17 replies to this topic

[Pippykins]

topic says it all, not sure what to do with the skills here. it's a highlander iic c with twin uac 10, 3 cr mediums, and atm 9 and 6. It's running an xl 325

[CFC Conky]

Generally speaking, faster is better. If you are happy with the mech's current speed, tweaking can still be useful as once the nodes are activated, you can reduce engine size, go just as fast, and free up some tonnage for other stuff.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

[Rogue Jedi]

I think you can get an extra 7.5% top speed, if you unlock all the speed tweak nodes with max engine that equates to an extra 4.3kph, you must decide if that (with the extra mobility nodes you have to unlock to get it) is worthwhile to you

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 02 December 2017 - 02:04 AM.

[arcana75]

The skillnode bonuses, many of them are % bonuses, so the bigger the base value, the bigger the bonus, the smaller the base value the smaller the bonus.

This applies not only to the speed nodes, but also:

armour & structure nodes (heavier mechs and those with armour/structure enhancements will benefit the most)
ammo (the bigger the gun the worse the benefit: Autocannon 20s, you get only ONE extra shot)
velocity nodes (MGs useless, but autocannons and gauss yes)

etc... so for slow mechs, speed nodes maybe not, but a light going at 100kph?

[Exard3k]

I found that 58kph is often too slow in most quick play matches while the 62.9kph is just enough to keep up with your team. I wouldn't go for mobility if you only want speed tweak. But the Highlander really can make good use of torso speed and acceleration stuff, as the chassis itself is above average mobility level (top speed excluded though) making it rather agile for a 90t mech especially on clan side

Edited by Exard3k, 02 December 2017 - 04:59 AM.

[Pippykins]

Yeah I'm still on the fence about it. I know I won't be getting much speed from it, but extra accel and decel would be nice for the close in fights I seem to be getting into. I'll have all the heat reduction, uac and missile stuff off the firepower tree and full survival, and would have enough points left to get all the speed tweak without branching off into the rest of the tree. it might be more beneficial to skip speed tweak and maybe go for cool run or accel,decel, and anchor turns for mobility.

[The Basilisk]

It realy depends on the specific build. I've got assault builds where I skill accell/deccel only...others where I skill for torsospeed and again others I go for topspeed.
Realy depends on your strategy.
You might say "hey those ~5kph..who cares..." well if you go just below 60kph and you get the chance to go just above you will care in most cases.

[mogs01gt]

325xl limit really hurts that mech. Normally I'd say skip speed tweak but that is slow! Try it without the increased speed.

[Dee Eight]

For the # of nodes you need to dump into the tree to unlock the speed nodes...you're better investing in the survival tree.

[panzer1b]

Honestly, ive started considering speed tweak (and the entire mobility tree for that matter) rather useless in practice. You are far better off investing into weapons (max out range, heat gen, and if it uses ammo ammo skills), sensors (for 100% radar derp, best armor around and a middle finger to lurmers), ops (cool run 100%, duh), and whatever is left into survival (its not a huge benefit but its alot more useful then 4kph or a tiny % to acceleration when your base acceleration is 0).

Thing is, mobility is a % increase, and a % increase is rarely beneficial since mechs which are already highly agile/fast, simply do not need any more of that trait, and mechs that are sluggish, gain so little that its hardly worth wasting skill points in. If speed tweak didnt require going through so much dead weight, id totally run it on every mech, but in its current state, i have a few speed tweak nodes on like 2-3 mechs just because i had nothing better to spend the points on since they needed no ops tree or heat gen nodes (summoner with 1GR and 1ERPPC, runs so cool id literally have to spam my weapons the instant they go off cooldown for 2 minutes to get hot on terra therma, dual gauss mechs, ect).

Like every skills, it CAN be useful, but its just hard to hjustify it over something that directly increases your offense or defense (and a teeny % to agility wont make your sluggish assaut avoid damage magically all of a sudden, and its not gonna make already agile mechs evade damage much better either when they are already zippy).

[arcana75]

On a slow mech nah. Since many of the nodes are percentage based, you should enhance what strong points your mech has. Alot of armour/structure, get armour/structure nodes, etc. Structure bonus can go as high has 30+%, which is quite significant.

Speed tweak maxes adds 7.5%, so if you have a mech that runs 130kph, you get a new speed of 139kph. 9 whopping kph more. With the 20+ nodes needed to reach 7.5%, it could be spent on the Sensor and Aux nodes, improving your strikes and radar deprivation to a much higher degree of impact than 7.5% on max speed.

Same goes for other nodes. If you have fast-firing weapons, say all IS small pulse lasers. Even if you pick up all the cooldown nodes, which IIRC brings you to around 15% (could be wrong) cooldown the IS small pulse laser cooldown goes from 2.25 to 1.9125, 1/3 of a second's difference. Is this a significant difference? What about a PPC's 4 seconds to 3.4 seconds? You decide. Same goes for say heat gen nodes, which iirc go as high as 11%. 11% on a small number gets a small benefit, but could it be the difference between firing one more time and shutting down?

The one upside is mech enhancements or quirks. Some of them will really make a difference, eg the Wolfhound-1 has a default 10% heat gen reduction on large lasers. If you added another 10% heat gen from nodes...

Edited by arcana75, 02 January 2018 - 07:20 PM.

[Seranov]

Panzer, I'd normally agree with you, but in any mech that goes sub-60 kph, I feel like it's absolutely worth it. Yes, you get a smaller increase than faster mechs, but slow mechs need every bit of speed they can get. Below 60 kph you are pretty much guaranteed to get left behind by your team and become food for the enemy. It's the same argument people make against the Defensive skills, the benefit seems small in theory, but in practice, every bit helps.

I think it does definitely depend on the mech and your comfort level with it, but I personally never go sub-60 if I can help it.

[arcana75]

Seranov, on 02 January 2018 - 07:19 PM, said:

Panzer, I'd normally agree with you, but in any mech that goes sub-60 kph, I feel like it's absolutely worth it. Yes, you get a smaller increase than faster mechs, but slow mechs need every bit of speed they can get. Below 60 kph you are pretty much guaranteed to get left behind by your team and become food for the enemy. It's the same argument people make against the Defensive skills, the benefit seems small in theory, but in practice, every bit helps.

I think it does definitely depend on the mech and your comfort level with it, but I personally never go sub-60 if I can help it.

If your mech is going sub-60 and you're using max speed tweak to bring it past 60, you're really spending 20 (22?) nodes to bring a mech from 56kph to 60.2kph via that 7.5% boost. A whopping 4.2kph difference. And that's the worst case scenario. Best case? 59.9kph to 64.3925kph, a 4.4925kph increase. You're getting left behind no matter what.

Assuming your aim was to reach speed tweak and those intermediate nodes eg anchor turn, kinetic burst, etc don't matter to you.

IMHO you're better off leaving it alone or using engine upgrades instead.

Edited by arcana75, 03 January 2018 - 05:10 AM.

[Seranov]

Having played my Nightstars going 55ish, and then having them Speed Tweaked to 60ish, I can assure you there is a difference. My survivability went up a ton because I wasn't literally always behind the rest of the team. It has never not been worth the points in my experience, because all the extra Firepower nodes in the world won't save me from getting run over by half a dozen enemy mechs when I'm isolated and unable to escape.

[BTGbullseye]

As long as it's going 60+, it's not going to be left behind, and 64 is average for a "fast" Assault. (at least for those who are building for weapons instead of speed) Breaking 70 is moving into Heavy territory.

[EDIT] This was my 404th post... It can't be found.

Edited by BTGbullseye, 04 January 2018 - 08:49 AM.

[justcallme A S H]

Absolutely not worth the investment into Skill Maze for Assaults... In fact 9/10 times mobility tree is of no use because Assault mobility is so bad to begin with and Skill Maze values are not what they should be.

[NRP]

Yeah, the mobility tree offers so little value for big assault mechs it's just not worth it imo. You're slow no matter what. Better to max survivability, firepower, heat gen, and radar derp. NASCAR is a thing unfortunately, and 60 kph won't save you.

[Seranov]

YMMV. I personally think using the Skill Tree to help shore up my mech's weaknesses is a completely valid use of points. It's not like I don't have any points in the other trees, either. Rather, it's only ever the last 10 or so points that I have fighting for various other nodes throughout the whole tree.

It's definitely a player comfort and preference kind of deal.