22 replies to this topic

[Tragic_Pain_Glove]

Have been focused on assault for years (Atlas, Kodiak, Stalkers, Awesome, etc) .

Would like to try a heavy to take advantage of its increased mobility/speed. Something that is not squishy and can deliver decent alphas when necessary.

Prefer dakka with srm's...maybe dakka with lasers.- 500 and closer.

Any recommendations?

Questions remains- if assault has better armor, can carry more payload on similar builds, is speed the only advantage? Why heavy's over assaults?

Thanks

Edited by Odd Thomas, 07 July 2017 - 10:25 AM.

[Old dirty B]

Better mobilty, turn speed, twist speed, lower / smaller profile, less attracting attention...

[TKG]

Odd Thomas, on 07 July 2017 - 10:16 AM, said:

Questions remains- if assault has better armor, can carry more payload on similar builds, is speed the only advantage? Why heavy's over assaults?
Thanks

Simple assaults are often too slow to quickly react to major changes in the battlefield. Heavies can do that and can carry pretty significant armor and weapons options. You may want to try the black knight or grasshopper as a rough heavy equivalent to the Awesome, and the Quickdraw as a rough comparison to the stalker. Likewise I'd guess that the Orion might be the heavy comparison for the atlas (I own both so I can say they are similar). In the case of the Kodiak have no idea what a heavy match up for the kodiak is I tend not to play clan mechs but I'm sure someone on the forums can make a recommendation.

[AureliusDean]

I bring my dakka out in a Jager... but you can't trust my opinion, Pacific Rim is the frigging ring tone on my phone. It all depends on your playstyle. I play a Tempest as my primary 'mech, so I'm used to providing long range fire support and covering assaults with ECM.

If you're used to quad ultra 10s or something that is WAY above my pay grade. Cool post though!

[Hobby Knight]

Heavies' speed advantage over assaults is not trivial. You have the firepower to be a game-changer, and the speed and maneuverability to not get ganked by a light. Dakka/SRM is a tough combo since it uses a lot of weight and both are ammo dependent. Struggling to think of any heavies off the top of my head that really mix autocannons and SRMs well. Orion maybe? You can run them very similar to a brawler Atlas.

[AureliusDean]

I would say heavy is better for one reason: Assaults draw fire like a magnet on Scarlett Johannsen's assets. I would ALWAYS rather be on a team with two extra heavies in Bravo and Alpha. When I see that X I pour the coal on like the Grinch whipping his dog.

[Gagis]

The Orion IIC with LB20X and 4x ASRM6 is possibly the best brawler in the game right now. I'd recommend one of those if you can handle the ugly.

Edited by Gagis, 07 July 2017 - 09:07 PM.

[TKG]

Gagis, on 07 July 2017 - 09:06 PM, said:

The Orion IIC with LB20X and 4x ASRM6 is possibly the best brawler in the game right now. I'd recommend one of those if you can handle the ugly.

that might change pending the civil war update due in a few days, as some of the ON1-VA Orion has identical hardpoints as the IIC-A(C) and light engines may make it the IS equivalent.

Edited by TKG, 08 July 2017 - 04:55 PM.

[Lightcraft]

Hi there,

I'd like to "hijack" the thread (@Odd Thomas: hope you don't mind) because I'm in quite a similar situation.

First let me start explaining my (short) experience and what I already got in my stable, so you might understand my situation a bit better.

Mech Stable so far contains:
Lights: Arctic Cheetah, RVN-3L [both from the Steam light pack] and a Panther (Got it during the sale).
Medium: ENF-4R (3 LL, 2 ML)
Heavy: MAD-3R(2 PPC, 2 UAC-5)
Assault: MAL-MX90 (just got it because of the sale), Free Battlemaster (just because it was free )

I'm up about 400 matches with approx 180 of them in my Arctic cheetah, and about 80/90 (each) in the Enforcer and the Marauder.

With the Cheetah I was mainly harassing and a little scouting, changed to loadout few times from c-ERsmall to c-SPL and running now c-ERML which I like better. It got good speed, maneuverability and packs a decent punch.

My enforcer runs the "meta" firesupport (or at least that's what I was told ) which is okay. I stick with the big guys and provide additional firepower right from second. Mobility is decent and JJs help getting around big obstacels, not mastered yet and I have trouble getting my damage pinpoint (LL feel uncomfortable compared to LPL, which I like more)

My Marauder runs dual ppc and dual uac/5 (apparently pretty common build) and it runs hot as hell. Played it a few times and it's okay. The MAD-3R is sturdy as hell and packs a pretty mean punch, though I have yet to master the skills.

I tried on a total f2p account some of the trial heavy mechs, mainly the ebon jaguar and the hellbringer.

The Ebon jag is fun, but the chasis is pretty low for my liking and I'm not a huge fan of the gauss rifle. Over all, like the mech hated the loadout. Still I did quite okay with it (considering I run around potato land)

I adore the Hellbringer. c-LPL and c-ERML, nothing wrong with that and an ECM on top.
Mobility and speed are quite nice, but I'm not really happy with the loadout variety the omnipods offer from what I've seen.

Now you know a bit about my MWO experience and what I already have. I would appreciate some recommendations which allow me to run different loadouts, mainly laser and missiles as I'm not much into ballistic weapons. Tried it but I just doesn't work well for me.

TL;DR: looking for new Heavy besides MAD-3R, decent speed and mobility are a must. Diversity in Loadout possibilities would be pretty appreciated. Should be able to Laserboat and possibility for brawling and skirmishing would be nice (SRMs/Laser).

see you guys around,
Lightcraft

[Nerokar]

Well if I understood you right, you want a mech to brawl and to laservomit. You want a possibility to switch your loadouts easily...
Following is my opinion, it is nothing about optimal usage or "best" mechs.

Omnimechs give you the best loadout possibilities thanks to switchable pods.
I try to give you some recommendations without ballistics:
TBR, one of the most versile mechs in game with optional JJ, but often focused, has low arms and those easy to shoot ears:

This one can brawl well. 4xsrma6 + 5 spls. If you want more lasers or JJ switch one or both STs from tbr-d to tbr-s and strip some armor and get rid of one or two tons of ammo...
TBR-D
This one is a Laservomit build with some flows like some low lasers and those easy to see magnetic tbr-a ST, but still good. If it is to hot switch the right ML to a DHS.
TBR-D

EBJ is the better *goes in cover* TBR, there are only two things I sometimes miss on it: JJs and the 4xsrma6+lasers build of the TBR... In all other points it is better. The profile is an advantage, podspace too and arms are higher. The biggest problem is the left Laser ear... it is so damn nice to focus...
Here is (for me) the best Laservomit ingame:
EBJ-A
And here is my "brawl" variant... well it is not exactly a brawler, but it is still powerfull in close combat:
EBJ-A

EDIT: The first EBJ Variant is hot... if skilled completely you will be able to Alpha twice... If not, be aware of the heat. The second build breaks Ghostheat. Split your MPLs in multiple groups. The simple variant: 5 left lasers in one group, 3 right lasers in another.

And here is one, that I'm missing in my collection... well its kind of heavy armored medium... but still:
LBK is a super fast heavy brawler for me:
Slap 6 SRMs or SRMAs on it, strike ones and disappear... Or boat MLs/MPLs/SPLs on it... but it is better, any pilot with LBK exp post some builds here.

Edited by Nerokar, 12 July 2017 - 04:17 AM.

[Audacious Aubergine]

Well depending on your definition of good mobility, have you considered Thunderbolts? They're from an older meta but they still check out alright I think?
Maybe something like TDR-5SS

Edited by Audacious Aubergine, 12 July 2017 - 04:52 AM.

[Gagis]

I can''t think of a mech that'd do a mix of lasers and missiles well since after c-spl was nerfed. I'd recommend grabing one chassis for each. The Grasshopper is still amazing with all styles of laser boating even though it was just nerfed, and for missiles I absolutely adorw the Catapult with 6 SRM6+A, XL300. Both of them even have jump jets.

[CFC Conky]

For dakka and lasers, you can't go too far wrong with the Marauder. The Rifleman is fun too but a tad fragile. That said, I've been able to survive with an xl engine, as long as I keep moving. Think of it as a large Blackjack.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

[S 0 L E N Y A]

TKG, on 08 July 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

that might change pending the civil war update due in a few days, as some of the ON1-VA Orion has identical hardpoints as the IIC-A(C) and light engines may make it the IS equivalent.

It wont, not even close.

First, the VA does not have identical hardpoints. It has a similar count, but believe or not, the location of the hardpoints counts for A LOT. The OrionVA has 4 missile hardpoints in the arms, which are both very low, and very wide. The OrionIICA has all 4 missile hardpoints on one side of the mech, which means you can strip the right arm of all armor in order to save weight.

PLUS

IICA still has a Clan XL which the Light Engine still cannot compete with. Point being, you will not get anything as tanky, fast, and with the firepower the OrionIICA has in the 75t weight class.

At this point, the OrionIICA is a superior brawler to the KDK Spirit Bear.

[Dubbelklik]

Odd Thomas, on 07 July 2017 - 10:16 AM, said:

Have been focused on assault for years (Atlas, Kodiak, Stalkers, Awesome, etc) .

Would like to try a heavy to take advantage of its increased mobility/speed. Something that is not squishy and can deliver decent alphas when necessary.

Prefer dakka with srm's...maybe dakka with lasers.- 500 and closer.

Any recommendations?

You didn't mention lasers with SRMs but I'd like to throw this out there: Try a Linebacker with (5) Sm. ER lasers and (4) SRM-6s with Arti. That's an alpha of 73 (if my memory is correct). It's reasonably tough right out of the box and gets even tougher once you put some structure skills into it. It's fast (for a heavy) at just above 90kph for great hit-and-run play.

[TKG]

Boogie138, on 12 July 2017 - 11:03 AM, said:

First, the VA does not have identical hardpoints. It has a similar count, but believe or not, the location of the hardpoints counts for A LOT. The OrionVA has 4 missile hardpoints in the arms, which are both very low, and very wide. The OrionIICA has all 4 missile hardpoints on one side of the mech, which means you can strip the right arm of all armor in order to save weight.

You are right it doesn't match up but the ON1-V does and the only difference between it and the IIC-C is that the ON1-V's missile systems are not idiotically clustered in an area with a much higher chance of being shot. I'd also point out that if you strip armor off the arms of a orion you deserve to die early in a match, ever hear of shield arms? Admittedly, the clan model doesn't need all that; it's already got tonnage and internal slot savings...the best brawler models for it don't need to do this.

[Artillery Witch Viridia]

Pick a Warhammer, Roughneck, or Jagermech to fill your dakka needs in civil war. Warhammer has a good laser vomit build as well as the Thunderbolt and Jester. While speed is an advantage, there are built in bonuses for most non assault mechs. They often get enhanced survivability in the form of armor/structure quirks. Each point invested is worth more to a mech that is lower tonnage since the closer to a 100 tons the lower the nodes are in overall armor/structure percentages. Couple that with Higher speeds at lower tonnages per engine rating it allows heavies to get into positions and avoid fire without investing in the Mobility tree. https://docs.google....gd1g/edit#gid=0
If these values are still accurate at about 60 tons you get about the same total value for defensive investments all the way up to 100 tons.
A dwf only does 52.2 with all speed tweaks. (21 mobility) invested to go up from an abyssal 48.6kph 124/62(186) CT points 84/42ST(126)
My Top Dog Thunderbolt with (26 survival) is 92/77CT(169) (65 ton mech only 17 points difference) 66/59 (125) 1 whole point in side torso difference. Travels at 76kph and maintains fast cooling 48 damage alpha which is pretty good for inner sphere standards.
That's a huge difference in survival in favor of heavies. Assaults who bite off more than they can chew can't avoid fire or retreat like a heavy could. This is why the front line assault beyond those only fit for brawling is extinct. There is not that much difference in armor with the skill tree and piloting a huge assault means you are nearly going to catch every shot taken at you. Assaults like the direwolf are better used at range where they can bring raw firepower dps/alphas and receive less damage taken. Rather than walking to the frontline and promptly dropping dead from focused fire. Most assaults even if they are up front have trouble returning fire due to terrain conflicting with low slung hard points.
The Roughneck (65tonner) with the quirks across the chassis would probably be more durable than the baseline 100 tonner with this configuration. It really has god tier quirks. The Black Knight (BL-6B) although far less than RGH "god tier" has decent quirks but suffers from being too tall for it's hard points, it's an honorable mention due to the amount of fire power it could bear with a light engine tomorrow.
p.s Protip watch out for RGH-1A with 3 rac 5's if the ghost heat isn't crazy. The Ilya-muromets with it's gorilla armed glory as well.

Edited by Azoic23, 17 July 2017 - 03:21 PM.

[Kaethir]

Lightcraft, on 12 July 2017 - 01:01 AM, said:

TL;DR: looking for new Heavy besides MAD-3R, decent speed and mobility are a must. Diversity in Loadout possibilities would be pretty appreciated. Should be able to Laserboat and possibility for brawling and skirmishing would be nice (SRMs/Laser).

You're going to be hard pressed to find a heavy that fits your requirements better than the linebacker:
1. Omnipods allow for (some) diversity in loadouts, although you're not looking at a lot of dakka especially with the weight of the huge engine limiting the ammo you can bring
2. very fast, decently maneuverable (got a little worse with engine desync, but still really good for its weight and can get better with skills if it doesn't feel right to you)
3. even without the redline pods it can do up to 8 E hardpoints or 6 M hardpoints, has the option to bring AMS if you want
4. Some of the best builds on it are small lasers + srms...

Only downsides the linebacker has, IMO:
1. No JJs - annoying to occasionally get stuck on pebbles.
2. That huge engine - gets great speed because of it, but the weight really limits you from some builds due the the inability to carry more DHS (for high-heat builds) or more ammo (for more missiles/dakka builds)

[Lightcraft]

Hey guys,

thanks everybody who put up some comments to my post.
I got myself and Ebon Jaguar and stuffing it with nice lazers. So far, love it though it's pretty toasty.

Though with the new tech dropping, I'll try out some loadouts including the new Heavy lasers.
So much to do, yet so little time

I will get a linebacker and a timby at a later point.

Again, thanks guys.

cya around

[Nerokar]

Its nice to get an answer. Unfortunaly its not the normal case. Good luck. Have fun. And Come back here if you have more questions.😉