124 replies to this topic

[r4zen]

To be fair, Oregon doesn't prefer objective rushing. I drop with him and a mixed group during off peak hours and he has never once called an objective rush.

Not once.

That particular scummy tactic comes from certain pilots who formed that unit that we are all well aware of. "Looking for pilots who put the team and winning above their own stats". It's right there in the original announcement thread for the unit.

That being said...Oregon, you did open yourself up to this, as the only guy from your unit to post anything about it. Everyone's pent up frustrations re: gen rushing are pouring themselves out here.

[Johnathan Tanner]

[McGoat]

[0regon]

justcallme A S H, on 30 January 2018 - 02:04 PM, said:

That statement is a bit rich coming from a team that Gen/Objective rushes against total PUG teams - every, single, time.

every single time, huh Ash? And tell me. How exactly do you know that? We're trying to keep the discussion honest here, not troll the discussion by spouting lies.

[0regon]

r4zen, on 30 January 2018 - 02:25 PM, said:

To be fair, Oregon doesn't prefer objective rushing. I drop with him and a mixed group during off peak hours and he has never once called an objective rush.

Not once.

That particular scummy tactic comes from certain pilots who formed that unit that we are all well aware of. "Looking for pilots who put the team and winning above their own stats". It's right there in the original announcement thread for the unit.

That being said...Oregon, you did open yourself up to this, as the only guy from your unit to post anything about it. Everyone's pent up frustrations re: gen rushing are pouring themselves out here.

I know Razen. But can't a guy have a little fun on the forums?? Sheesh...I got tired of you guys hogging it all to yourselves. Maybe I'm being a bit trollish, but I'm still trying to be honest here. I appreciate you man

[Johnathan Tanner]

[ANOM O MECH]

0regon, on 30 January 2018 - 01:59 PM, said:

ttk669 you're one of the players that doesn't drop into a FW match unless you're hiding behind a bunch of players that are better than you. That doesn't take nearly as much skill as playing with a group of average players and still managing to play an effective match against seal clubbers. You have a loud bark when you're running with a pack of killers, but that's the onlly time I ever see you around. Again, no offense, but there's not teeth to your bite....sorry

Wow.

I am, huh?

Nothing could be further from the truth, and pretty much everybody who knows me, knows this. You just made something up out of thin air, and against the absolute worst person to do that with cause you see....

I pug alone a whole crap ton. I pug in free to play alts, I pug in my BCMC account, I pug in a fully equipped dirty Clanner account. So not only are you wrong, you are either foolish for taking a guess by throwing that out there, or you are outright lying.

So, bite aside you have zero credibility and nothing to back you up.

Oh and ask Heavy cause three days ago when I was pugging he said he was going to report me when I said I would not participate in a gen rush while I was pugging alone. In fact Heavy has seen me often enough, you see, I could actually use your own unit leader as proof of how far off you were!!!

Just as another kick to your teeth, while you're already down, look up mechwarrior2470942. That's my f2p IS alt that has never been in a group in this game...ever. The cw leaderboad entries are entirely pugging.

So you are laughably and provably wrong and full on talking bs.

What was that you were saying about bite? Sorry your lack of credibility was distracting me.

[Q]

from Pokeme Meme Creator

Edited by Q, 30 January 2018 - 02:38 PM.

[Johnathan Tanner]

I love hotfixes, When the servers are dowe the community really sits down and shares......

Edited by Johnathan Tanner, 30 January 2018 - 02:39 PM.

[0regon]

r4zen, on 30 January 2018 - 02:25 PM, said:

That particular scummy tactic comes from certain pilots who formed that unit that we are all well aware of. "Looking for pilots who put the team and winning above their own stats". .

Man, you make it sound so bad. It's not scummy. It's just different. And in Heavy's defense, he's a very good leader who listens to his guys, has real integrity, and is willing to adapt his strategy to accommodate his players wishes. That's respectable.

[0regon]

tker669 I just never see you around. If you do actually pug drop on an alt account then I humbly apologize. I should have thought of that. Truth is, I just can't stand players that only play on stacked teams. It's bad for FW in general, and I want FW to prosper into something better than what it is.

[Hobbles v]

Serial Number, on 30 January 2018 - 12:20 PM, said:

There is. If you never actually try to fight that "elite team" you'll never get better. Play against better to get better, you know. That's how all those "elite teams" got to level they are on. Not by objective rushing against everyone.
But unless you change your thinking of insta dunking the objectives whenever you see those "elite teams", you'll never stand a chance against them.

^^^ This is how BCMC started. We were founded by a group of ex-HHoD loyalists, with most of our early recruits coming from the ranks of Marik loyalist. HHoD, is a pillar of the mechwarrior community and a fine unit and Marik at the time had some tight knit groups, but neither was known for being particularly good, and both were known for Gen rushing.

We formed our own identity and focused on FIGHTING, the enemy. Now we are one of the dominant forces in the game, through hard work and not conceding to better teams.

[0regon]

Hobbles v, on 30 January 2018 - 02:44 PM, said:

^^^ This is how BCMC started. We were founded by a group of ex-HHoD loyalists, with most of our early recruits coming from the ranks of Marik loyalist. HHoD, is a pillar of the mechwarrior community and a fine unit and Marik at the time had some tight knit groups, but neither was known for being particularly good, and both were known for Gen rushing.

We formed our own identity and focused on FIGHTING, the enemy. Now we are one of the dominant forces in the game, through hard work and not conceding to better teams.

Cheers man. I appreciate the history and the sentiment

[ANOM O MECH]

0regon, on 30 January 2018 - 02:42 PM, said:

tker669 I just never see you around. If you do actually pug drop on an alt account then I humbly apologize. I should have thought of that. Truth is, I just can't stand players that only play on stacked teams. It's bad for FW in general, and I want FW to prosper into something better than what it is.

Ok I accept that.

If my responses were passionate it is only a reflection of how much I am into this game. Especially CW. Safe to say by your response you feel similar.

I guess I wanted it to be clear that I wasn't anti objective. Hobbles explained better perhaps.

Not sure I have any hope left about the mode prospering considering the life cycle of games, but I want there to be tactics and is why I am engaged in CW. Just don't want them to be mind numbingly easy.

Would actually love to see the tactics that would come out of Heavy if the objectives were not so easily crushed. He is an above average player and does have the mind for strategy. I can begrudgingly say this and doubt any could really say otherwise. So in a way think of it as feeling deprived almost of getting to actually play and counter someone and what I might learn from it....

[Q]

Wasn't there a Russ tweet a couple weeks ago that we were going to get some info on FW in a couple weeks?

Wait... I see what he did there...

[ccrider]

Is everyone else playing a different game than I am? I swear, every time I drop the mode is "bring onions or Atlas'" and the objective is to bash stuff till someone is dead. I see counters for "conquest" and these funny things in based on incursion but I have no idea what they are about. I'll have to start paying attention before drops instead of wandering off, I guess.

[justcallme A S H]

0regon, on 30 January 2018 - 02:28 PM, said:

every single time, huh Ash? And tell me. How exactly do you know that? We're trying to keep the discussion honest here, not troll the discussion by spouting lies.

Never seen anything different.

Also looking at the ingame stats, incidentally the ones youre complaining about... It's clear who is shooting/killing mechs and who is shooting at gens and not a lot else/dying. That's one thing the stats are actually quite good at telling.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 30 January 2018 - 03:27 PM.

[Stealthrider]

Q, on 30 January 2018 - 02:55 PM, said:

Wasn't there a Russ tweet a couple weeks ago that we were going to get some info on FW in a couple weeks?

Wait... I see what he did there...

Was a response to me and it said "week(s)" so not a definitive timetable.

If there were no objectives in FP there would be so much less variety in drops. People would just run the same exact decks for every map (barring ultra-hot/long-range maps), you'd get the same heaviest-to-lightest drop order and fight in the same locations every single time, because there would be no reason to do anything but. Obejctives make an otherwise straightforward battle more interesting.

That said, a two minute drop isn't interesting for anyone. Likewise, a 36-0 first wave that ignored gens and just spawncamped the whole time isn't interesting, either. Clearly, the issue is that the objectives are not being taken at the right time and are either too rewarding or not rewarding enough depending on when they're taken and what the battle situation is at that time.

If the issue is one of timing then the solution must be one that takes timing into consideration. A possible off-the-cuff suggestion:

Gens start with an extra-HP shield that decays over time. Batteries (similar to Incursion's) can be used by the defender to reinforce the shield, but they spawn outside the gates (ie, need to go out and come back in to get one, making throwing away mechs less of an always-good idea). Once depleted, the shield can't be reinforced. The gens are then vulnerable for the rest of the match, with lower HP than they've got at the moment.

This method would prevent fast gen rushes by making the gens that much tankier early on, but weaker later. Since the shields hitting 0 would prevent them from being repowered, hitting the gens early would still be an option to prepare for a later attack without outright winning in the first two waves. The longer the fight goes on, though, the more vulnerable the gens get so the defenders need to stay alert: they wouldn't want to let a light sneak in behind them and finish the game while they're busy farming. It'd be their own fault if that happened. Maybe it forces them to eject, which could give the farmed team the time they need to regroup and even the odds.

The shield would not hit zero until the final minutes of the match on its own, though, and would still be able to reinforced up until that point. This means that in a close game, where usually the attacker's last wave would be favored over the defender's, the defender could keep the gens alive with their own light mechs running in and out as the attackers try to kill the gens. The attackers would then not only need to worry about the other mechs shooting them but also deal with those lights, making bringing down the gens less of an all-in PvE fest and more of an actual objective. If the attackers merely waited for the shields to depower on their own they'd be cutting it very close.

[Q]

Cool idea Stealthrider. I'm sure there will be a way to game around it, but it does address some of the bigger issues with gen rushing.

Unfortunately it sounds like a lot of work for PGI.

[0regon]

tker 669, on 30 January 2018 - 02:53 PM, said:

Ok I accept that.

If my responses were passionate it is only a reflection of how much I am into this game. Especially CW. Safe to say by your response you feel similar.

I guess I wanted it to be clear that I wasn't anti objective. Hobbles explained better perhaps.

Not sure I have any hope left about the mode prospering considering the life cycle of games, but I want there to be tactics and is why I am engaged in CW. Just don't want them to be mind numbingly easy.

Would actually love to see the tactics that would come out of Heavy if the objectives were not so easily crushed. He is an above average player and does have the mind for strategy. I can begrudgingly say this and doubt any could really say otherwise. So in a way think of it as feeling deprived almost of getting to actually play and counter someone and what I might learn from it....

Glad we feel the same way about CW. I have a lot of love and respect for the CW community. That was why I started the thread. Hoping to wake PGI up a little bit. There is so much potential with the CW concept and it's community. But, I should wake up. The PGI devs are really only motivated to wring out as much money as they can with as little effort or thought as they can get away with. They're penny wise, and dollar dumb. I hate to see how they abuse such a bunch of bad-*** killers. They have a damn monopoly on the license and as a result, can release half baked content and get away with it. I'm probably going to start writing Microsoft Corporate about the crap PGI seems perfectly content dropping on us, instead of voicing my concerns here. I don't think Russ has ever listened to the community. I'll start writing Microsoft regularly. They'd probably be appalled if they knew what was really going on here.