325 replies to this topic

[MovinTarget]

Nerfs and buffs would not be such a hot button issue if it was only ever meta v meta and/or tater v tater in all modes. This isn't the case so you are going to to have non-meta players protest even though these changes (often) are made in an effort to keep *them* alive longer. Its rather ironic.

[Reposter]

So... does changing the Heat Gen Skill Nodes make life difficult or impossible for Clan mechs now? I use some Clan and IS mechs myself and feel that Clan mechs do not exactly have SUPER high heat threshold for my Hellbringer and Direwolf builds? I do not know.. maybe Clan ER medium lasers should have their cooldown decreased... to help make Clan Energy builds not unviable?

[Alcom Isst]

Dee Eight, on 20 January 2018 - 06:57 AM, said:

Failed at the math again eh ? 4 x 3 tons per launcher vs 3 x 4 tons per launcher.... where is this +4 tons coming from ? Its the same weight to get 6 less missiles per volley, but with much tighter spread with all three launchers being in the same side torso.

Oh my bad, I assumed the 4xSRM6 was a typo. 4xSRM4 is the common Assassin-21 loadout.

Edited by Alcom Isst, 22 January 2018 - 07:16 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

Reposter, on 22 January 2018 - 05:56 AM, said:

So... does changing the Heat Gen Skill Nodes make life difficult or impossible for Clan mechs now? I use some Clan and IS mechs myself and feel that Clan mechs do not exactly have SUPER high heat threshold for my Hellbringer and Direwolf builds? I do not know.. maybe Clan ER medium lasers should have their cooldown decreased... to help make Clan Energy builds not unviable?

It hurts the Lights, IFRs, VPRs, and SHCs and nothing else. It should be rolled back or those 'Mechs should get quirks tbqh.

[Sir Immortal Shadow]

I'm really struggling to understand why people are saying clan laser builds are in jeopardy.
I'll admit my experience is still pretty limited, but I do know good builds and bad builds, and I've consistently seen properly made clan laser builds of all flavours do well for themselves. Both in my personal experience, and from watching videos like Baradul's Molten Metal channel.
People are also saying the Clan ERML is much better than the C MPL, when the pulse laser is much more heat efficient and short burned, which are usually people's biggest complaints about clan lasers. As far as I know, the C MPL is also keeping its optimal range (I think) which is crazy long compared to the IS one. And as an IS player who makes heavy use of the MPL, I'm really satisfied with its performance and don't want to see it buffed.
I am a little scared and excited of what Piranha's could do with MPLs, or a mix of medium and small pulse or heavy lasers, sprinkle machine guns. Harassers with speed, some range and some DPS. Those could be a real flankers dream.

Edited by Sir Immortal Shadow, 22 January 2018 - 08:43 AM.

[Luminis]

valrond, on 22 January 2018 - 01:37 AM, said:

Oh, and unlike many of you, I'm not just a one side player. I play MWO, I have mechs from both sides, but seeing the same side getting nerfed and the other one buffed makes me sick.

Funny. I do, too.

Yes, seeing nerfs pop up for well over half my 'Mechs (because I've been leaning Clan over IS) kinda sucks. However, since my Clan 'Mechs are, at present, still the better performers for me, I can't really be too mad about it.

Reposter, on 22 January 2018 - 05:56 AM, said:

So... does changing the Heat Gen Skill Nodes make life difficult or impossible for Clan mechs now?

You'll barely notice it, unless you're able notice the quarter of a second it'll take to cool off the additional heat.

[Grim 13]

Clam buffs next patch cycle please, yes? :3

Getting tired of half my 'Mechs becoming more and more worthless by the patch.

P.S. Wanna bring balance back to the Force? Nuke the Linebacker armor quirks (it's speed is it's armor), reduce IS armor quirks in general (they are insane atm.) and stop increasing time to kill to cater to players who can't play. All that has done so far is increase the use of cheesy tactics and builds you can't do anything about because it will ruin other 'Mechs and playstyles.

Edited by Grim 13, 22 January 2018 - 09:17 AM.

[MovinTarget]

Grim 13, on 22 January 2018 - 09:04 AM, said:

Clam buffs next patch cycle please, yes? :3

Getting tired of half my 'Mechs becoming more and more worthless by the patch.

Define worthless plz. If weapons and/or mechs are generally overperforming and get nerfed, doesn't that mean that the OTHER half of your mechs are actually now more valuable?

Edited by MovinTarget, 22 January 2018 - 09:18 AM.

[Johnathan Tanner]

Grim 13, on 22 January 2018 - 09:04 AM, said:

Getting tired of half my 'Mechs becoming more and more worthless by the patch.

[Grim 13]

Mcgral18, on 21 January 2018 - 06:35 PM, said:

Would you rather take the 3 slot 7 ton 10 damage isERPPC
or
The 6 ton 2 slot 15 damage cERPPC


Unless it hits 7 seconds, cERPPC every time

I don't know if you know this but... only 10 of that 15 Clan ERPPC damage is pinpoint, the other 5 spreads to up to 2 adjacent components.
So unless you're damage farming and not going for killshots, you're at a disadvantage with your Clan ERPPC VS your IS counterpart. And that's not even considering the quirk disadvantage Clams have

[Grim 13]

MovinTarget, on 22 January 2018 - 09:17 AM, said:

Define worthless plz. If weapons and/or mechs are generally overperforming and get nerfed, doesn't that mean that the OTHER half of your mechs are actually now more valuable?

Well, the problem is that the faction getting nerfed is not GENERALLY overperforming, but rather has a few builds that do. Yet the nerfs are covering the entire faction. And on the other hand the faction that currently is over performing is still getting buffed. Almost like PGI has a plan of action and are unwilling to alter it when something clearly goes wrong.

My final point is I don't want to be forced to pick and chose which 'Mech builds or faction I have to play to have a good time, but right now I kind of have to... either you're IS, or you're a 12 man of Linebackers

[Mcgral18]

Grim 13, on 22 January 2018 - 09:32 AM, said:

I don't know if you know this but... only 10 of that 15 Clan ERPPC damage is pinpoint, the other 5 spreads to up to 2 adjacent components.
So unless you're damage farming and not going for killshots, you're at a disadvantage with your Clan ERPPC VS your IS counterpart. And that's not even considering the quirk disadvantage Clams have

...really?

Name me a quirked Spheroid poptart, which works better than the quirked Clam poptarts. I'm not sure you can.

[Luminis]

Grim 13, on 22 January 2018 - 09:40 AM, said:

Well, the problem is that the faction getting nerfed is not GENERALLY overperforming, but rather has a few builds that do.

Both factions have good and bad builds. The IS, too, has just a couple of high performers (which can't hang with the top performers on the Clan side still). I bet I can list you a bad or, at best, adequate IS chassis for every bad or, at best, adequate Clan chassis you can come up with.

PGI not helping the inferior 'Mechs on either side and balance within the respective factions being horrible is a huge issue, albeit a different one. I don't know when they'll get around to at least fixing glaring mistakes like not putting durability quirks on the Dire Wolf, completely nuking any semblance of mobility the Spirit Bear had or slapping negative quirks on good ol' Tibbers...

[Grim 13]

Mcgral18, on 22 January 2018 - 09:42 AM, said:

...really?

Name me a quirked Spheroid poptart, which works better than the quirked Clam poptarts. I'm not sure you can.

My double ERPPC Vindicator can hang with any PPC Summoner even with the 25t difference ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
It's my only dedicated PPC 'Mech I'm willing to push into a brawling role and are still able to poptart/snipe with. Never had that same feeling with any Clam PPC build

[Mcgral18]

Grim 13, on 22 January 2018 - 10:17 AM, said:

My double ERPPC Vindicator can hang with any PPC Summoner even with the 25t difference ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
It's my only dedicated PPC 'Mech I'm willing to push into a brawling role and are still able to poptart/snipe with. Never had that same feeling with any Clam PPC build

I'm having a feeling of overwhelming doubt right now

BJ, maybe
Griffin, quite possibly, I've been enjoying HPPCs with him


But low mounted Vindi?
He has quirks, but geometry doesn't support poptarting very well

[MovinTarget]

Grim 13, on 22 January 2018 - 09:40 AM, said:

Well, the problem is that the faction getting nerfed is not GENERALLY overperforming,

considering they have nerfed specific chassis in the past, why would they nerf systems in general rather than just those chassis unless the over performance is more widespread than you've observed.

...and unless you've hacked Russ' email and can produce the documents where he states "Nerf those clans! I just want to see the clanfanboys cry!" you can't use the "because PGI hates clans" argument.

considering they have nerfed specific chassis in the past

[Conner Ward]

So far I have replaced my CSPLs with CERSLs and my CLPLs / CMPLs with the Heavy variants and it has worked well, since the extra tonnage left lets me add more CHS to offset some of the additional heat from the Heavy lasers. Yes, the insanely long burn time of Heavy lasers takes some getting used to, but at least those lasers do additional damage to compensate for that. CMPLs still seem to compliment CLMGs though.

Edited by Conner Ward, 22 January 2018 - 12:17 PM.

[Squarebasher]

I thought I would try light gauss so I did today and it is already a pretty good weapon with a current DPS of 2.46 with virtually no heat V the CERPPC with a DPS of 2.50 and as we know a massive heat output which is now going to be more if you have got any of the heat skill nods, and lower DPS. So why PGI why.

"Heat Gen Design Notes: After reviewing the net benefit provided by the Heat Gen Nodes within the Firepower Tree, we have determined that the original values were providing inflated benefits on the Clan side compared to the benefits offered for IS 'Mechs. This change is therefore aimed at bringing the net benefits between the two factions closer in line, accounting for a typical Clan Loadout and a typical Inner Sphere Loadout."
This statement by PGI is absolute rubbish, of course it gives more benefits to clan LASERS they are all hotter in the first place. If I look at things from another view then why do the IS get so much more from the laser duration quirk, we are not talking a measly 0.15 here it is 1.25 better than clan? And really I am not that botherd it is just this drip drip effect against clan weapons every patch.

Really at the moment in QP the balance is pretty good, SO PGI WILL YOU STOP FIDDLING ABOUT WITH IT AND GIVE US SOME MORE MAPS, AND WHILE I AM AT IT WHO CARES ABOUT SOLARIS GIVE US SOME MORE MAPS, 2 IN HOW MANY YEARS IS NOT ENOUGH.

[Luminis]

Squarebasher, on 22 January 2018 - 12:34 PM, said:

I thought I would try light gauss so I did today and it is already a pretty good weapon with a current DPS of 2.46 with virtually no heat V the CERPPC with a DPS of 2.50 and as we know a massive heat output which is now going to be more if you have got any of the heat skill nods, and lower DPS. So why PGI why.

Are you comparing a 12-ton gauss rifle that deals 8 damage per shot to the cERPPC that weighs half as much and deals 10+5 damage?

Squarebasher, on 22 January 2018 - 12:34 PM, said:

This statement by PGI is absolute rubbish, of course it gives more benefits to clan LASERS they are all hotter in the first place. If I look at things from another view then why do the IS get so much more from the laser duration quirk, we are not talking a measly 0.15 here it is 1.25 better than clan?

Same concept: Lower base value = higher percentage nodes, higher base value = lower percentage nodes.

[MovinTarget]

Luminis, on 22 January 2018 - 12:53 PM, said:

Same concept: Lower base value = higher percentage nodes, higher base value = lower percentage nodes.

I am almost of the opposite mind where the benefits be front loaded with diminishing returns, encouraging variety instead of specialization.