103 replies to this topic

[Nightbird]

It's dishonorable to hold back against an enemy, for that means you do not see them as an equal.

[Bishop Six]

Johnathan Tanner, on 21 June 2018 - 09:10 AM, said:

Can you show me this mythical creature?

Sure. or not. doesnt work

Well...we are.

Edited by Bishop Six, 21 June 2018 - 09:23 AM.

[Khobai]

Nightbird, on 21 June 2018 - 09:13 AM, said:

It's dishonorable to hold back against an enemy, for that means you do not see them as an equal.

if you beat them while holding back it means theyre not an equal

[S O L A I S]

Anastasius Foht, on 21 June 2018 - 12:22 AM, said:

FP need SoloQ, whole idea about unit's game play obviously not so popular (same reason why GroupQ is dead - not enough organized people for premade drops).
Made mode between "Scout" and "Invasion", call it "Planetary Militia" phase when defend planet and "Mercenary Pug" when attack, made it SoloQ only, and you lure enough players to try FP at least.

FP doesn't need a solo queue. That is what quick play is.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

Bishop Six, on 21 June 2018 - 08:37 AM, said:

I am with you. But it was totally unnecessary to slaughter us in this way, with narc&lurms. It looks like they just wanted to destroy the motivation of all of us. Maybe you know what i mean.

Whatever group it was (I could make a good guess), they were probably just messing around to keep things interesting for them. There is so little real competition for a couple of the top units (and their friends, Alts, etc) when they run 10-12 man’s, that it probably gets rather boring to beat mid-tier or lower units with their normal direct fire ...much a less pugs. So, they mess around with narc and Lrms..etc. I wouldn’t take it personally, was probably just them messing around...

[S O L A I S]

Bishop Six, on 21 June 2018 - 08:50 AM, said:

Thank you! But its not the level i care, its their intention to actively destroy motivations of casuals and i dont like that behaviour. In my world champions are champions also of their honour and to be a fair enemy.

I am having a bit of trouble following you. So far it sounds like you are saying you won against a good group, then in another game you were narced and lurmed to death on Sulfurous?

Either way, they're are no 'pro' teams running around CW right now. I have the pleasure of regularly playing with that one Emp member who plays the mode with his lovely girlfriend and his buddy. I can count on one hand the number of times he ran lurms because he literally never had done it before (when he did for first time Carl finked him out to Vxheous luls).

So when a good team is going to lurm they are generally goofing off, and they are probably going to do it right. It's not uncommon to see BCMC or Evil guys running lurms when bored, and self narcing Hunchies work well.

You also lose me on this honour issue. Running lurms and narcs is not a moral issue. World champions playing CW are allowed to use what everyone else is using and it's absurd to think that they should be held to any standards other than the ones they hold themselves to.

[Kubernetes]

Bishop Six, on 21 June 2018 - 08:37 AM, said:

I am with you. But it was totally unnecessary to slaughter us in this way, with narc&lurms. It looks like they just wanted to destroy the motivation of all of us. Maybe you know what i mean.

How did you want to be slaughtered? Is there some less demoralizing way of getting stomped?

[Anastasius Foht]

S O L A I S, on 21 June 2018 - 09:44 AM, said:

FP doesn't need a solo queue. That is what quick play is.

Oh, so FP wait time is fine and don't need those 90% of players who's playing QP only?

[QueenBlade]

PGI can't start on FP just yet...

Comp queue just launched today. I'm sure PGI will need to monitor and tweak that, but then the Solaris season will be done and that will need some tweaking, but then we'll be at the Semi-Finals of the Comp queue. After that its getting ready for MechCon and MWOWC. After that event, its MW5...

Sorry guys, we'll have to take a rain check on FP game mode until 2019.

[S O L A I S]

Anastasius Foht, on 21 June 2018 - 10:08 AM, said:

Oh, so FP wait time is fine and don't need those 90% of players who's playing QP only?

There has been a recent uptick in new players. Being able to switch sides easily now means during most of the day I can get matches no problem, especially NA primetime. That works for me.

Does FP need those 90% to draw from quick play? No we absolutely don't need most of them. We need the ones that are inclined to invest in playing as an actual team. Of the people in quick play that number is low.

What will never happen but would help a great deal is if the lfg was more robust and was more akin to a social lobby that players could utilize the in game voip, talk to each other and form teams.

[Elizander]

Just make the carrot nice and I'll allow premades to kill me all day

[Bishop Six]

S O L A I S, on 21 June 2018 - 10:05 AM, said:

I am having a bit of trouble following you. So far it sounds like you are saying you won against a good group, then in another game you were narced and lurmed to death on Sulfurous?

Either way, they're are no 'pro' teams running around CW right now. I have the pleasure of regularly playing with that one Emp member who plays the mode with his lovely girlfriend and his buddy. I can count on one hand the number of times he ran lurms because he literally never had done it before (when he did for first time Carl finked him out to Vxheous luls).

So when a good team is going to lurm they are generally goofing off, and they are probably going to do it right. It's not uncommon to see BCMC or Evil guys running lurms when bored, and self narcing Hunchies work well.

You also lose me on this honour issue. Running lurms and narcs is not a moral issue. World champions playing CW are allowed to use what everyone else is using and it's absurd to think that they should be held to any standards other than the ones they hold themselves to.

I get it, that i cant describe clearly my point of view. For me it is about sportmanship. And i was sad to see my group instantly gone after that match. It wasn't because of the loss, we lost like i said most of the games. It was about the "How".

Honestly, i was really glad to see these guys again after a long time in FP, i even told some friends: "Look! Also old veterans are coming back! Thats a good sign! Lets try our best to give them a challenge!"

Ok, we can say i was naive to believe that these guys would perhaps appreciate our endurance to try to deliver them good fights.

And right at the moment we could reached this, 2 of their leaders rage quitted, no "gg", no "wp" (like i did to them) and the next round were this, what i described.

I thought they would like what we do, but instead, they were only motivated to kick us out of FP. I have no problem to take the bad card here this time, but i want to underline that i try to attract players for FP instead of driving them away with ugly and nasty tactics, only because they lost 1 ******* time. Thats not about sportsmanship, it is about narcismn and this drove me crazy.

Yeah sorry. Like i said before, i take this one on me, my fault for being naive.

[Khobai]

FP needs more than just better rewards for losing.

at bare minimum it needs a complete balance overhaul, a logistical/strategic level of play added to the map (ability to spend cbills to buy attacker/defender assets), a new gamemode, renovation of old gamemodes like siege/incursion, etc...

and all that still wouldnt attract new players into the game. it would just stop current players from leaving as quickly. so it ultimately wouldnt even be worth it for PGI to invest the devtime into. they have nothing to gain from throwing good money at dead features.

If PGI wants new players, adding dinosaurs is the best course of action...

look at orion:prelude. its like the absolute worst game on steam. but it sold 2,000,000 copies just because it was $1 and had dinosaurs in it. more people bought that game than have ever played MWO lolol.

im not even kidding. add the dinosaurs PGI. you could even make them a third faction. And it might even save faction play.

"but dinosaurs arnt part of battletech canon"

well maybe if they were battletech wouldnt have died out in the 80s only to be periodically resurrected every 20 years and fail all over again. and we mightve gotten a company other than PGI to produce mechwarrior games because it wouldnt have been shelved for 15 years.

"but how do dinosaurs travel from planet to planet"

time portals. hollow asteroids. giant space dinosaurs that carry other dinosaurs. take your pick. all of those are just as ridiculous and farcical as battletech's solar powered faster-than-light travel.

Edited by Khobai, 21 June 2018 - 11:10 AM.

[Vxheous]

S O L A I S, on 21 June 2018 - 10:05 AM, said:

Either way, they're are no 'pro' teams running around CW right now. I have the pleasure of regularly playing with that one Emp member who plays the mode with his lovely girlfriend and his buddy. I can count on one hand the number of times he ran lurms because he literally never had done it before (when he did for first time Carl finked him out to Vxheous luls).

It's ok, I use lrms at least once a night nowadays. It's kinda how PGI wants us to play the game.

Edited by Vxheous, 21 June 2018 - 11:03 AM.

[S O L A I S]

Bishop Six, on 21 June 2018 - 10:49 AM, said:

I get it, that i cant describe clearly my point of view. For me it is about sportmanship. And i was sad to see my group instantly gone after that match. It wasn't because of the loss, we lost like i said most of the games. It was about the "How".

Honestly, i was really glad to see these guys again after a long time in FP, i even told some friends: "Look! Also old veterans are coming back! Thats a good sign! Lets try our best to give them a challenge!"

Ok, we can say i was naive to believe that these guys would perhaps appreciate our endurance to try to deliver them good fights.

And right at the moment we could reached this, 2 of their leaders rage quitted, no "gg", no "wp" (like i did to them) and the next round were this, what i described.

I thought they would like what we do, but instead, they were only motivated to kick us out of FP. I have no problem to take the bad card here this time, but i want to underline that i try to attract players for FP instead of driving them away with ugly and nasty tactics, only because they lost 1 ******* time. Thats not about sportsmanship, it is about narcismn and this drove me crazy.

Yeah sorry. Like i said before, i take this one on me, my fault for being naive.

So you won a match then you lost the next one to lurms? Even if I am getting that wrong it still doesn't mean that these players where trying to lurm you out of the game nor is it dishonourable to use lurms. There are no nasty tactics. There are just tactics which as long as they are within the rules, are legit and not about people's morals or character.

[Nightbird]

Vxheous, on 21 June 2018 - 11:02 AM, said:

It's ok, I use lrms at least once a night nowadays. It's kinda how PGI wants us to play the game.

Gotta shake off that rust from using direct fire weaponry every now and then.

[Nameless King]

Vellron2005, on 21 June 2018 - 12:02 AM, said:

So, dear PGI, are we done with Solaris yet?

Can we finally put Faction Play on the front burner and focus on reworking it?

Turning it into what it should be? The main course of the game? "Campaign mode"? Not seal-clubbing country?

There are plenty of suggestions how.. (many my own, I admit), so you should probably get plenty of ideas on what the players need..

Maybe?

Please..

Hopefully not and hopefully never,

[Sjorpha]

Bishop Six, on 21 June 2018 - 08:50 AM, said:

Thank you! But its not the level i care, its their intention to actively destroy motivations of casuals and i dont like that behaviour

You seem to base this idea about their intentions solely on the fact that they used coordinated LRMs to beat you, what if I told you LRMs are just another weapons system and using them as a team is just another way to win? Why couldn't you just attempt to counterplay and beat their LRM strategy? Why is it suddenly a moral issue which weapons are used?

It's morally neutral, people can use whatever weapons and tactics they want within the ruleset and there is no such thing as "honourable" or "dishonourable" strategies.

There is a word for people who bring their own external rules and morals into games.

That word is "scrub", and...

Quote

In my world champions are champions also of their honour and to be a fair enemy.

...scrubs don't win world championships. Your world simply isn't the real world.

Why can't we just be happy LRMs are finally useful after all the years of being severely underpowered, if good players and teams can finally use them as a real strategy that's a good thing and not something to complain about.

Edited by Sjorpha, 23 June 2018 - 02:48 AM.

[Bishop Six]

Sjorpha, on 23 June 2018 - 02:46 AM, said:

You seem to base this idea about their intentions solely on the fact that they used coordinated LRMs to beat you, what if I told you LRMs are just another weapons system and using them as a team is just another way to win? Why couldn't you just attempt to counterplay and beat their LRM strategy? Why is it suddenly a moral issue which weapons are used?

It's morally neutral, people can use whatever weapons and tactics they want within the ruleset and there is no such thing as "honourable" or "dishonourable" strategies.

There is a word for people who bring their own external rules and morals into games.

That word is "scrub", and...



...scrubs don't win world championships. Your world simply isn't the real world.

Jesus how many times shall i say sorry?!

Its ok...your world is not my world and never will be. And i dont want to talk about this further. These guys know the truth about that situation. I dared to critizise the elite and i got my bang on the head. Its enough.

I got the point that i come from other values. I did many sport challenges in my life, in athletics, soccer and other sports and i was succesfull.

You can be what you are, i'm fine with that. I stay what i am. For me sportsmanship and honour is more important than my epeen. Maybe your "values" are a picture of our society, sad enough. Last word from me to this topic.

I promise never to rant again about people who don't understand things.

[Prototelis]

If you're looking for honor in an fps you are in the wrong place and time.

You would have loved Jedi Knight 2: Jedi Outcast in its prime.

Had a dueling system in ffa where you could challenge people. Dude's would even bow before matches, or let you jump back up to them if you fell down to a lower platform. Me personally... I waited for the timer and just force choked them over a ledge... and when that stopped working I'd switch to one of the splash damage guns as soon as the duel started and knock them off that way..