94 replies to this topic

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Tarogato, on 22 May 2018 - 06:20 AM, said:

This happens to me as well. I always hammer it three or four times just to be sure. Dunno what it is about strikes in particular.



I still think you're dropping packets. Have you been in direct contact with PGI? It might be a good idea to get in a private lobby with them and see if you can reproduce the issue like you did with that Uziel.

That uziel was a live solaris match...... Thats why i dont play it anymore.

[Verilligo]

Cara Carcass, on 22 May 2018 - 06:17 AM, said:

Thx for the hackusations man i really need that with the state of the game atm....

I would reflect a bot about waht sarcasm is. Just writeing sarcasm on off doesnt take away from the accusation....

Relaaaaaax, Cara. It was a joke with regards to one of the guys in the videos you posted. I'm not actually accusing you of doing anything. I thought including the AutoCad meme would make that apparent, I'm sorry.

You do mention that you have this happen more often when your ping is lower. I would generally assume that means a better connection overall with less packet loss. It seems like it happens super frequently with lasers, how often does it impact PPCs and ACs? I'm going to wager that ACs always register damage properly for you and PPCs register damage more often than lasers, but when they don't register they aren't appearing at all like in the one video you posted. You also have... a pretty crazy high FPS number, at the very least your recordings are super smooth. Do you encounter the issue more often at higher FPS or at lower FPS?

I'm kind of wondering if the problem isn't that your communicating with the server too little, but that for some reason you're communicating with it too MUCH, to the point that certain packets are being ignored because of all the other ones that are coming in. That sounds silly, I know, but it would explain why lower ping is worse for you. It would also explain why gauss and (potentially) ACs don't have the same trouble, there's a lot more to push onto the server for it to work with since it has to calculate projectile drop.

Edited by Verilligo, 22 May 2018 - 06:39 AM.

[Nightbird]

It's on your end, nothing PGI can do to fix it.

[Tarogato]

Nightbird, on 22 May 2018 - 06:34 AM, said:

It's on your end, nothing PGI can do to fix it.

Playing at a packetloss that low shouldn't result in actions being dropped so frequently. Especially in such a slow-paced game as MWO. I'm sure there's something PGI could do with their netcode to mitigate this. They should be at least made aware that it's an issue, and investigate. Who knows how many people have this issue and have no idea what's even going on.

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Verilligo, on 22 May 2018 - 06:32 AM, said:

Relaaaaaax, Cara. It was a joke with regards to one of the guys in the videos you posted. I'm not actually accusing you of doing anything. I thought including the AutoCad meme would make that apparent, I'm sorry.

You do mention that you have this happen more often when your ping is lower. I would generally assume that means a better connection overall with less packet loss. It seems like it happens super frequently with lasers, how often does it impact PPCs and ACs? I'm going to wager that ACs always register damage properly for you and PPCs register damage more often than lasers, but when they don't register they aren't appearing at all like in the one video you posted. You also have... a pretty crazy high FPS number, at the very least your recordings are super smooth. Do you encounter the issue more often at higher FPS or at lower FPS?

I'm kind of wondering if the problem isn't that your communicating with the server too little, but that for some reason you're communicating with it too MUCH, to the point that certain packets are being ignored because of all the other ones that are coming in. That sounds silly, I know, but it would explain why lower ping is worse for you. It would also explain why gauss and (potentially) ACs don't have the same trouble, there's a lot more to push onto the server for it to work with since it has to calculate projectile drop.

well fine...

yeah ppcs work better but have their problems too
acs register fine
mgs however have their times where while i hold them steady on a mechs back sometimes in the middle of the stream of bullets, for half a secodn the crosshir stops indicating hits.

regarding the fps - they are crazy low, since recording and playing in 4k takes its toll - without recording i have about 40 fps more. It does not impact the hitreg at all. I used to have a capture box when i played at 1080 - but that one burned out after 2 years of service, practically directly on teh day teh warranty ended.
Since you asked, and i reflected about the resolution change, i can say this.

When solaris 1v1 first came out (i played at 1080p), the first days until the hotfix where exactly like what i am experienceing right now. After the hotfix a few days later it was gone.

then the solaris city map came out (4k resolution now) and it started all over again, i am hopeing for another hotfix and the magically fixed problems.

Edited by Cara Carcass, 22 May 2018 - 06:56 AM.

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Tarogato, on 22 May 2018 - 06:44 AM, said:

Playing at a packetloss that low shouldn't result in actions being dropped so frequently. Especially in such a slow-paced game as MWO. I'm sure there's something PGI could do with their netcode to mitigate this. They should be at least made aware that it's an issue, and investigate. Who knows how many people have this issue and have no idea what's even going on.

One other thing - since i learend, that this is all UDP, yeah i can see teh packet loss i get for packets i get from the server, but perhaps the packet loss happens, because pgis server is so flodded with packets that the server jsut wont accept it. i think i dont have a chance to know waht the packet loss is for packets sent from me towards pgi.

When i trace the route towards pgis servers, all seems fine but how relieable are those results from wireshark, PRTG, resmon etc.....?

[Nightbird]

There is no acceptable rate of packet loss, any non-zero rate indicates the incidance rate may be excaberated when there is more traffic. It may also be the user's network hardware overheating after prolonged use, some cheaper network chips, esp wireless chips, are prone to that. PGI can't 'net code' packets that don't arrive, the code can only create a tolerance for latency.

Also, don't put the packet loss issue on PGI's server, it's 90% you and 9% your ISP and 1% PGI. Rule out the most likely sources of problems in order if you actually want to resolve your issue. If you just want to point fingers, continue as you were.

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Nightbird, on 22 May 2018 - 07:09 AM, said:

There is no acceptable rate of packet loss, any non-zero rate indicates the incidance rate may be excaberated when there is more traffic. It may also be the user's network hardware overheating after prolonged use, some cheaper network chips, esp wireless chips, are prone to that. PGI can't 'net code' packets that don't arrive, the code can only create a tolerance for latency.

Also, don't put the packet loss issue on PGI's server, it's 90% you and 9% your ISP and 1% PGI. Rule out the most likely sources of problems in order if you actually want to resolve your issue. If you just want to point fingers, continue as you were.

ok right there that is ********, knowing that this issue occured in waves where manny people over the forums complained about it over and over again, we can roule out a lot of the isp and pc problems, since it were so manny with vastly different pcs and ISPS all over the world who had low pings and low packet loss situations. I eman i can check for jitter and everythign else, i am just not so confident about ti since i learned that it is UDP at work here.

I am sitting in front of a really good computer. When everythign esle works normal, every other game is fine and only mwo has these problems its not 90% on my computers side.

Edited by Cara Carcass, 22 May 2018 - 07:18 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

Verilligo, on 22 May 2018 - 06:10 AM, said:

Did you aim your shot before firing or did you slide the lasers across his front a little bit and hit more than one section? Reason I ask is that it feels like if you cross multiple components of a mech with lasers, there's a chance you can actually lose damage for not having the laser "on component" for the specific interval of time that a tick of damage is dealt. There have been several times where I've fired a 48 damage laser vom alpha at a bright cherry red CT assault and yet somehow still not depleted that single point of structure that must be hanging on for dear life, mostly because my lasers got slid around a bit from being at a high speed.

Not to say that's at all related to Cara's issue, though. Cara's issue is clearly worse than hit reg, this looks more like fire reg. That's the only way I can explain the heat buildup rewinding like that, it seems like the client side is acknowledging you fired a shot, but the server says "sorry, I didn't see it, so it didn't happen." Probably the reason the gauss isn't giving you the same trouble is because it's forcing the server to do a trajectory calculation, rather than just a travel time check like with PPCs. Curiously enough I'd expect the cooldown on the lasers to also reset, but apparently that's strictly a client side check?

<sarcasm>Time to update your edition of AutoCad so you can decrease gauss cooldown by 1000% while you're haxing your headshots.</sarcasm>

I stopped, turned around. He was maybe 20m away from and I fired point blank at the CT. The whole salvo should have connected with the CT

Edited by Bush Hopper, 22 May 2018 - 07:21 AM.

[Nightbird]

'Many people' is how many? 10 per week complaining? Out of 1k concurrent users, 5k daily users? There have been days when PGI is at fault, and hundreds of users are complaining simultaneously. I'm glad this is not that case. Patiently diagnosing issues is what most people refuse to do, they'd rather someone else do it. Unfortunately most people also refuse to hire a technician to fix their sh*t, cuz that is what's broken. Catch 22.

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Nightbird, on 22 May 2018 - 07:42 AM, said:

'Many people' is how many? 10 per week complaining? Out of 1k concurrent users, 5k daily users? There have been days when PGI is at fault, and hundreds of users are complaining simultaneously. I'm glad this is not that case. Patiently diagnosing issues is what most people refuse to do, they'd rather someone else do it. Unfortunately most people also refuse to hire a technician to fix their sh*t, cuz that is what's broken. Catch 22.

Basically everybody i play with has this problem from time to time. i am having an extreme situation.

I dont need a technician - my pc is fine, my hardware works perfectly. Its just mwo thats not working. And i have tested everything.

Nice of you to tell me that my pc is not working when you have no idea how long i have been building my own computers aAnd what i know about them. You are not sitting at my computer. The game works smooth beside haveing hitreg problems.

Vastly faster fps shooter never displayed that problem.

The forum has manny people showing mass disconnects since the last patch and so on.
Most people never make it to the forums when something is wrong. Out of my friends in mwo at best 1% comes to the forums because they will shrug it off as pgi is not going to do anything even if i can proof its their fault.

Also most of the players in mwo are not competent enough to spot the problem.

Perhaps you rethink your position about how many people have this problem.

Also explain the perfect correlation with patch progress....

[Nightbird]

Mass disconnects but not everyone = ISP problem at a major artery, not PGI. If you admit to having it 'worse' than everyone, what's special about you?

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Nightbird, on 22 May 2018 - 08:30 AM, said:

Mass disconnects but not everyone = ISP problem at a major artery, not PGI. If you admit to having it 'worse' than everyone, what's special about you?

the mass disconnect happens to players with different ISPs....

[El Bandito]

Hit-reg issue in Solaris even more important, cause every shot is vital in that mode.

[Nightbird]

The closer to PGI's server, the more internet traffic lanes are merged, but until it gets to the server PGI cannot do any more than we can.. call up the ISP in charge of thst pipeline and wait. The screenshots of mass disconnects of HALF of all players is a perfect example of that. Basically, one of the 4 to 8 major pipelines going into the datacenter had a malfunction. Nothing PGI can do other than face palm.jpg.

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Nightbird, on 22 May 2018 - 09:16 AM, said:

The closer to PGI's server, the more internet traffic lanes are merged, but until it gets to the server PGI cannot do any more than we can.. call up the ISP in charge of thst pipeline and wait. The screenshots of mass disconnects of HALF of all players is a perfect example of that. Basically, one of the 4 to 8 major pipelines going into the datacenter had a malfunction. Nothing PGI can do other than face palm.jpg.

Yeah jsut that it happens on all 3 zones.

El Bandito, on 22 May 2018 - 08:55 AM, said:

Hit-reg issue in Solaris even more important, cause every shot is vital in that mode.

I stopped playing coz of that. And no matter what nightbird says, packet loss that is perfectly correlated often between two shots... those alser on that uziel in teh solaris mathcv are perfect in that regard. hit miss hit miss hit miss. i dont belive that this is jsut my pc or jsut the isp there is something more behind that.

[Duncan Aravain]

Hit registration has always been a problem in this game all the way back to closed beta and everyone who has played this game for some time can claim an instance that they have experienced the frustration of watching a well aimed shot not be credited. Invincible Ravens, unhitable Spiders, etc. ; the list goes on and on. The Kool-Ade drinkers will blame your computer or the ISP, but the sad truth is that their is plenty of blame still left for PGI. As long as EVERYONE has the same general problem occurring at the same rate, it's a broken but fair system. However, there are indications based on player comments that there is a wide variation with hit registration variables and parameters that imply that certain matches are less than fair and equal.

[Nightbird]

There are three types of issues with hit reg, you, your ISP (between your cable to PGI's server), PGI. You only have control over your sh*t, other things can go wrong and result in a missed shot. For all the issues that occur, PGI's issues happen to everyone equally. There's no preferential treatment to make only your shots disappear. ISP issues are geographical, can be at your house, your city, your country, your continent. Your issues affect only you.

If your sh*t is working properly, you get the best experience possible that's under your direct control. If you have multiple ISPs possible, use the better quality one. If it's PGI, everyone is affected to the same degree and you're not at a disadvantage.

Edited by Nightbird, 22 May 2018 - 09:41 AM.

[Dr Cara Carcass]

Nightbird, on 22 May 2018 - 09:36 AM, said:

There are three types of issues with hit reg, you, your ISP (between your cable to PGI's server), PGI. You only have control over your sh*t, other things can go wrong and result in a missed shot. For all the issues that occur, PGI's issues happen to everyone equally. There's no preferential treatment to make only your shots disappear. ISP issues are geographical, can be at your house, your city, your country, your continent. Your issues affect only you.

If your sh*t is working properly, you get the best experience possible that's under your direct control. If you have multiple ISPs possible, use the better quality one. If it's PGI, everyone is affected to the same degree and you're not at a disadvantage.

Yep i agree - i recive manny shots that do 0 damage. over the amount of games its somewhat equally distributed. Doesnt mean its fun.

[Nightbird]

Out of all the matches I've played, I've only experienced the pointblank missed shot to CT once. (20k matches played) I've been DCed as a group before but PGI posted the reason. Other disconnects I've experienced are all local, like power outage due to T-storms.