32 replies to this topic

[arcana75]

Let's spread the message to embrace a kinder version of teamwork. If you are rushing towards a neutral capture and your team mate is mere seconds behind you, wait for him to catch up then enter the area with enough time for your team mate to earn the cb/xp award for Capture Base.

A little bit goes a long way

[SteelMantis]

Sorry, but I`m not going out of my way to help teammates score more C-bills. Especially in a scenario like this that could result in the team losing by seconds or make me late to a critical fight.

Just keep playing, in time you will have more C-bills and xp than you need.

[Paigan]

Uhm, what?

First of all:
First kill, then cap. Something like 9 out of 10 conquest matches are decided via kills and the winning team is just (re)capping everything. Yes, conquest is just 90% skirmish with a side objective.
So as a general rule of thumb, everyone capping that is not the single fastest/weakest light in the team or that went that way anyway is more hurting than helping the team.

Second:
Those few CB you get from a few cap ticks more are so insignificantly tiny that even opening this thread is a waste in comparisons.
There are regular events that SH*T MILLIONS of CB over you just for playing a few matches that you probably would have, anyway.
Everyone who struggles to have enough CBs is doing something terribly wrong in this game. E.g. constantly buying and selling stuff (= destroying money, about the only way possible in this game) or being locked in primitive collector drives and trying to buy ALL Mechs there are.

Edited by Paigan, 24 October 2017 - 04:14 AM.

[Bombast]

Time is one of the most valuable resources in this game. So no, don't wait, get it over with.

Edited by Bombast, 24 October 2017 - 04:45 AM.

[R0gal D0rn]

No ofense, but even in tier 1 we have people going to cap... In an Anihilator...

As Paigan said... First fight, then cap. Kill mechs and win the match will give more rewards to the entire team.

C bills come alone just shooting stuff, there is any complicated economy behind the game...

[TWIAFU]

arcana75, on 24 October 2017 - 03:18 AM, said:

Let's spread the message to embrace a kinder version of teamwork. If you are rushing towards a neutral capture and your team mate is mere seconds behind you, wait for him to catch up then enter the area with enough time for your team mate to earn the cb/xp award for Capture Base.

A little bit goes a long way

It's combat, I have no time to consider kindness to teammates and niceties.

[LordNothing]

Tirant Lo Blanc, on 24 October 2017 - 05:26 AM, said:

No ofense, but even in tier 1 we have people going to cap... In an Anihilator...

As Paigan said... First fight, then cap. Kill mechs and win the match will give more rewards to the entire team.

C bills come alone just shooting stuff, there is any complicated economy behind the game...

its still good practice to get a couple caps in just so you dont have to worry about them right away to give you more time to conduct the fight. with some caps it gives you an opportunity to take out the enemy team's light mechs which renders capping even less of an issue and frees everyone up for combat. even if 9 out of 10 end by killing the other team, no need to loose the 10th game.

Edited by LordNothing, 24 October 2017 - 06:00 AM.

[Bombast]

Tirant Lo Blanc, on 24 October 2017 - 05:26 AM, said:

No ofense, but even in tier 1 we have people going to cap... In an Anihilator...

Honestly, I don't have much regard for the average Annihilator mechwarrior...

[LordNothing]

Bombast, on 24 October 2017 - 06:01 AM, said:

Honestly, I don't have much regard for the average Annihilator mechwarrior...

annihilator is a terrible mech for any top tier combat. its mostly a novelty that quickly grows old. essentially its a worse dire whale. unless by some miracle you can get it into range of the enemy without getting squirrel farmed or lermed to death between cover. if you do encounter combat, you get to be a primary target.

Edited by LordNothing, 24 October 2017 - 06:06 AM.

[Bombast]

LordNothing, on 24 October 2017 - 06:04 AM, said:

annihilator is a terrible mech for any top tier combat. its mostly a novelty that quickly grows old. essentially its a worse dire whale. unless by some miracle you can get it into range of the enemy without getting squirrel farmed or lermed to death between cover. if you do encounter combat, you get to be a primary target.

Pretty much. Made even worse because half of the Annihilators in QP are running minimum engines, and even the ones max show up late to the fight on even the smallest map. Anyone running an Annihilator has basically decided in the mechlab that they don't want any control over the fight or map.

And don't get me started on the Annihilator's that have the audacity of complaining about getting 'left behind by the team' when their chugging along at 30 something km/h and even their assault buddies have left them behind. Useless sacks of...

[James Argent]

Everybody on your team gets more C-Bills for a selfish win than for a courteous loss.

[Verilligo]

James Argent, on 24 October 2017 - 06:15 AM, said:

Everybody on your team gets more C-Bills for a selfish win than for a courteous loss.

This is technically true, in that the whole team will gain more C-bills on a win than a loss because you can only cram so many mechs onto a point. In practice, it's also true because as everyone else has mentioned, those few seconds of extra cap time or to get away from a point and to a fight can matter. However, first cap is worth 4500 C-bills per point. A win is worth 35000, a loss is worth 10000. Per mech, if you manage to do first cap on 3 points, you'll roughly break even on a loss versus if you hadn't gotten any first caps and won. If you cap 4 or 5 points, you'll earn a fair bit more on a loss than on a win.

Of course, if you win AND get one or two first caps, you'll make even more than all 5 first caps and losing. The situation Arcana is describing is something more like this. It's not a matter of the next mech behind you being 10 seconds away from being able to get a first cap, it's them being 2-3 seconds. Usually that means a light mech waiting up for the team's fast mediums. In which case... if we really want to be courteous as the light mech... we'd actually ditch capping that point altogether so we can get to the next point in line faster, which is likely to be more heavily contested. If we can gain THAT point before the enemy, then skirmish around it to keep them from gaining timer on it, the team will overall be better off because more people will have had a first cap and we'll also be more likely to win the fight.

Of course that falls apart a bit in cases where the heavily contested point suddenly gets swarmed with either lights or a light-killing medium, but in that instance your best bet is to just bug out. And naturally, if the team doesn't play well together in the first place, your score was likely doomed before you even started.

[Mystere]

TWIAFU, on 24 October 2017 - 05:31 AM, said:

It's combat, I have no time to consider kindness to teammates and niceties to the enemy.

FTFY, given I think you've mixed up a few things.

[James Argent]

'First cap' rewards end up being slight compensation for fast mechs having to sacrifice a lot of their potential fighting time to cap, back cap, and recap points. A lot is asked of fast mechs in Conquest for little return compared to other modes...if you want the C-Bills for capping, feel free to play a faster mech.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

In QP: you should generally only be capping if it's on the way to the fight and you are in a fast mech. Otherwise, kill them all and worry about capping later. There are exceptions, but it's a good rule to follow...

In FW: the idea of waiting even 1 extra second to cap would be even more absurd.....as in FW the match is always decided by cap points and can be very close.

[Jack Booted Thug]

When you hear your teammates at the start of a conquest match discussing capping order and which lances are headed to different points....


It's over. Unless it's that rare match where the other team is equally full of terribads..

[SFC174]

Jack Booted Thug, on 24 October 2017 - 09:07 AM, said:

When you hear your teammates at the start of a conquest match discussing capping order and which lances are headed to different points....


It's over. Unless it's that rare match where the other team is equally full of terribads..

I think its pretty important to direct Charlie (and usually Bravo) lance to avoid close caps and move toward the expected location of the fighting (usually Theta). I also ask Alpha to pick up the 2 easy caps before rejoining the team. Doesn't always work, but most of the time it keeps the slow guys from making bad choices early.

[Jack Booted Thug]

SFC174, on 24 October 2017 - 09:18 AM, said:

I think its pretty important to direct Charlie (and usually Bravo) lance to avoid close caps and move toward the expected location of the fighting (usually Theta). I also ask Alpha to pick up the 2 easy caps before rejoining the team. Doesn't always work, but most of the time it keeps the slow guys from making bad choices early.

When lances are splitting up to go cap... it's generally over. Sending the fastest mech for a close cap point on certain maps is fine, but it doesn't take all 4. The other 3 should be headed to the best strategic location to engage with the rest of the team.

Lances splitting up equals loss most of the time.

[Magnus Santini]

I agree with the OP as long as it is seriously just leaving them a couple of seconds of red light and then back to the fight. Because a light mech arranging his heavy hitters to be sitting longer at the rear capture point so he can rush theta and meet vipers, assassins, etc., is suicidal. Streak stormcrows, that too. EDIT: fresh linebackers woo hoo!

Edited by Magnus Santini, 24 October 2017 - 10:54 AM.

[Fox With A Shotgun]

LordNothing, on 24 October 2017 - 06:00 AM, said:

its still good practice to get a couple caps in just so you dont have to worry about them right away to give you more time to conduct the fight. with some caps it gives you an opportunity to take out the enemy team's light mechs which renders capping even less of an issue and frees everyone up for combat. even if 9 out of 10 end by killing the other team, no need to loose the 10th game.

Yup.

Most maps have two 'natural' caps for each team, plus Theta. The only two maps that I'm aware of that doesn't follow this pattern are Crimson Straits (Epsilon is really isolated from both teams, while Kappa + Sigma are really easy to capture for the island-side team) and Grim Plexus (one team has good access to three capture points, while the other side only has access to one). The key point is to minimise the chance of a cap win by the enemy team by making sure the point gain rate difference is really small. The natural caps usually lead towards a fight anyway, or if they don't, they're easily accessible by Alpha lance.

As for the OP, nope. The gain from a first cap is really minimal anyway, so there's not much lost. Waiting for that 97 kph urbie to catch up to your 150kph Locust is going to slow your team down a lot. If you really feel concerned about this, just run over that cap point and move along to the next. It should still count for you.