831 replies to this topic

[Thunder Fist]

Paul Inouye, on 01 June 2018 - 01:22 PM, said:

It’s been a while and there have been many discussions surrounding 8v8 for Quick Play and we communicated that we would cast a poll on the subject and here it is.

From a logistics/match making perspective, 8v8 has numerous advantages including faster team creation for both solo and group play in the match maker, faster connection times (less ‘Mechs being loaded), improved framerate, improved memory usage and less taxing on your local CPU.

From a player organization perspective, 8v8 means less management headaches getting 8 players together rather than 12, deck building would have a much higher impact in terms of what ‘Mechs are fielded and how they’re played. The ability to be carried through to victory is less likely due to the fact that in an 8v8 scenario, every ‘Mech matters more.

The drawbacks affect the game in a different way and are just as important. We would be losing the feel of full divisional combat (12 ‘Mechs in 3 lances). Switching to 8v8 will not be a simple switch and team size reduction. UI, Match Maker, Economy, game mode adjustments, map adjustments, etc. A switch to 8v8 will also impact on our ability to address other parts of the game such as Faction Play.

Overall, we would be looking at covering all team size areas via the following:
* 1v1 and 2v2 are covered in Solaris 7.
* 4v4 in Scouting
* 8v8 will be covered in Quick Play and Comp Play.
* 12v12 will be covered in Faction Play.

So the big question is, and the reason for this poll, would you like to see Quick Play switch to 8v8?

9V9 with the old maps PLEASE.

[JC Daxion]

Why can't we have both? Make it swap weekly, or monthly... or maybe have events.. Why do we have to choose? Why cant i like both options?

[Woopass]

Can we have the best of both worlds and have a choice to drop 8 or 12? Or is that the whole idea? If so I do hope to see 8 mech drops as well as still have the option for 12’s.

[Rycard]

I prefer bigger matches, 24 vs 24 or 48 vs 48. All that chaos would be fun. And no, faction play doesnt count, i want dozens of players fighting at the same time.

[OMEGA FIST]

THOR HAMMER, on 07 June 2018 - 10:14 AM, said:

Keep 3 Lances 9v9 ?. The maps that have been created are way too large for 8v8 you would need to bring back the old maps or Make two separate quick play options (12v12) and (8v8 or 9v9) and have the 8v8 or 9v9 play on the old maps that were removed ?. This would add a new aspect to the game I would LOVE it !! if we had this option and got the old maps back as well to play 8v8 or 9v9 ?.The quick play now gets very tiring and this would alleviate that and add new Fresh Perspective ….

I agree some of the new maps are way too large for 8V8, now 9V9 would let us keep our 3 lance play style and bringing back the older smaller maps would be Fantastic!. Playing on the Old Frozen city HELL YEAH !!. I am going with the 9V9 and 12V12 option and bring back the Old maps .

[Redwo1f]

Used to play 8 vs 8 when that was the norm years ago...
...just pointing out that there is going to be A LOT more 8-0 rolls with it (vs 12-0 ) as losing a mech on your team becomes even more significant and things can roll very quickly after that...so take that into consideration.

[DAYLEET]

Just announce MWO2 (unreal engine port) and tell everyone to hang tight while its being done. This will fix most if not all problem.

Not only is 8v8 worse but you can already have it in game. AND theres not enough people that wants to play it to even start a game when its free_reward_comp_time! People who want an easier time carrying dont realize they are being selfish. They cant carry or blame anyone but themselves in 8v8 comp or solaris, logical solution is lower qp to 8v8. Wanting a game mode where its easier to carry... that is wrong. Quick play is a game mode designed for people who want an anything goes style of gameplay. Fun over more restriction, because 8v8 is more punishing. Yes, sometimes your teamamte are frustrating, duh, but player count isnt to blame, just requeue and carry on

[AzureRathalos]

I'll leave a few comments:

I do understand that it would require quite the programing overhaul, but I do agree that the idea of 12v12 for busy times and 8v8 for quiet times would be the best.

The comments about meta this and meta that should not matter. Regardless of 12v12 or 8v8, there will be builds that stand out. There will be people who will use those builds and people who will not.

Map size shouldn't matter either. Spawn points can be moved. Objective points can be moved. In the extreme cases, buildings/obstacles could be moved as well.

It's not like I know the exact formula or anything, but it seems as if win/loss has the highest effect on PSR. With 8v8, the contribution of each player is larger and a player that doesn't belong in a Tier due to lack of skill/experience will have a much higher chance of dragging a team down and losing. They lose, their PSR goes down, they eventually (hopefully) get away from players that that they shouldn't be fighting against.

[Tethyss]

Maybe -- only if you bring back the best maps ever which are the Old Frozen City and Old Forest Colony.

And FYI, since most battles only use about 30% of the map anyway, those old maps could EASILY support 12v12 battles.

[paws2sky]

8v8 for group dorps would be nice.
12v12 for quick play. (the recent queuing changes helped, imo).
Either way, not going to quit playing.

[SCCOJake]

changing to 8v8 in QP will be a disaster for everyone but the top end players who can coordinate regularly. It will feed into the meta narrative of the game that only specific mech builds are worth taking. If they don't also implement a hard cap on the number of each class mech it will largely result in heavies and assaults being the only regularly viable mechs to take into QP as anything that cant dish out a 50+ alpha will be a determent to the team. If they DO implement a hard cap then the effect it will have on queue times will be only to make them longer as more and more people try and get one of the coveted heavy or assault slots.

This won't solve the problem of the death ball being the best tactical choice in any given game. It will in fact condense that tactic and reinforce it. Splitting your fire will be even more of a liability. The snowball will be amplified because each mech lost is going to hurt the team that much more.

I don't want to be hyperbolic, but I could very easily see this resulting in, at best people simply dropping from the game if they see their team isn't perfectly optimized; at worst they will team kill people who wander out of position/away from the deathball or who take in less than ideal mechs.

Having an 8v8 OPTION sounds like a fine idea, nothing wrong with that. But to completely replace QP with it will be, IMO, a disaster. If its both solo and group QP, good luck playing group with anything other than an 8 person team as they will utterly dominate the game.

This is a bad idea that will only serve to stoke the egos of the top end players and ruin the experience for new people and those who aren't always going full try-hard.

Edited by SCCOJake, 07 June 2018 - 11:10 AM.

[PhoenixX2]

I feel the level of effort to make this change isn’t worth it. I was around for 8v8 before and ran out of content to enjoy. And I was around for 12v12 and ran out of content to enjoy. I would rather the focus be moving the game forward.

[Colin Pryde]

I'd like to have both modes. The MM assigns a roughly even number of 8v8 and 12v12 matches unless you specify in your options you only want 1 of those.

[NocturnalBeast]

Scarecrow24th, on 07 June 2018 - 10:21 AM, said:

With this action Mechwarrior Online will lose a lot of players just because they want to wave something off if there are players who vote for no. -.-

People have made this claim before and yes, there will always be a few people who quit, but it is never a very significant number.

[DAEDALOS513]

Paul Inouye, on 06 June 2018 - 04:02 PM, said:

1) Enter queue as group of 10. 2) System decides to switch to 8v8. 3) Might as well paint the livingroom while waiting.

I voted no. If it's between staff time spent on Faction Warfare vs 8v8 QP.. I vote for Faction Warfare.

If 8v8 does go through however.. I do like the suggestion someone made to bring back the old maps which are perfect for 8v8 (been calling for their return for years); also liked the suggestion that matchmaker only switches to 8v8 during longer searches.. creating a dedicated 8v8 queue will only further divide our limited player base. If the group is 9 or larger.. that group will simply not have the option to switch to 8v8.

I view this 8v8 mode as a solution to long search times and not as adding a new feature or more content to the game.

PhoenixX2, on 07 June 2018 - 10:58 AM, said:

I feel the level of effort to make this change isn’t worth it. I was around for 8v8 before and ran out of content to enjoy. And I was around for 12v12 and ran out of content to enjoy. I would rather the focus be moving the game forward.

EXACTLY

Edited by DAEDALOS513, 07 June 2018 - 11:49 AM.

[tacorodwarrior]

How about you make a decision? If it will be better, then change it to an 8v8. Simple.

[Kurbeks]

Yes and while you are at it. Drop tiers and Put ELO back for quick play matchmaker.

[Reno Blade]

Without anything else, I would try to get 8 vs 8 for Solo Queue and 12 vs 12 in Group Queue.

Better would be that the matchmaker decides depending on player ELO how large the group could be.
e.g. Tier5 could be 4-8 players, Tier 4-3 could be 8 players and Tier 2-1 could be 12 players.


But considering the main factor being TTK due to deathballing, there are other things which would increase gameplay fun for me so I would prefere these changes:

1. If the overall boating and Alpha potential would be lower, the speed of the first kill (which can start a steamroll) would be much slower and you would either end up in a melee, or have more time to manouver around or reacting to such manouvers.
This would also reduce the domination potential of high-elo players, as they would not be able to pump out the dps we can currently.
And the best, without being able to pump out high dps with maxed meta builds, the "fun builds" are a lot closer in performance. (e.g. stock Mech vs a dakka/laservomit), nearly removing "meta" from the throne.

-> my quick suggestion for balanced build kill potential (balanced TTK):
Aim for a re-start of the Energy Draw limiter somehow, but with less overall spiky penalties and add the TT heat effects on top in general for the Mech heat bar.


2. If there would be more Game Mode goals that need to be taken care of, the teams could split up more instead of deathballing.

-> probably difficult to "force" this, as deathballing, even in conquest/invasion/incursion very effective.
But somehow it's still not effective enough to go "scouting" for example, as you can just go together with the blob and thats it (outside of sniper lights/meds with ECM attacking from the read)

-> my quick suggestion for reworking Game Modes:
changing the "kill everyone" option to give lot less payout than the main goal(s).
- Escort: having multiple VIPs in escort, with each one giving more points
- Domination: holding multiple bases for domination that you need to hold,
- Conquest: using the incursion battery delivery system to "conquer" resource containers and carry them back to a Union Dropship
- Incursion: have one side attacking from a Union Dropship and other side defend
- Assault: maybe add AI tanks that need to be assisted in an assault (DOTA style?)
- Skirmish: maybe spread lances more, but get both teams closer, so there are quicker fights with lance vs lance where the rest of the team need to coordinate if they regroup or attack.


3. PSR/ELO being not balanced enough and most players are "stuck" at the top.
Maybe re-calculate or reset the levels or reduce everone by - 2 levels.

[Grimfeather]

Helsbane, on 06 June 2018 - 04:16 PM, said:

I'm for it, especially if it could be cycled to activate 8v8 during low population hours, and swap back to 12v12 during peak hours.

So much this. A combination would a good way to go. Playing late at night watching the spinning wheel is no fun.

[Agent of Change]

Grimfeather, on 07 June 2018 - 11:45 AM, said:

So much this. A combination would a good way to go. Playing late at night watching the spinning wheel is no fun.

Actually This has been brought up a couple times and if they wanted to put an indicator on the UI to say whether it was 8 man or 12 man play and put a switch in place that automatically switched between the two based on player population. If it drops below a threshold that would make MM longer switch to 8 man rules. so long as it is used when it's needed and clearly visible to players when in effect I could see that working. Dunno about how easy it would be to have a different pool of maps for each mode but that would be on teh devs to work out.