103 replies to this topic

[Mystere]

Xavori, on 03 November 2017 - 11:42 PM, said:

While I want the Clans back at 55 tons for scout missions, I definitely don't want Bushwackers or Assassins nerfed. They're good mechs. All mechs should be like them.

Instead, the fix for scouting is to make objectives worth doing. If collecting intel was worth more than a measly 1000 c-bills and whatever paltry faction points it pays, people would start picking mechs to collect intel on both sides. In turn, that would mean that you'd have to pick mechs to counter those fast sneaky buggers rather than just everyone pick their best medium brawler and ignore the objectives.

Because short of that, even given the Clans back 55 does nothing to fix the imbalance since neither the Stormcrow nor the upcoming Black Lanner can match up against Bushwackers so long as those two mechs are great big walking leg hitboxes just waiting to get chopped off...

Scouting mode should be changed. It should be about a smaller force gathering intelligence, escaping to an extraction point, all while being hunted by a larger enemy force. This game's obsession with symmetrical N vs. N fights all day everyday 24x7 is hugely responsible for it's lack of variety and subsequent mounting staleness.

Edited by Mystere, 04 November 2017 - 04:47 AM.

[Mystere]

Lupis Volk, on 04 November 2017 - 12:26 AM, said:

It's almost like they are deliberately making bad mechs and playing them badly to further an agenda

Hmm, that would make them smart, or make them think they are actually smart.

[El Bandito]

Got the Stormcrow (S) and decked it out with a nasty 71 damage alpha. Just waiting for my unit to go Clan.

[Mystere]

El Bandito, on 04 November 2017 - 05:13 AM, said:

Got the Stormcrow (S) and decked it out with a nasty 71 damage alpha. Just waiting for my unit to go Clan.

This is one of my many other problems with this game. It's all about the alphas.

Maybe I should start a thread about MWO implementing cones of fire and forced chain-firing for any and all weapons. Hmm.

Edited by Mystere, 04 November 2017 - 05:22 AM.

[El Bandito]

Mystere, on 04 November 2017 - 05:20 AM, said:

This is one of my many other problems with this game. It's all about the alphas.

Maybe I should start a thread about MWO implementing cones of fire and forced chain-firing for any and all weapons. Hmm.

Go ahead. It is an issue that has been unsuccessfully tackled by PGI several times.

[Y E O N N E]

Nema Nabojiv, on 04 November 2017 - 12:39 AM, said:

I know how to fix scouting, listen. Stormcrow is not a match for a bushwacker anyway, BUT! A Mad Dog have about the same armour and can carry the same amount of splat, so to make things even they need to raise the weightcap to 60 for both.

That will also allow occasional Dragons and Quickdraws into scouting, but primarily it will be maddogs vs bushwackers.

That's going to let me bring a RIfleman in scouting and, let me tell you, you aren't going to get close enough to use splat with a Mad Dog if I can bring a Rifleman. That 'Mech is a beast and cranking out damage in a short amount of time.

Honestly, if PGI would make IS UACs have a little more than a token advantage in jam chance (and it absolutely is token) on UACs, Heavy lasers would be a complete non-issue. 30 damage from Medium Lasers plus 30-40 damage from UAC fire in roughly the same span? Savage.

Lupis Volk, on 04 November 2017 - 12:15 AM, said:

ftfy

TBF, the reverse is what happened back in early 2016 and things have been annoyingly out of whack since then.

And seriously, FW is not a good bar to measure balance, people. Like QP, it is too reliant upon the distribution of good players vs. bad players.

[GuardDogg]

Asym, on 04 November 2017 - 03:35 AM, said:

I'm not a BT/MW expert but GD is spot on and right.... Scouting is a mission about data not damage. Speed and stealth versus direct action. In the MW games, there was a neat mission where you have to infiltrate a base for technical data and not set off proximity alarms and avoid roving patrols... THAT IS SCOUTING.....

Lights and some very fast mediums at or below 40 tons should be the limit. But as usual, you 'all want to go the other way because you 'all have this obtuse obsession with brawling and brawling only...... Why? Because it's simple and really, doesn't require much thought: See bad guys, chase bad guys, kill bad guys.....next mission... Wow, I'm breathless that soo much fun....

There is a cancer in MWO. Scouting is a symptom of it. Mission creep is a warning sign of serious dysfunction. That cancer is "balance....." Balance is eating the soul of MWO. I could go on but, as Lupis said above: "I'd point it out but, since it is hard for you to see, it would be pointless..."

Correct and Agree.

[Armored Yokai]

DANKnuggz, on 03 November 2017 - 02:04 PM, said:

This subject isn't a new one for sure but still remains a valid complaint.

With the IS gaining solid mediums like the BSW and Assassin why are clans still limited to 50 tons?

The IS now have solid options to combat our crows and tonnage needs to be evened up.

No. You guys have Invasion, which is easy mode for clans. It's I.S turn to have a game mode that they win in.
now if you want crows really badly give I.S 60-65 ton in scouting

Edited by Armored Yokai, 04 November 2017 - 12:00 PM.

[BrunoSSace]

This thread needs to die. What a toxic read.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Armored Yokai, on 04 November 2017 - 11:59 AM, said:

No. You guys have Invasion, which is easy mode for clans. It's I.S turn to have a game mode that they win in.
now if you want crows really badly give I.S 60-65 ton in scouting

More like give IS 55 tons and Clans 60-65 if you wanted it to actually be balanced.

[Lupis Volk]

BrunoSSace, on 04 November 2017 - 01:19 PM, said:

This thread needs to die. What a toxic read.

Aww sucks when people don't conform to your narrative isn't it. Got to shut it down like a good little authoritarian.

What needs to "die" is the toxic, self defeatist mind set that has infected a staggering amount of IS players, they refuse to improve themselves and continue to play like potatoes and have the nerve to say it's clan tech and not their own inability to play the game.

Edited by Lupis Volk, 04 November 2017 - 02:37 PM.

[Nema Nabojiv]

Yeonne Greene, on 04 November 2017 - 08:20 AM, said:

That's going to let me bring a RIfleman in scouting and, let me tell you, you aren't going to get close enough to use splat with a Mad Dog if I can bring a Rifleman. That 'Mech is a beast and cranking out damage in a short amount of time.

Thats doubtful. Nothing stops clans from trying to outrange bushwackers now, with say ERLL shadowcats, but it doesn't happen.

[Trenchbird]

Lupis Volk, on 04 November 2017 - 02:28 PM, said:

Aww sucks when people don't conform to your narrative isn't it. Got to shut it down like a good little authoritarian.

What, people are supposed to follow your narrative, then?

I'll be damned if I follow the ideas of a hypocrite.

EDIT; Well, I'm not going to follow any Hypocrite that isn't me, at any rate.

Edited by Catten Hart, 04 November 2017 - 02:50 PM.

[Lupis Volk]

Catten Hart, on 04 November 2017 - 02:41 PM, said:

What, people are supposed to follow your narrative, then?

I'll be damned if I follow the ideas of a hypocrite.

EDIT; Well, I'm not going to follow any Hypocrite that isn't me, at any rate.

No, but to declare this thread toxic, where there has been no toxicity raises some questions.

I don't expect people to see my "narrative" because i've played both sides. IS from the steam launch to Clans for the last half year. I've seen the balance on both sides of the coin. A feat which i know for a fact few on the vocal IS forum warrior brigade experience due to a policy of "i only play is mechs" While many more have alt accounts, one for IS and one for Clan.

[Trenchbird]

Lupis Volk, on 04 November 2017 - 02:46 PM, said:

No, but to declare this thread toxic, where there has been no toxicity raises some questions.

I don't expect people to see my "narrative" because i've played both sides. IS from the steam launch to Clans for the last half year. I've seen the balance on both sides of the coin. A feat which i know for a fact few on the vocal IS forum warrior brigade experience due to a policy of "i only play is mechs" While many more have alt accounts, one for IS and one for Clan.

I'd ignore my edit, if I were you. I changed it after this, because by your first post, I assumed you were less balanced. Apologies.

EDIT; No, I can understand part of your argument; But not all of it. I've played both sides since I started playing; And I can say without a doubt that I prefer, with three exceptions, my Clan Medium mechs over my IS medium mechs. Granted, those three are all niche brawler builds; An XL300 CN9-YLW, a triple Flamer+AC20+SNPPC High Roller, and a quad SRM-4 Assassin.

Bushwhackers are without a doubt, powerful for what they are. They take a lot more firepower than expected to take down. But I wouldn't equate them to the anti-medium/anti-light strength of the old Streakcrow. I ran into those a few times in QP when I was running around in my faster mechs, and I was vastly more terrified of them than I am of even Streak Bushwhackers.

On that note, also, I'm going to try out a streak Bushwhacker myself. To see if they are as 'OP' as people claimed at least once.

Edited by Catten Hart, 04 November 2017 - 02:55 PM.

[Lupis Volk]

Catten Hart, on 04 November 2017 - 02:51 PM, said:

I'd ignore my edit, if I were you. I changed it after this, because by your first post, I assumed you were less balanced. Apologies.

Edit to this to come.

This is the thing. Many simply label me a Clan apologist due to the CGB logo in an effort to shout down any sort of dissenting opinion and it has after a long time, made me rather quick on the trigger finger and rather apathetic towards the IS if not somewhat hostile. I started off in the IS, slowly got better and better. Saw the seesaw of balance sway back and forward. However one thing stayed the same.

The IS always enticed beginners but few wished to train them. A game mode about teamwork and organisation was filled with people who can only be called anti-social yolo swaggers. The ech imbalance is part of the problem, but that's it......a part of the problem not the core, a part.

Edited by Lupis Volk, 04 November 2017 - 03:00 PM.

[BrunoSSace]

It might not be thread thats "toxic". Just one person.

[Lupis Volk]

BrunoSSace, on 04 November 2017 - 03:05 PM, said:

It might not be thread thats "toxic". Just one person.

Aww does facts and truth hurt your feelies? Might want to wonder over to sites like tmblr and twitter since they crack down on things that trigger you like my crime of wrongthink.

[Trenchbird]

Lupis Volk, on 04 November 2017 - 03:09 PM, said:

Aww does facts and truth hurt your feelies? Might want to wonder over to sites like tmblr and twitter since they crack down on things that trigger you like my crime of wrongthink.

Hey, man, this is what I was originally getting pissed at you for. Cut it out and play nice.

Both of you, if you're both being the problem.

Edited by Catten Hart, 04 November 2017 - 03:13 PM.

[Lupis Volk]

Catten Hart, on 04 November 2017 - 03:11 PM, said:

Hey, man, this is what I was originally getting pissed at you for. Cut it out and play nice.

Both of you, if you're both being the problem.

Why should i play nice with people who are PART of the problem, refuse to admit that and have the nerve to proclaim that i am instead?

They'll never be nice to me because i'm a Clanner, heck even when i was in the IS they showered me with scorm because i called them out on their bs. So why should i be nice to a group who consider everything i do or say invalid because of a pretty icon i have? I AM OVER IT.

I ain't going to be the better man here and i sure as heck will use the moral high ground to give my body slam more oompf not to grandstand or soapbox off.

Edited by Lupis Volk, 04 November 2017 - 03:29 PM.