73 replies to this topic

[sycocys]

Moral of the story is - if it beats you then it's OP and the only thing that can be done is PGI nerfing whatever it was into non-existence.

[Razorfish]

Terminus C54, on 21 January 2018 - 03:57 AM, said:

I am very angry about the unfair Light Mech speed . A single Assault have no chance against these Mechs. That means go alone with Assault and you will be killed by a Mech witch cost lower than the half of your Mech.
This realy idiotic game mechanic kill a lot of fun in the game and a lot of tactical oportunitys in game.

I wish me a fair play , slow down the light Mech speed that they cant run faster as the turning speed of other Mech.
Or give us the oportunity to vote out light Mech from Matches.

That’s why my favorite medium mechs have 18-20 streaks, a probe, and a 2-3 ERML.

That’s also why a lot of my heavy and assault mechs have 12-18 streaks, a probe, plus…

I see light mechs consistently having the highest damage in any given game, and that is broken. The delves will not do anything about it, and light pilots scream that it is all about skill… it’s not, skill has nothing to do with it. It’s all about bad hit reg and stupid speed. So you have to fix it yourself. The best tool for fixing the issues is streaks!

[TWIAFU]

Der Geisterbaer, on 21 January 2018 - 06:37 AM, said:

And then we just have to wait for 4 AMS OP! threads

Oh, already seen that in CW, but not OP, but 'cheaters' was the word.

[Angus McFife VI]

Terminus C54, on 21 January 2018 - 03:57 AM, said:

I am very angry about the unfair Light Mech speed . A single Assault have no chance against these Mechs. That means go alone with Assault and you will be killed by a Mech witch cost lower than the half of your Mech.
This realy idiotic game mechanic kill a lot of fun in the game and a lot of tactical oportunitys in game.

I wish me a fair play , slow down the light Mech speed that they cant run faster as the turning speed of other Mech.
Or give us the oportunity to vote out light Mech from Matches.

Actually many lights that have gotten near my Atlas have gotten insta-rekt by my heavy gauss or AC/20.

Edited by Dont LRM me please, 21 January 2018 - 10:28 AM.

[TWIAFU]

Mcgral18, on 21 January 2018 - 08:15 AM, said:

https://leaderboard....?u=Terminus+C54


Oh, look at that
He hasn't played any Lights.


Hm....

[Seranov]

Razorfish, on 21 January 2018 - 10:21 AM, said:

That’s why my favorite medium mechs have 18-20 streaks, a probe, and a 2-3 ERML.

That’s also why a lot of my heavy and assault mechs have 12-18 streaks, a probe, plus…

I see light mechs consistently having the highest damage in any given game, and that is broken. The delves will not do anything about it, and light pilots scream that it is all about skill… it’s not, skill has nothing to do with it. It’s all about bad hit reg and stupid speed. So you have to fix it yourself. The best tool for fixing the issues is streaks!

I have no issues shooting lights with my weapons. I am confident most other people don't, either. I get eaten alive by lights if they catch me alone in a place I can't get my back to a wall, and that's intentional. When they're actually in front of me, in a place I can point my weapons, they are no more scary than any other mech, and that is also intentional.

[Laser Kiwi]

When i started i played lights. My first season my kill death ratio was 0.16, my second 0.40. Mostly lights. They are not OP, till the pilot improves they are dead in the water.

I'm a better player now so that has changed.

Some mechs have hitreg issues, sure, but in reality you might hit my commando with a ppc for example, but if you group that with anything else the difference in speed and convergence means everything else misses at top speed, AS IT SHOULD. In table top the only thing that kept lights alive was moving maximum hexes for maximum hit penalty and winning initiative and getting behind the enemy out of firing arcs. This is no different in MWO and is true of plenty of games.

Having said that, if i wander out in my dual snub plus ac 20 build, i'm not worried about lights unless i'm engaged and don't notice them.

Also to do most damage to a particular area a lot of people will stop and shoot and then move, when they stop the light is vulnerable.

Also if i'm in a light and another big mech is near by, ie not the one im shooting at, i'm vulnerable.

As for lights doing heaps of damage, it happens, but often its because when you get behind the enemy you are in prime possie for those air strikes and arty's, and whilst my locust might occasionally get 800 damage, if i want 1000 plus i need something bigger usually.

I'm not saying pilots don't get 1000+ in lights, i'm just saying its easier in a big mech

And for crying out loud for the 1 millionth time, even though i hate telling people this cause i like lights.

SHOOT THE LEGS, 2 hit locations is more vulnerable than 5

and if you get one leg, you quickly learn there are no major hit reg issues

Dont LRM me please, on 21 January 2018 - 10:28 AM, said:

Actually many lights that have gotten near my Atlas have gotten insta-rekt by my heavy gauss or AC/20.

And i wonder how many double gauss will be potshotting the new pirahna, rather than the usual streak crap

Edited by Laser Kiwi, 21 January 2018 - 10:47 AM.

[WrathOfDeadguy]

Salt miners gonna salt. It's way easier than the alternative, which involves a lot more "git" and "gud."

Disable arm lock. Arm lock is your enemy when fighting lights, especially if you're in an assault. Arm rotation speed is vastly superior to torso speed, so if your target crosses your firing arc at all, you can tag it with your arm weapons. With torso lock on, you're limited to tracking targets at your much slower torso turn rate, and all of your weapons are limited to your torso's range of motion (which is- and this should go without saying- more limited than your arms).

Mount arm weapons in the first place. If you have the mounts, and don't use them, you have no excuse. Even a pair of medlas is dangerous to a light 'Mech, if your aim is good and you hold it on their hips.

Aim for the hips. You know, that magical place where the legs meet the torso? That's the universal weak spot. If you shoot for the hips, then your shots will connect with either the legs (good) or the CT (also good). When someone tells you to shoot the legs, they don't mean you should try to hit the wildly flailing lower bits, they mean the top of the legs, where the hitboxes aren't bouncing around as much.

Back it up. Observe the direction the light is circling in. Back up and turn the other way. You will cut across their circle, and as they come around they will be heading straight for your guns. Shoot them with your guns. At the very least, you've forced them onto the defensive, which buys you some time in which you are no longer getting shot. Use that opportunity to reposition, which leads us to our next point...

Use cover. See that wall? Back all that junk in the trunk right up to it and park dat azz. You see, a light cannot circle you if it has to phase through a wall to do it. That ability is exclusive to dropships in MWO.

Use comms. Get on the mic, and repeat after me: "I've got a light on me, need help!" Then call out your location. Use the command wheel's "enemy spotted" function to call the enemy's position on the map.

Press R. Target the enemy! If they're on your allies' sensors, your allies will be more likely to shoot the pest. If you're having problems with stealth lights, then start carrying ECM counters like BAP/CAP, and UAVs. If you're using (ugh) guided missiles, you should already have a TAG, so light them up with that too. The more visible you make the enemy light, the tastier they look to your allies.

Don't wander off alone. Elephants are remarkably tough creatures. They are fully capable of stomping the everloving hell out of damned near anything that threatens them. They have giant tusks which can turn any lesser animal into an instant shishkebab. They also stick with their herds, because they're smart creatures, and they know that if they wander off alone they are still vulnerable to smaller, faster creatures. Be like the elephant. If you act like food, you will be food.

Don't panic. Panic kills more pilots than meta cheese. If you flail around like a headless chicken and fire your weapons without being sure of a hit, then all you're doing is wasting ammo (and heat), and making the light driver laugh. Nothing warms a light driver's heart like a panicking fatso ripe for the kill. Keep your cool, work the problem, and most importantly fire only when you know you're going to hit something. You have more armor than they do, and you can abuse the hell out of that advantage if you keep your wits about you. Counter their turn, get your crosshairs on target, and you can ruin their day with one good shot.


As you develop these crucial skills, bear in mind that some weapons splatter lights better than others. If you want to be maximally dangerous to these minimal machines, make space in your loadout for the following weapons:

PULSE LASERS. Accept no substitute for the best of the vest. Streaks need not apply. Wubs are histcan, and the puke up a lot of hurt very quickly. That makes them ideal for legging. For bonus points, they're also effective against 'Mechs that aren't armored with tissue paper.

LBX. Shotguns are used by bird hunters for a reason. If your aim isn't good enough to slap lights with PPFLD, some damage may be better than none at all. LBX ACs also run very cool, so even if that dastardly light has brought a flamer to the party, you can still shoot them without any danger of self-immolation. Take heed, however, of the First Commandment of the Scattergun: Bringest Thou Thy Biggest Cannon. Don't try to kill lights with LB5X and LB2X; they haven't got the throw weight. Go big or go home.

Streaks. They're lazymode, but they're quite effective at sandblasting light 'Mechs down to their wee little bones. That's... pretty much all they're good at, really. So, y'know, if you don't mind sucking moose nuts at anything over about 45 tons, I guess they're an option.

SRMs. They're like streaks, but with aiming skill! That means you can focus legs with them, so focus the bloody legs with them. SRMs pack a metric arseload of damage into a very small space. They also work against big game, unlike Streaks.

Edited by WrathOfDeadguy, 21 January 2018 - 11:22 AM.

[Windscape]

Lights do not need to be nerfed, they have been nerfed lots before. If anything, some assaults need some more mobility quarks.
Other that, everyone else has summed up my thoughts really well.

[Grus]

Terminus C54, on 21 January 2018 - 03:57 AM, said:

I am very angry about the unfair Light Mech speed . A single Assault have no chance against these Mechs. That means go alone with Assault and you will be killed by a Mech witch cost lower than the half of your Mech.
This realy idiotic game mechanic kill a lot of fun in the game and a lot of tactical oportunitys in game.

I wish me a fair play , slow down the light Mech speed that they cant run faster as the turning speed of other Mech.
Or give us the oportunity to vote out light Mech from Matches.

I'm guessing you're new here. As an assault never go alone, always be around others for support. So if you're getting harassed by light mech's you can call and receive support. And don't forget to enable VOIP.

[Lykaon]

ApolloKaras, on 21 January 2018 - 08:59 AM, said:

As a light pilot (predominantly)... I would have to say that many many kills were a result of an assault that had bad positioning. However there are many many pilots that could pluck a pimento out of an olive from 1200m with a gauss rifle, and will have no issues blowing me up if I make a mistake.

I would work on Positioning, and Aim.


To McGral's point you should really take out a few lights, get a view from the other side.

I also have played light mechs with some frequency and you and I both know what to do when you see an assault mech that looks vulnerable suddenly cuts into reverse and counter turns against a light's strafing run or calmly backs up to shield it's rear and flanks...

Skip it and find a more vulnerable target because a light mech can not afford to get hit by an assault mech even once.

So I guess what the OP needs is to learn to at least look dangerous even if they can't shoot straight (yet). Most of the skilled light pilots won't mess around fighting an assault mech pilot that can position well.

[Lykaon]

Razorfish, on 21 January 2018 - 10:21 AM, said:

That’s why my favorite medium mechs have 18-20 streaks, a probe, and a 2-3 ERML.

That’s also why a lot of my heavy and assault mechs have 12-18 streaks, a probe, plus…

I see light mechs consistently having the highest damage in any given game, and that is broken. The delves will not do anything about it, and light pilots scream that it is all about skill… it’s not, skill has nothing to do with it. It’s all about bad hit reg and stupid speed. So you have to fix it yourself. The best tool for fixing the issues is streaks!

You won't see many light mechs topping the charts in higher teirs where the players have learned to shoot straight(er). You may see a light mech pulling in some great damage numbers but in higher tier that is a reflection of the pilot over the mech.

Using the streak crutch may get you by until you have to actually have learned to shoot straight. And by and large to many streaks on a build makes you vulnerable to heavily armored targets that do have pinpoint aiming potential.

12 - 18 streaks even with clantech is 9-13 tons (3 tons per SSRM6 + 1 ton ammo per launcher + CAP) in weapons that utterly suck at punching thick armor and are made 100% worthless the instant multiple ECM are in range.

I recommend just learning to shoot straight those streaks become more and more nitch in higher tiers.

[justcallme A S H]

Another thread about things being "OP" without the actual OP having any real idea about the state of balance of the game and the fact that lights are in one of the worst spots they have ever been.

Just another day on the MWO Forums really...

[Confessor Golab]

Yes, lets allow voting lights out of matches.

My friend, I dont usually post in here -though long-time lurker- but cant even begin telling you how misguided your assertions are...

As an assault, when you overextend,or make a small mistake, you lose a limb or some armor-you still have an armory of Gauss, particle cannons and a battery of various lasers.

As a light, when you make the smallest mistake;

-walk 2 centimeters too far and into a dual rotary cannon fire
-fail to spot the stealthed and immobile raven waiting just for that
-going full speed into a small obstacle which stops you cold
-slightly misjudging the radius of your turn around an enemy mech
-cresting that totally safe and too far from any lane hill, then staring at 2-3 surprised mediums.

...you become instantly vaporised, and your friends will politely suggest trying something simpler...perhaps a lurmer will do for starters?

Yeah, I usually play heavies, but have great respect for light jockeys,as its the most subtle and difficult class to master.

[pattonesque]

Shoot it in the legs my dude

[Dr Cara Carcass]

WrathOfDeadguy, on 21 January 2018 - 11:19 AM, said:

Salt miners gonna salt. It's way easier than the alternative, which involves a lot more "git" and "gud."

Disable arm lock. Arm lock is your enemy when fighting lights, especially if you're in an assault. Arm rotation speed is vastly superior to torso speed, so if your target crosses your firing arc at all, you can tag it with your arm weapons. With torso lock on, you're limited to tracking targets at your much slower torso turn rate, and all of your weapons are limited to your torso's range of motion (which is- and this should go without saying- more limited than your arms).

Mount arm weapons in the first place. If you have the mounts, and don't use them, you have no excuse. Even a pair of medlas is dangerous to a light 'Mech, if your aim is good and you hold it on their hips.

Aim for the hips. You know, that magical place where the legs meet the torso? That's the universal weak spot. If you shoot for the hips, then your shots will connect with either the legs (good) or the CT (also good). When someone tells you to shoot the legs, they don't mean you should try to hit the wildly flailing lower bits, they mean the top of the legs, where the hitboxes aren't bouncing around as much.

Back it up. Observe the direction the light is circling in. Back up and turn the other way. You will cut across their circle, and as they come around they will be heading straight for your guns. Shoot them with your guns. At the very least, you've forced them onto the defensive, which buys you some time in which you are no longer getting shot. Use that opportunity to reposition, which leads us to our next point...

Use cover. See that wall? Back all that junk in the trunk right up to it and park dat azz. You see, a light cannot circle you if it has to phase through a wall to do it. That ability is exclusive to dropships in MWO.

Use comms. Get on the mic, and repeat after me: "I've got a light on me, need help!" Then call out your location. Use the command wheel's "enemy spotted" function to call the enemy's position on the map.

Press R. Target the enemy! If they're on your allies' sensors, your allies will be more likely to shoot the pest. If you're having problems with stealth lights, then start carrying ECM counters like BAP/CAP, and UAVs. If you're using (ugh) guided missiles, you should already have a TAG, so light them up with that too. The more visible you make the enemy light, the tastier they look to your allies.

Don't wander off alone. Elephants are remarkably tough creatures. They are fully capable of stomping the everloving hell out of damned near anything that threatens them. They have giant tusks which can turn any lesser animal into an instant shishkebab. They also stick with their herds, because they're smart creatures, and they know that if they wander off alone they are still vulnerable to smaller, faster creatures. Be like the elephant. If you act like food, you will be food.

Don't panic. Panic kills more pilots than meta cheese. If you flail around like a headless chicken and fire your weapons without being sure of a hit, then all you're doing is wasting ammo (and heat), and making the light driver laugh. Nothing warms a light driver's heart like a panicking fatso ripe for the kill. Keep your cool, work the problem, and most importantly fire only when you know you're going to hit something. You have more armor than they do, and you can abuse the hell out of that advantage if you keep your wits about you. Counter their turn, get your crosshairs on target, and you can ruin their day with one good shot.


As you develop these crucial skills, bear in mind that some weapons splatter lights better than others. If you want to be maximally dangerous to these minimal machines, make space in your loadout for the following weapons:

PULSE LASERS. Accept no substitute for the best of the vest. Streaks need not apply. Wubs are histcan, and the puke up a lot of hurt very quickly. That makes them ideal for legging. For bonus points, they're also effective against 'Mechs that aren't armored with tissue paper.

LBX. Shotguns are used by bird hunters for a reason. If your aim isn't good enough to slap lights with PPFLD, some damage may be better than none at all. LBX ACs also run very cool, so even if that dastardly light has brought a flamer to the party, you can still shoot them without any danger of self-immolation. Take heed, however, of the First Commandment of the Scattergun: Bringest Thou Thy Biggest Cannon. Don't try to kill lights with LB5X and LB2X; they haven't got the throw weight. Go big or go home.

Streaks. They're lazymode, but they're quite effective at sandblasting light 'Mechs down to their wee little bones. That's... pretty much all they're good at, really. So, y'know, if you don't mind sucking moose nuts at anything over about 45 tons, I guess they're an option.

SRMs. They're like streaks, but with aiming skill! That means you can focus legs with them, so focus the bloody legs with them. SRMs pack a metric arseload of damage into a very small space. They also work against big game, unlike Streaks.

I dissagree on one thing - keep armlock on. On most short ranges weapons speeds are close enough to unload everything into the light, when torso and arm weapons point to the same position.
I have seen too manny people shooting alphas with their arm weapons somewhere spraying over teh target adn their torso weapons going miles behind the mech.

[ocular tb]

My friendly advice is to stay with your teammates, especially if you're playing as an assault. Shoot lights in the legs or carry streaks. Stick with it and don't give up and you will get better. If you haven't tried it yet, you could also try playing lights to see what it's like from their perspective and what it takes to make them work effectively.

[ANOM O MECH]

Vote light mechs out....

This thread is nonsense.

So you know what I would really like to see? PGI open up the Dev console on the test server for a couple of days so you can alter the movement profile and speed of a Direwhale to that of a Locust.

Imagine how fun it would be to run around at 165kph in a Direwhale?

[PocketYoda]

From what i've seen the main issue is many teams are being dropped without having any lights in them at all... or an odd Urbie only.. so that team is effectively ****** from the get go if the other team has four or more lights...

The match maker should not be allowing matches without any light mechs on one or more sides..

[Kimchi4u]

I can understand if you get recked by a light mech every once in a while...we all make tactical errors. If it's happening to you all of the time....you're doing it wrong.