33 replies to this topic

[dario03]

Khobai, on 12 December 2017 - 02:32 PM, said:

yep its been around since closed beta

apparently deadzoning mechs is a new concept for some people though

I think the "new" thing is the free look to shoot to the side for better shielding. Though that isn't new, its just very under used.

Unless theres something else new that I don't know of.

[MischiefSC]

Actually watched the match, the gun wasn't clipping the torso. Shooting under it.

[dario03]

MischiefSC, on 12 December 2017 - 07:38 PM, said:

Actually watched the match, the gun wasn't clipping the torso. Shooting under it.

That part might be new. Never paid enough attention and the last time that Dragon got used was when it had a bunch of AC5 quirks which was a while back.

[Jman5]

Dee Eight, on 12 December 2017 - 04:43 PM, said:

Wayyyy to much ammo for the 8v8 format of comp games. Could have dropped a ton and stuck a RL15 into the CT.

UAC ammo is always tricky to judge. Especially on mechs with uac jam chance quirks.

Anyway, I could be wrong, but I wouldn't be surprised if his comp build is a little different.

Notice he has the exact amount of space for a Light Engine. I don't really see the point in not using one. I can't remember what the speed penalty is for losing a side torso but it's probably mostly if not completely offset by going with a larger LFE with a much higher base speed. Not to mention the fact that for most of game you will have both side torsos. If heats the issue then you go light fero, drop to LFE 250 and add 2 DHS.

I dunno, using the std engine feels like you're building under the assumption that you will fail which is very uncharacteristic of competitive players. Maybe in practice that left torso falls off really quickly really often and he just got sick of it.

I suppose either way it's not a big deal if he's just hanging out in one spot for most of the game, but it does feel like that build is leaving something on the table.

[Y E O N N E]

Speed penalty is 20%. Losing a side torso, an LFE280 would run only 7 kph slower than a STD 250, 60.5 vs 67.5 kph. The real kicker is the fact that losing an ST with cXL and LFE means you lost the equivalent dissipation of 5x DHS. For a UAC/2 boat spitting out heat as fast as it is spitting out rounds and whose entire purpose is to control an approach with uninterrupted DPS, this is devastating.

[Jman5]

Yeonne Greene, on 12 December 2017 - 09:03 PM, said:

Speed penalty is 20%. Losing a side torso, an LFE280 would run only 7 kph slower than a STD 250, 60.5 vs 67.5 kph. The real kicker is the fact that losing an ST with cXL and LFE means you lost the equivalent dissipation of 5x DHS. For a UAC/2 boat spitting out heat as fast as it is spitting out rounds and whose entire purpose is to control an approach with uninterrupted DPS, this is devastating.

Thanks. I think it's a LFE 285, so just under 6 kph slower if you lose your ST.

The issue I have with the standard engine is that you're building like losing that side torso is a foregone conclusion. You apply that same logic to other things and you're equipping things like CASE. This is what I mean by building to fail.

Think about what you could do otherwise. If triple UAC/2 runs hot on tourmaline (which it might, I don't play it), then why not go LFE 250 + 2DHS? Now for 90% of the match where you probably still have both torsos you're able to be more effective. On the off chance you do lose that ST, you've still got those 2 DHS. So it's 7-ish.

I can only think of three reasons for the standard. Either the LT falls off super fast all the time because he tanks with it, or the build runs just cool enough with 10 DHS but falls apart with 5-7 DHS, or he built this mech ages ago and just didn't bother changing the engine because it was working good enough.

Anyway, do what you guys want. My humble suggestion though is to give the LFE a shot before you downgrade to the standard.

[Curccu]

Lightfoot, on 12 December 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

Ammo is on the wrong side. If it blows up you have no weapons. Ammo in head slot is pretty safe.

150 damage per ton for ammo explosion, doesn't matter where it is, you die without case.
+ chance of ammo explosion is very small

Dee Eight, on 12 December 2017 - 04:43 PM, said:

Wayyyy to much ammo for the 8v8 format of comp games. Could have dropped a ton and stuck a RL15 into the CT.

Yep noob Proton, doesn't have a clue what he is doing...

[Khobai]

dario03, on 12 December 2017 - 06:04 PM, said:

I think the "new" thing is the free look to shoot to the side for better shielding. Though that isn't new, its just very under used.

Unless theres something else new that I don't know of.

its not new. people having been using free look with dragons for as long as I can remember.

whats new is that the dragon was never really considered comp worthy before

Quote

Actually watched the match, the gun wasn't clipping the torso. Shooting under it.

part of the arm and the top gun barrel definitely clips through the side torso and leg if you freelook the max distance. ive showed pictures of it in the other thread.

the arm being partially clipped inside the torso is what makes it hard to hit.

since theres 100% picture proof evidence of clipping, I dont understand the point of continuing to deny it.

its like those people that still insist the earth is flat.




lmao look at how clipped it is, the top barrel is sticking through the CT grill of the mech. And the middle barrel is going through the right side torso.

"theres no clipping" lmao ahahahaahh youre hilarious

but yeah THATS why the arm is hard to hit; the combination of clipping and torso twisting.

I mean theres nothing wrong with doing it, but PGI should probably fix it lol.

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The issue I have with the standard engine is that you're building like losing that side torso is a foregone conclusion.

yeah I mean you should experiment yourself.

maybe the lfe works fine. or maybe you find you do lose the side torso often enough that the std engine is worth it.

Edited by Khobai, 13 December 2017 - 06:08 AM.

[Juodas Varnas]

Khobai, on 13 December 2017 - 05:20 AM, said:

yeah its not new. people having been using free look with dragons for as long as I can remember.

whats new is that the dragon was never really considered comp worthy before



part of the arm and the top gun barrel definitely clips through the side torso and leg if you freelook the max distance. ive showed pictures of it in the other thread.

the arm being partially clipped inside the torso is what makes it hard to hit.

since theres 100% picture proof evidence, I dont understand the point of continuing to deny it.

its like those people that still insist the earth is flat.

Yeap, the arm totally clips into the body.

Wouldn't happen if it was high-mounted like it's supposed to be

[Khobai]

Quote

Yeap, the arm totally clips into the body.

Wouldn't happen if it was high-mounted like it's supposed to be

well people have been asking for the dragon's right arm to be cockpit level as long as I can remember too lol. PGI doesnt seem to care.

[GabrielSun]

Many drops the last few days I've seen these run by people who are less than stellar pilots. Blow their arm and a leg off in a few seconds of fire and let them stew. Just more proof to the fact that just because Proton does something doesn't mean that it's a good idea for everyone.

[dario03]

Khobai, on 13 December 2017 - 05:20 AM, said:

its not new. people having been using free look with dragons for as long as I can remember.

whats new is that the dragon was never really considered comp worthy before

Well yeah, I said that it wasn't new, its just under used. Because while its always been an option and gets some use, it isn't used that much and some don't even know about it.

Also I'm pretty sure the AC5 dragon saw some comp use back in the day.

[Snazzy Dragon]

dario03, on 13 December 2017 - 11:15 PM, said:

Well yeah, I said that it wasn't new, its just under used. Because while its always been an option and gets some use, it isn't used that much and some don't even know about it.

Also I'm pretty sure the AC5 dragon saw some comp use back in the day.

Probably has something to do with the old 50% cooldown quirk

[dario03]

Snazzy Dragon, on 13 December 2017 - 11:16 PM, said:

Probably has something to do with the old 50% cooldown quirk

Maaayyyyyyybe.
Also maybe when knockdowns were a thing, they might have seen some use for some reason....

Edited by dario03, 13 December 2017 - 11:37 PM.