44 replies to this topic

[Kasumi Sumika]

Fix the misplaced hardpoints on certain mechs.

Before October 2017 Patch:



After October 2017 Patch:

[Trissila]

Khobai, on 08 November 2017 - 03:54 PM, said:

id rather see the mechs that relied on medium lasers get medium laser quirks as compensation

because medium lasers were way too good. they needed to be nerfed. unfortunately some builds did rely on medium lasers, so nerfing medium lasers hurt those builds, so the mechs that relied on them should get medium laser quirks to make up for the nerfs.

but I feel the game on the whole is better off with medium lasers being weaker.

I've seen... basically no change at all since the nerf.

Still giant yellow/green seas, because what the heck else are you going to use in place of a medium laser? It's slowed the game down ever so slightly, but again, even that hasn't really done too much given that MLAS variant spam is almost always heat-limited rather than cooldown-limited.

[The6thMessenger]

Trissila, on 08 November 2017 - 11:21 PM, said:

I've seen... basically no change at all since the nerf.

Still giant yellow/green seas, because what the heck else are you going to use in place of a medium laser? It's slowed the game down ever so slightly, but again, even that hasn't really done too much given that MLAS variant spam is almost always heat-limited rather than cooldown-limited.

Well, yeah. Personally, i didn't mind the cooldown nerf on the Medium Lasers cause that's just time otherwise used to cooldown that i don't exactly notice -- except on the desynced laser vomit builds like that on the urbanmech.

Honestly, i could go with or without the nerf -- it would be welcome but not needed. The Clan ERML on the other hand deserves a LOT of nerfs cause it's practically a 1-ton Large-Laser, it's just global nerfs that include it isn't exactly what i had in mind.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 08 November 2017 - 11:28 PM.

[Trissila]

The6thMessenger, on 08 November 2017 - 11:27 PM, said:

Well, yeah. Personally, i didn't mind the cooldown nerf on the Medium Lasers cause that's just time otherwise used to cooldown that i don't exactly notice -- except on the desynced laser vomit builds like that on the urbanmech.

Honestly, i could go with or without the nerf -- it would be welcome but not needed. The Clan ERML on the other hand deserves a LOT of nerfs cause it's practically a 1-ton Large-Laser, it's just global nerfs that include it isn't exactly what i had in mind.

For sure. It's entirely possible to nerf the CERML without touching the ISML; I will never understand why PGI thought that ISMLs needed to be hit with a bat right along with everything else.

I mean, if the base premise is "Medium Lasers, as en entire weapon class, are too popular", then... welcome to Battletech? MLs and their numerous variants have been staple weapons since the beginning, that's kind of the point of a well-rounded weapon system. Not too big, not too small; to the extent that they are 'too popular', it's only because Small Lasers blow chunks and have always blown chunks, because half a ton per weapon just isn't enough of a savings to justify all the other downsides. In order to get any real savings, you'd have to swap a BUNCH of MLs for SLs, and at that point you might as well not even bother because SLs are so dangerous to use -- requiring you to be basically point-blank but not having the damage to back that up.

Even in Mechwarrior 2, your Nova was much better off mounting 8 ERMLs rather than 12 ERSLs. 56 damage instead of 60 damage and 8 tons instead of 6 tons, but WAY more usable/safe range.


Small lasers have an eternal problem: They're very light, very short range, low-damage weapons... but they take up the same one critical space and the same one energy hardpoint as medium lasers, which only weigh half a ton more.

So when you've got six energy hardpoints to work with, you can fill 'em with six smalls... or you can find three tons to upgrade those to mediums and get almost double the range and over 50% more damage.

Even a Locust, the lightest 'mech available with 6 energy hardpoints, has no good reason to use smalls. With the biggest engine it can mount (an XL 190) and maxed armor, using six mediums STILL has 0.14 tons of leftover tonnage. You could swap three of them for smalls and either strip out 0.36 tons of armor or drop an engine class to swap to an LFE for slightly more safety, but why would you? At that point, you've neutered your damage and forced yourself into even closer range that the benefit of an LFE over an XL doesn't really mean anything anymore.

Smalls are only 'worth it' if you are so strapped for tonnage that half a ton makes or breaks you, and that's just never the case. You can always find that half a ton of savings somewhere else, like stripping 2 points of armor from every component and a couple more from the head. The only situation where smalls have anything going for them is when a 'mech has an absurd amount of energy hardpoints, like 12, where it's conceivable that you might be able to boat 12 smalls where you really could only mount a lesser number of mediums... but even then, the smalls aren't ENOUGH additional damage to make up for all the other ways you're gimping yourself by bringing them.

[The6thMessenger]

Trissila, on 08 November 2017 - 11:52 PM, said:

For sure. It's entirely possible to nerf the CERML without touching the ISML; I will never understand why PGI thought that ISMLs needed to be hit with a bat right along with everything else.

It's like "It's because I'm Batman", but with PGI.

Trissila, on 08 November 2017 - 11:52 PM, said:

I mean, if the base premise is "Medium Lasers, as en entire weapon class, are too popular", then... welcome to Battletech? MLs and their numerous variants have been staple weapons since the beginning, that's kind of the point of a well-rounded weapon system.

Yeah, kind of boggles my mind why would PGI become too concerned with a well-rounded weapon becoming popular.