Jump to content

Remove All Divisions


7 replies to this topic

#1 Morte Nilsum

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Survivor
  • 58 posts

Posted 10 May 2018 - 09:48 AM

There's a lot of good things with solaris, but the divisions are not one of them. Instead of having 7 different queues, I suggest they merge them all into a single queue.

When a player enters the queue, he chooses the maximum tonnage he is willing to face. The match maker then pairs him up with another player in the queue that's within his limit. If no one is found, he can adjust his maximum tonnage, or simply wait.

So why would we want to do this?
  • The population of MWO players that prefers duels is simply not big enough to sustain 7 divisions. Evident by the empty queues in many of them.
  • MWO is a team game with many different mechs to choose from. It is impossible to balance all of them so that they stand an equal chance in a duel. The divisions were a good attempt, but they bring with them a lot of different problems.
  • Some players are not interested in fighting an assault with a medium, while others love to bring their light to take out an assault. With a single queue as described above, you can cater to both of these wishes. And since there are no divisions, you can bring whatever mech you want.
  • With all players in a single queue, it should be easier for the matchmaker to find a good match. And hopefully not that many lopsided matches that tend to scare away new players, and leave experienced players bored.
So how would it work?

Player A has a 40 ton mech and enters the queue. He is not interested in facing assaults, but some heavies might be ok, so he sets his maximum tonnage to 60.

Player B has a 55 ton mech and enters the queue. He don't mind facing assaults, so he sets his maximum tonnage to 100.

The match maker sees that player A and player B are within each others desired range, and have about the same elo rating, so it starts a match between the two.

Naturally there are some problems with this, as it does not take into account the differences of mech performance within the same tonnage. There's also a greater risk of meeting light mechs when in your assault or heavy. But we already have these problems in the divisions today, as some mechs are simply obsolete. I don't think that can be helped.

But I feel that these are minor inconveniences compared to empty queues and lopsided matches that scare people away from playing.

#2 Monkey Lover

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • FP Veteran - Beta 1
  • FP Veteran - Beta 1
  • 7,280 posts
  • LocationWazan

Posted 10 May 2018 - 12:54 PM

Needs more than just weight sizes. Some lights are stronger than some heavy mechs.


http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Battle_Value

http://battletech.rp...?calcmechid=147

Edited by Monkey Lover, 10 May 2018 - 12:55 PM.


#3 Throe

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Guide
  • The Guide
  • 1,018 posts
  • LocationBoycotting mwomercs.com forums

Posted 10 May 2018 - 02:48 PM

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 09 November 2018 - 12:40 PM.


#4 Surn

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 932 posts
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationSan Diego

Posted 10 May 2018 - 07:08 PM

RPI stats could be used to remove divisions, find better matches and in the event of an unequal match...take the situation into account for stats.


Unlike ELO wins and losses are just a component of RPI. You can play without fear of losing.

Consider College Basketball and RPI...the top 65 teams have good win/loss, have played good opponents who have also played good opponents.

So a noob can look forward to playing a great MechWarrior in a Great build because good damage might make a loss more valuable than beating a bad opponent.

This is why my league lasted a decade, got big sponsors and held the first streaming live tournaments in the 1990s.

#5 Morte Nilsum

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Survivor
  • 58 posts

Posted 11 May 2018 - 03:37 AM

View PostThroe, on 10 May 2018 - 02:48 PM, said:

I'd like to point out here an extreme case for abuse in your system, and that is the ACW-1. Assuming it is correctly grouped in Division 1, that means now you're making all 'Mechs of 40 tons and heavier have to potentially face this wrecking ball on the battlefield, where the vast majority of them have *no* chance against it.

Yes that is correct. You may end up fighting such wrecking ball mechs, that's a problem. But if such mechs will always win no matter what, then it comes down to "its the mech that matters, not the skill of the player" which is the opposite of what the competitive solaris players on this forum says. If such mechs are so superior that it eliminates all others, then wouldn't that be a good sign that it needs to be nerfed?

View PostThroe, on 10 May 2018 - 02:48 PM, said:

The population of players queueing for Solaris is plenty big enough. Based on my own observations and a little math, there are easily over a thousand daily players queueing for Solaris at last count. And overall player numbers are up significantly as of the last two seasons.

Unfortunately I've had different observations. At launch there were plenty of people to be found in all divisions, but now most divisions have 0 or 1, while one or two has maybe 4 (this is GMT evenings for reference). So if I want to play a mech that's not in one of the popular divisions, I don't get to play, or get at best a very lopsided match that is no fun for either party. My hope and intention of merging everything into one queue, is that you get to pick what ever mech you want, and not be forced to choose from a specific division. Maybe the player doesn't even have a viable mech in that division.

View PostThroe, on 10 May 2018 - 02:48 PM, said:

And some players are not interested in fighting a Light when they're in an Assault too, but your suggestion ignores that for no apparent reason. At least with the Divisions, we have the option of piloting an Annihilator and actually avoiding most Lighter 'Mechs.

It was ignored for the sake of simplicity. There's no reason why it wouldn't be possible to set a minimum tonnage as well.

View PostThroe, on 10 May 2018 - 02:48 PM, said:

More likely this suggestion will result in *more* mismatches, not less, but sure, we'd have more matches probably so why not? I don't actually mind mismatched fights, but I would mind being paired up against a clearly superior platform, beyond being paired up against a clearly superior player.

Well, it does have the potential of matching a superior mech against an inferior mech, that's true (same as what is happening in the divisions). But I would think that it's more likely to match you up with a player with the same skill level. But if this is a problem, then again it's a matter of mech being more important than skill.

View PostThroe, on 10 May 2018 - 02:48 PM, said:

Some underperforming 'Mechs need to be buffed. Some overperforming 'Mechs need to be nerfed. Some 'Mechs probably just need to be moved up or down a Division instead. That is all. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Yes I do understand the purpose of the divisions, and as I said, they were a good attempt. However, your observations aside, it appears that the population is decreasing, and it's becoming increasingly difficult to find good matches. The trend goes towards there only being 1 or maybe 2 active divisions, while all the others seem to rot away. And when that happens, you actually only have a single queue, you just get limited by your choice of mechs.

The goal of the suggestion is to keep solaris going even with a low population. I noticed that a lot of players want divisions based on weight classes instead of these divisions decided by PGI. I noticed that a lot of players complained about not being able to bring their chosen mech to a fight, because they were in different divisions. And at heart, solaris is about mechs dueling right? So why shouldn't the players be allowed to pick any mech they want, regardless of division? Let the players figure out what works and what doesn't work instead of PGI having to come in every 3 months and decide for us which mechs are good and which isn't.

Edited by Morte Nilsum, 11 May 2018 - 03:39 AM.


#6 Throe

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Guide
  • The Guide
  • 1,018 posts
  • LocationBoycotting mwomercs.com forums

Posted 11 May 2018 - 09:39 AM

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 09 November 2018 - 12:39 PM.


#7 Morte Nilsum

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Survivor
  • 58 posts

Posted 11 May 2018 - 10:34 AM

View PostThroe, on 11 May 2018 - 09:39 AM, said:

You did notice of course that we have a whole slew of Quick Play events going on right now, didn't you? Overall player population is up. The fact that it's been difficult over the last few days to find a Solaris match is probably because people are enjoying themselves more in Quick Play right now.

Well, yes, but the decline in players were noticed before these events. Anyways, I'm not shouting for immediate action or anything like that, merely wanting to have a discussion about an alternative solution to the divisions, as I feel that a declining population will not support that in the long run.

Hopefully I'm wrong about this, and the population will grow, and when events end and the initial buzz of Battletech wears off, people will return to solaris and make it a better experience for all across all divisions. But still, it doesn't hurt to explore other options, and my suggestion is just that, a starting point for discussing how to best deal with a low population :)

#8 Throe

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Guide
  • The Guide
  • 1,018 posts
  • LocationBoycotting mwomercs.com forums

Posted 15 May 2018 - 05:47 PM

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 09 November 2018 - 12:37 PM.






1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users