017 - 11:59 AM.
#5
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- The Bloodlust
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Posted 10 October 2017 - 12:07 PM
It's not that they have a grudge, it's just as you get into the higher tiers you'll find players who know that your loadout is a late game terror so they make sure you don't make it into the late game without some damage. They also know that 8 machineguns means you have weak arms; they don't need to kill you they just need to take off at least one of your arms to make you less of a threat.
You can try running the MLX-A right arm instead of the MLX-G. You lose 2 ballistic hardpoints but you gain a 15% MG ROF quirk (letting your 6 guns act like 6.9) and 24 armour to the arm to make it harder to pop off. You should also get Radar Deprivation on the skill tree to reduce the time LRM boats can lock on to you.
If you get tired of machineguns you can always try an ERPPC and ECM. Before the hero and the MLX-G this was a fun, annoying build but forced you to shave down the armour a touch more that most people liked because you had to put the ERPPC in the arm. Now with it moved to the torso you can remove the armour of the dead arm and keep the important parts maxed out.
You can try running the MLX-A right arm instead of the MLX-G. You lose 2 ballistic hardpoints but you gain a 15% MG ROF quirk (letting your 6 guns act like 6.9) and 24 armour to the arm to make it harder to pop off. You should also get Radar Deprivation on the skill tree to reduce the time LRM boats can lock on to you.
If you get tired of machineguns you can always try an ERPPC and ECM. Before the hero and the MLX-G this was a fun, annoying build but forced you to shave down the armour a touch more that most people liked because you had to put the ERPPC in the arm. Now with it moved to the torso you can remove the armour of the dead arm and keep the important parts maxed out.
#6
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Posted 10 October 2017 - 02:29 PM
Thank you both for your input.
On maps or battlefronts where I don't have a safe/intelligent path to enemies, I too try to stay second line and flank or light hunt. I'll freely admit however that patience in general is one of my weakest qualities. I get bored fast, and then I get stupid, just to be doing something. I'm not a fan of the "peek-a-boo" playstyle that's taking over. (*1200m out: Fire ERLL/ERPPC**Duck behind cover* "Yea, punk! Take that! Whatcha gonna do now with that scratched paint?! Man, I am so awesome. Btw, LRM boats suck! Die horribly you noskill cowards!") /end ironic sarcasm. Sorry, back to topic.
As for picking up Radar Dep, I completely spaced on that option. I went ahead and fixed that, so my next few games will let me know if it has made the difference I needed, or if more alterations are in order. Again though, thank you both, and I'll put your advice to work.
On maps or battlefronts where I don't have a safe/intelligent path to enemies, I too try to stay second line and flank or light hunt. I'll freely admit however that patience in general is one of my weakest qualities. I get bored fast, and then I get stupid, just to be doing something. I'm not a fan of the "peek-a-boo" playstyle that's taking over. (*1200m out: Fire ERLL/ERPPC**Duck behind cover* "Yea, punk! Take that! Whatcha gonna do now with that scratched paint?! Man, I am so awesome. Btw, LRM boats suck! Die horribly you noskill cowards!") /end ironic sarcasm. Sorry, back to topic.
As for picking up Radar Dep, I completely spaced on that option. I went ahead and fixed that, so my next few games will let me know if it has made the difference I needed, or if more alterations are in order. Again though, thank you both, and I'll put your advice to work.
Edited by Nava LaCrosse, 10 October 2017 - 02:41 PM.
#7
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 10 October 2017 - 02:58 PM
So fragile, so fragile mist linx are...
#8
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- Shredder
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Posted 10 October 2017 - 03:30 PM
As you move up in tier the machine guns become less and less effective as people start aiming better, calling out enemy targets when they attempt to flank, and bring builds more able to remove light mechs.
Generally speaking once you get up to the top levels the Wolfhound actually becomes the top light in the game, as seen in the World Tournament. Being able to fire 36 damage all at once at around 250m and then being able to get away makes it a tough opponent and nearly unbeatable for any other lights.
The machine gun lights are generally pretty fun, and they can be decent, but they do just get harder to use over time. In general my Wolfhound does about 3 times better than my machine gun Cheetah. This coming from tier 1.
Generally speaking once you get up to the top levels the Wolfhound actually becomes the top light in the game, as seen in the World Tournament. Being able to fire 36 damage all at once at around 250m and then being able to get away makes it a tough opponent and nearly unbeatable for any other lights.
The machine gun lights are generally pretty fun, and they can be decent, but they do just get harder to use over time. In general my Wolfhound does about 3 times better than my machine gun Cheetah. This coming from tier 1.
#9
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Posted 12 October 2017 - 12:50 PM
Thank you, Dakota, you made me think enough that I did go out and buy a wolfhound.
As of yet, I haven't tried it in a real game setting, just against target dummies in training mode. I went with the xl engine/mpl option. Despite the low burn time of the lasers, it's still quite hard for me to keep my damage where I want it while moving. It's also a different playstyle than I'm used to. That alpha heat forces you to take your best shot or two, then duck and hide for cool off. If I were a better shot, that wouldn't be much of a problem. (I had a humilitating game last night where my CTF was absolutely hounded to death by a couple assassins on Caustic. I managed to get off one good alpha shot. >.> They were using the above method to great effect.)
On a positive note, that pinpoint pop of damage is really quite nice, more so with the fairly quick cooldown of the lasers. However, my love of machine gun builds is largely due to my inability to pin point aim unless at a decent distance, generally 400m+. I've turned my mouse sensitivity down and followed all the other "better aim" suggestions, but I'm guessing my lack of patience and getting discouraged by my own poor performance keeps me from putting in the actual time and practice to get better.
Anyways, I do have a question relating to the wolfhound 2, I dropped the engine size down to a xl 265, which gave me an extra DHS for 7kph. It doesn't sound like much, but it allowed me two to three more alphas before heat became a worry. With the xl engine, I know the concept is to hit and run, quickly as possible. Yet, that extra damage is very, very nice. I'll admit though, that the mech did feel sluggish at only 122 kph. Anyone have any thoughts as to which might be kinder to train with given my poor aim?
As of yet, I haven't tried it in a real game setting, just against target dummies in training mode. I went with the xl engine/mpl option. Despite the low burn time of the lasers, it's still quite hard for me to keep my damage where I want it while moving. It's also a different playstyle than I'm used to. That alpha heat forces you to take your best shot or two, then duck and hide for cool off. If I were a better shot, that wouldn't be much of a problem. (I had a humilitating game last night where my CTF was absolutely hounded to death by a couple assassins on Caustic. I managed to get off one good alpha shot. >.> They were using the above method to great effect.)
On a positive note, that pinpoint pop of damage is really quite nice, more so with the fairly quick cooldown of the lasers. However, my love of machine gun builds is largely due to my inability to pin point aim unless at a decent distance, generally 400m+. I've turned my mouse sensitivity down and followed all the other "better aim" suggestions, but I'm guessing my lack of patience and getting discouraged by my own poor performance keeps me from putting in the actual time and practice to get better.
Anyways, I do have a question relating to the wolfhound 2, I dropped the engine size down to a xl 265, which gave me an extra DHS for 7kph. It doesn't sound like much, but it allowed me two to three more alphas before heat became a worry. With the xl engine, I know the concept is to hit and run, quickly as possible. Yet, that extra damage is very, very nice. I'll admit though, that the mech did feel sluggish at only 122 kph. Anyone have any thoughts as to which might be kinder to train with given my poor aim?
#10
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 12 October 2017 - 03:00 PM
CFC Conky, on 08 October 2017 - 06:03 PM, said:
Yeah, that thing has been the bane of many a players' existence ever since it dropped...
Not it has not.. its been mostly useless until the last patch when they introduced the weapons
they gave the linx a new model... The g (which gave the G arms to the rest)
and the 8 mg linx was born.. and the mistlnx has reentered the feild...
Ive had the prime and mastered that for years now.. It was pushed back in to the corner of my drop ship and stripped.. cause it was of no value, now on the other hand its a very effective light mech...
Edited by Burning2nd, 12 October 2017 - 03:00 PM.
#11
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- The Bloodlust
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Posted 12 October 2017 - 03:05 PM
Burning2nd, on 12 October 2017 - 03:00 PM, said:
Not it has not.. its been mostly useless until the last patch when they introduced the weapons
they gave the linx a new model... The g (which gave the G arms to the rest)
and the 8 mg linx was born.. and the mistlnx has reentered the feild...
Ive had the prime and mastered that for years now.. It was pushed back in to the corner of my drop ship and stripped.. cause it was of no value, now on the other hand its a very effective light mech...
He was referring to the MLX-G, not the Mist Lynx in general.
#12
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 13 October 2017 - 03:08 AM
yeah the whole thread is only reliant to the G
#13
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- Shredder
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Posted 13 October 2017 - 03:55 AM
Nava LaCrosse, on 12 October 2017 - 12:50 PM, said:
Thank you, Dakota, you made me think enough that I did go out and buy a wolfhound.
As of yet, I haven't tried it in a real game setting, just against target dummies in training mode. I went with the xl engine/mpl option. Despite the low burn time of the lasers, it's still quite hard for me to keep my damage where I want it while moving. It's also a different playstyle than I'm used to. That alpha heat forces you to take your best shot or two, then duck and hide for cool off. If I were a better shot, that wouldn't be much of a problem. (I had a humilitating game last night where my CTF was absolutely hounded to death by a couple assassins on Caustic. I managed to get off one good alpha shot. >.> They were using the above method to great effect.)
On a positive note, that pinpoint pop of damage is really quite nice, more so with the fairly quick cooldown of the lasers. However, my love of machine gun builds is largely due to my inability to pin point aim unless at a decent distance, generally 400m+. I've turned my mouse sensitivity down and followed all the other "better aim" suggestions, but I'm guessing my lack of patience and getting discouraged by my own poor performance keeps me from putting in the actual time and practice to get better.
Anyways, I do have a question relating to the wolfhound 2, I dropped the engine size down to a xl 265, which gave me an extra DHS for 7kph. It doesn't sound like much, but it allowed me two to three more alphas before heat became a worry. With the xl engine, I know the concept is to hit and run, quickly as possible. Yet, that extra damage is very, very nice. I'll admit though, that the mech did feel sluggish at only 122 kph. Anyone have any thoughts as to which might be kinder to train with given my poor aim?
As of yet, I haven't tried it in a real game setting, just against target dummies in training mode. I went with the xl engine/mpl option. Despite the low burn time of the lasers, it's still quite hard for me to keep my damage where I want it while moving. It's also a different playstyle than I'm used to. That alpha heat forces you to take your best shot or two, then duck and hide for cool off. If I were a better shot, that wouldn't be much of a problem. (I had a humilitating game last night where my CTF was absolutely hounded to death by a couple assassins on Caustic. I managed to get off one good alpha shot. >.> They were using the above method to great effect.)
On a positive note, that pinpoint pop of damage is really quite nice, more so with the fairly quick cooldown of the lasers. However, my love of machine gun builds is largely due to my inability to pin point aim unless at a decent distance, generally 400m+. I've turned my mouse sensitivity down and followed all the other "better aim" suggestions, but I'm guessing my lack of patience and getting discouraged by my own poor performance keeps me from putting in the actual time and practice to get better.
Anyways, I do have a question relating to the wolfhound 2, I dropped the engine size down to a xl 265, which gave me an extra DHS for 7kph. It doesn't sound like much, but it allowed me two to three more alphas before heat became a worry. With the xl engine, I know the concept is to hit and run, quickly as possible. Yet, that extra damage is very, very nice. I'll admit though, that the mech did feel sluggish at only 122 kph. Anyone have any thoughts as to which might be kinder to train with given my poor aim?
The build does reward good aim very well, getting to that point might be difficult though. I'd recommend playing the mech with support of your team, this way you won't be the one getting focused on, which will allow you time to peek out of cover, stop for a moment, take a shot on the enemy, and get back behind cover. Alternatively if the enemy you are attacking doesn't have support you can run up behind him to perform a pincer maneuver with your ally.
With the skill tree upgrades I have on it I can get off 3 alpha strikes before having to cool off. Usually I'll attack enemies who are in areas with dense cover, the city of crimson straight or the rocky area of river city as an example, from there I can shoot at an enemy and get behind cover then repeat it 3 times and then run off to cool. Many enemies will be dead by the third alpha if I pick my targets out well, otherwise I break off to cool just to repeat at the next opportunity.
The extra DHS is pretty useful, especially if you're only losing 7 kph over it, its really up to the pilot, usually they're fine if they go over 120kph. I'm honestly just using the XL280 because I had it sitting around. I'd recommend giving yourself a bit of time to get used to how the Wolfhound handles and focusing on making your shots count. You can try running the Gauntlet in the training academy, it will spawn mechs along your path, your goal is to get through without dying, but you can also fire back, good training for shooting at things while moving and trying to not die.
#14
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- Little Helper
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Posted 02 November 2017 - 04:59 PM
Just bought mine yesterday, and I’m good with its survivability so far (I main Locust, so having jj even with much slower max speed is a real boon).
Unlike most, I run Flamers and HMG. Face time is not nearly as much of a problem when the enemy is shutdown.
Being able to force enemies to turn around is a real advantage for your team, even if you don’t get any score to show for it. As for me, I just play spotter in that type of situation, and hopefully be able to draw out some poor sods into an ambush.
Unlike most, I run Flamers and HMG. Face time is not nearly as much of a problem when the enemy is shutdown.
Being able to force enemies to turn around is a real advantage for your team, even if you don’t get any score to show for it. As for me, I just play spotter in that type of situation, and hopefully be able to draw out some poor sods into an ambush.
#15
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- 351 posts
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Posted 02 November 2017 - 10:07 PM
I could literally write pages of pages about the Mist Lynx but regarding this:
Pilots who see what you're running are going to know how to take you out. Everyone likes to use all four lasers but I can't recommend just two ER Mediums in the torso enough. Gives great range, damage, and longevity for a match. So that's one counter - pack a punch in your torso mounts to outlast the loss of your arms. A second point to make here is that you can counter their counter with another counter: YOU ARE WALKING JUMPING SQUISHY BAIT. Stay in communication with your team and flank when they push. Folks will trip over themselves trying to nail you for the easy kill and because you're potentially very dangerous while you keep dancing and spin-jumping between them. Don't focus on one target at first - spray as many with your MGs as possible to turn as many heads as you can. It's chaos and your jump jets and agility will let you thrive in it. Do this for a bit and then disengage... and then do it again. Don't have a good setup for doing that or don't have a team that's ready for a push? It's okay - put 8-10pts of armor on your back and squirrel a bit. Literally making your presence known (the ER Medium range is good for this, as well as shooting down those UAVs and turrets, etc.) will probably set the Reds into a predictable set of behavior just based on the fact that they know someone's just waiting in the wings for their juicy components.
I can't speak to T1 or FP but I'm T3 and play QuickPlay almost exclusively and these strategies rarely let me down. The number one feature the MLX had going for it was that everyone dismissed it as low-priority. Now we've got this option to boat MGs and people are crying about 'MG OP!' and 'MG MLX = easy mode!' Use that reputation as bait, my friend. Let them think they know how to destroy you and then show them what they didn't know - a good Lynx pilot is *never* predictable.
Even he doesn't know what he's going to do until he does it!
#mistlynx4life
Quote
So, here's the question. When you end up on maps like polar or plexus while in an MLX-G, any suggestions on how to stay relevent for the entire match?
Pilots who see what you're running are going to know how to take you out. Everyone likes to use all four lasers but I can't recommend just two ER Mediums in the torso enough. Gives great range, damage, and longevity for a match. So that's one counter - pack a punch in your torso mounts to outlast the loss of your arms. A second point to make here is that you can counter their counter with another counter: YOU ARE WALKING JUMPING SQUISHY BAIT. Stay in communication with your team and flank when they push. Folks will trip over themselves trying to nail you for the easy kill and because you're potentially very dangerous while you keep dancing and spin-jumping between them. Don't focus on one target at first - spray as many with your MGs as possible to turn as many heads as you can. It's chaos and your jump jets and agility will let you thrive in it. Do this for a bit and then disengage... and then do it again. Don't have a good setup for doing that or don't have a team that's ready for a push? It's okay - put 8-10pts of armor on your back and squirrel a bit. Literally making your presence known (the ER Medium range is good for this, as well as shooting down those UAVs and turrets, etc.) will probably set the Reds into a predictable set of behavior just based on the fact that they know someone's just waiting in the wings for their juicy components.
I can't speak to T1 or FP but I'm T3 and play QuickPlay almost exclusively and these strategies rarely let me down. The number one feature the MLX had going for it was that everyone dismissed it as low-priority. Now we've got this option to boat MGs and people are crying about 'MG OP!' and 'MG MLX = easy mode!' Use that reputation as bait, my friend. Let them think they know how to destroy you and then show them what they didn't know - a good Lynx pilot is *never* predictable.
Even he doesn't know what he's going to do until he does it!
#mistlynx4life
#16
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- Liquid Metal
- 126 posts
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Posted 08 April 2018 - 06:08 AM
In T1 people don't tend to chase but will focus at any given opportunity. You'll get something ripped off fast with Dual Gauss/erppcs but as far as chasing doesn't hardly happen. But this opens up another opportunity to play the MLX G even more light and annoyingly. Flamers to cook your big buddies targets/stripping weapons and not giving them the ability to return fire. Use the battle buddy system, find something scary.. fight next to it as the not scary thing and rack up that damage. Just be aware of 2nd line mechs that will probably take pot shots at the harrasser mechs. All part of the fun and flow of the game.
#17
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- Survivor
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Posted 19 May 2019 - 06:11 PM
I've had more fun in this thing than I care to admit to.
If you just gotta have ECM when you brawl
Or we can ditch that ECM for an extra MPL
Now we're cooking with gas.
Who needs ecm? It's a crutch. Turn aggression to 11.
Honorable mention to this build, which I haven't played yet, but is too cute.
Switch to (s)srms as you see fit.
If you just gotta have ECM when you brawl
Or we can ditch that ECM for an extra MPL
Now we're cooking with gas.
Who needs ecm? It's a crutch. Turn aggression to 11.
Honorable mention to this build, which I haven't played yet, but is too cute.
Switch to (s)srms as you see fit.
#18
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- Survivor
- 305 posts
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Posted 19 May 2019 - 06:24 PM
Apologies for not having my armor balanced earlier, the dual streak 2's have a higher dps per ton (shorter cycle time) than a single ssrm4. The micros synchronize with the mgs nicely.
Or ditch the micros for an armor bonus.
more survivable, better armor balance.
Or ditch the micros for an armor bonus.
more survivable, better armor balance.
#19
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- Liquid Metal
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Posted 19 May 2019 - 09:53 PM
Necroes a Year or Two old MLX-G thread and posts not so MLX-G stuff on it...
#20
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- Survivor
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Posted 21 May 2019 - 02:15 PM
All but the first one use a G arm, I've been tearing up reds with a powerful will with the 3mpl/4lmg build I posted. If it's got a G arm, it still counts, right?
Getting tired of running out of that 1/2 ton of ammo though.
Getting tired of running out of that 1/2 ton of ammo though.
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