46 replies to this topic

[B0oN]

Training, training, training and getting used to it, OP, that´s all thats needed and all we expect from anyone ...

[Zeoraimer]

Fixing Convergence: When you do not hit "r", all your weapons fires forwards. In the exact shape of your mech.

So a kodiak facing centralised and dead on another a kodiak, your RA hits his LA, your LT hits his RT.

[Mole]

Curccu, on 10 January 2018 - 07:46 AM, said:

Convergency is still same and both weapons still have their own independent path (from weapon location to where your crosshair located at the time you pulled the trigger) but you have less chance to landing them into same component with chainfire, which is usually what everyone wants.

Look, if I fire both ERPPCs from my Adder with the same click while leading a target, one of them is likely to miss. If I do two trigger pulls, one for each ERPPC, then both ERPPCs hit.

[MauttyKoray]

Minamitsu, on 10 January 2018 - 03:46 AM, said:

So have tried using the King Crab as well as the Nightstars, and can't stand using them with anything except LBX ACs because of how aiming works.
When a target is moving you will need to lead them to get a hit, but your weapons focus on the point your crosshair is at. So if you try to lead a target with weapons so far apart, it's like you are shooting at two different targets.
Personally, I would love to see an option to where your weapons adjust to the distance of a locked target when you are aiming near it.

Learn to not fire all your weapons at once? Also, you're playing a walking tank game, a vehicle, with weapons placed at various locations across it. You're not shooting out of a single, human sized character directly from your stomach.

The way the system works for projectiles is actually great how it is and requires the player to think about what/how they're shooting. Thus punishing players with lower returns when they just spam their fire.

[Mystere]

AlphaEtOmega, on 10 January 2018 - 04:19 AM, said:

So basically you want an aimbot?

Don't be daft.

Setting Convergence Point To Distance To Locked Target <> Aimbot


<smh>

Bombast, on 10 January 2018 - 04:25 AM, said:

That would actually be kind of neat, and it may inspire more people to push R (Come on, people. I know some of you are just trying to spite LRM boats, but seriously, press R to know where to shoot, homing weapons or not).

That said, it really shouldn't be that much of an issue, especially for something that's almost certainly carrying short range ballistics. If you're having problems leading under the current system, adding 'auto-range' is not going to help you. Your shots are still going to go into the dirt.

The reason LB-Xs are working better for you is simply because they have greater velocity, so there's less leading to be done.

But the current way automatic convergence works is silly when it comes to ballistics (i.e. leading).

Edited by Mystere, 10 January 2018 - 12:54 PM.

[Mystere]

BTGbullseye, on 10 January 2018 - 05:02 AM, said:

Convergence should be crosshair based fixed or zero, unless you have a target locked, then based on the lock distance.

FTFY.

[Mystere]

SilentScreamer, on 10 January 2018 - 07:26 AM, said:

Love this idea!

To those posting about having a aim-assist rather than convergence.... Do you really want to see 3 different recticles floating on the screen? Weapon fire travels at different velocities, so if you have a PPC, SRMs and an AC, each travels at a different velocity so unless your target is stationary your aim-assist would show 3 seperate lead indicators. Much too confusing to be of value in-game unless your mech only uses one or two specific weapons.

I don't know about other people, but I myself would like 3 reticles: one for each arm and one for torso-mounted weapons.

[Cyzxxikz]

MauttyKoray, on 10 January 2018 - 09:58 AM, said:

Learn to not fire all your weapons at once? Also, you're playing a walking tank game, a vehicle, with weapons placed at various locations across it. You're not shooting out of a single, human sized character directly from your stomach.

The way the system works for projectiles is actually great how it is and requires the player to think about what/how they're shooting. Thus punishing players with lower returns when they just spam their fire.

agreed 100% this is why I always have separate groupings for each side of a mech (pretty much spate groupings for anything I can hit with at 500m+ below that and I don't care)

[ANOM O MECH]

MrMadguy, on 10 January 2018 - 03:58 AM, said:

+1 This is the real reason, why Lights are so invulnerable. Implement this change and they all will die as quick, as they should. Some people have an illusion, that hitreg is broken in this game, just because they unload their 2xGauss alpha into Light's CT, crosshair flashes, indicating hit, so they assume, that whole 30 dmg is done. But... It isn't the case, as one weapon missed and another hit Light's arm due to crappy convergence.

I've been asking for this change for a long time already, cuz it's just pointless crap, that we have weapons, that need leading, and for our TC it's easier to converge weapons on some arbitrary point on a ground, than on our real target.

Lights invulnerable?

You and I are playing a different game.

[gooddragon2]

AlphaEtOmega, on 10 January 2018 - 04:19 AM, said:

So basically you want an aimbot?

http://www.infinitel...68Ws&p=n#/60;65

It's hard to see it, but at 1:00 to 1:05 there's a little red + sign that shows you where to lead your shots. Drifts in from the upper left.

Edited by gooddragon2, 10 January 2018 - 02:55 PM.

[Maxxi]

With ballistic weapons you need to get used the proyectile speed. I have a king crab and I learned how to shoot a moving target with two AC20. Not a skillshot, but a good hit can destroy a leg. And you don't waste ammo. Get used to the speed and you can anticipate where's gonna hit.

[Lozruet Gravemind]

Minamitsu, on 10 January 2018 - 03:46 AM, said:

So have tried using the King Crab as well as the Nightstars, and can't stand using them with anything except LBX ACs because of how aiming works.
When a target is moving you will need to lead them to get a hit, but your weapons focus on the point your crosshair is at. So if you try to lead a target with weapons so far apart, it's like you are shooting at two different targets.
Personally, I would love to see an option to where your weapons adjust to the distance of a locked target when you are aiming near it.

As much as it gets lambasted I think PGI could actually take a cue from Battlefront II. Criterion designed the Starfighter assault and included a circle that precalculates the lead time needed to hit a target. The ship may be at one spot but there will be a white circle outside it or off center to show where you need to aim to hit the target. The faster the target is moving the further from center the circle gets, indicating the lead needed.

[Lozruet Gravemind]

gooddragon2, on 10 January 2018 - 02:52 PM, said:

http://www.infinitel...68Ws&p=n#/60;65

It's hard to see it, but at 1:00 to 1:05 there's a little red + sign that shows you where to lead your shots. Drifts in from the upper left.

Better and newer example of that is Battlefront II. If you look there is a white circle slightly ahead of enemy ships to indicate where shots have to land to actually hit the target.

https://youtu.be/1-cGSWsZetA

[kuma8877]

Lozruet Gravemind, on 10 January 2018 - 06:10 PM, said:

Better and newer example of that is Battlefront II. If you look there is a white circle slightly ahead of enemy ships to indicate where shots have to land to actually hit the target.

https://youtu.be/1-cGSWsZetA

Star Citizen has two versions of this. Lead or Lag PIP's. Lead is as you'd think, estimated shot placement by "leading" the target (easier to learn but less accurate overall). Lag actually has you aiming your reticle at what you want to hit, and then calculates the shots to do so (harder to learn but more accurate overall). You get PIP's for each weapon type which can get crazy when they have different ROF's and round speed... PIP's everywhere!

Edited by kuma8877, 10 January 2018 - 06:36 PM.

[gooddragon2]

Lozruet Gravemind, on 10 January 2018 - 06:10 PM, said:

Better and newer example of that is Battlefront II. If you look there is a white circle slightly ahead of enemy ships to indicate where shots have to land to actually hit the target.

https://youtu.be/1-cGSWsZetA

I'd prefer the white circle, but ultimately it's better for me if this doesn't go through because it hurts light mechs a bit.

[Brain Cancer]

Honestly, we've needed something like "Press R for convergence" for a while. You have target info? You get convergence to range of target. You don't? Default convergence mode instead. TCs would improve convergence simply because they get target info faster as one of their bonuses.

[Jettrik Ryflix]

BTGbullseye, on 10 January 2018 - 05:02 AM, said:

Convergence should be crosshair based, unless you have a target locked, then based on the lock distance.

Sounds good in theory, but imagine in the heat of battle? If you decide to turn and shoot anything besides your current target, your weapons will converge before or after your enemy.

Say, if your "target" is at 200m, but you go for a shot at an enemy 600m away... you miss completely, even if the enemy is standing still.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

B0oN, on 10 January 2018 - 07:54 AM, said:

Training, training, training and getting used to it, OP, that´s all thats needed and all we expect from anyone ...

You can't train away the distance between the arms of a King Crab.

Do people really not understand how convergence works here? Do I need a diagram?

Here's a Diagram.



Note how since you are leading the target you are aiming out infront of it so the guns will converge out in space. The King Crab is wide enough that the locust fits between its arms, this means that if you were to lead perfectly you will miss entirely. Instead you must lead with just one arm while perfectly accounting for the distance between that arm and your cockpit, then you can fire that one arm's gun and potentially hit with that then repeat for the other.

Basically you can never hit a locust that is moving at top speed with both of your guns on the king crab at once if you must lead with them so much that your crosshair is no longer touching any part of the locust. Aiming for legs gives you a better chance since the ground is there closer than the sky is so convergence becomes closer together.

[Zeoraimer]

Dakota1000, on 10 January 2018 - 08:25 PM, said:

I liked your post because I think that was a great diagram. I want to see more diagrams with other animal named mechs being represented.

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Minamitsu, on 10 January 2018 - 03:46 AM, said:

So have tried using the King Crab as well as the Nightstars, and can't stand using them with anything except LBX ACs because of how aiming works.
When a target is moving you will need to lead them to get a hit, but your weapons focus on the point your crosshair is at. So if you try to lead a target with weapons so far apart, it's like you are shooting at two different targets.
Personally, I would love to see an option to where your weapons adjust to the distance of a locked target when you are aiming near it.

Dakota1000, on 10 January 2018 - 08:25 PM, said:

You can't train away the distance between the arms of a King Crab.

Do people really not understand how convergence works here? Do I need a diagram?

Here's a Diagram.



Note how since you are leading the target you are aiming out infront of it so the guns will converge out in space. The King Crab is wide enough that the locust fits between its arms, this means that if you were to lead perfectly you will miss entirely. Instead you must lead with just one arm while perfectly accounting for the distance between that arm and your cockpit, then you can fire that one arm's gun and potentially hit with that then repeat for the other.

Basically you can never hit a locust that is moving at top speed with both of your guns on the king crab at once if you must lead with them so much that your crosshair is no longer touching any part of the locust. Aiming for legs gives you a better chance since the ground is there closer than the sky is so convergence becomes closer together.

Try to get a bit higher ground, when you lead the target. You will then have your weapons converge just a few meters behind the moving mech and you will be able to get both arms of your mech to unload their weapons into the enemy.

Edited by Cara Carcass, 11 January 2018 - 06:17 AM.