76 replies to this topic

[Mechwarrior 37]

I admit I often play a sniper. Mainly Hellbringers. I have a stupid amount of them because I used to do Faction Warfare.

Funny enough one reason is that I do not see well at all. I used to and semi still put a LRM 5 on a Mech just for the crosshairs. I used too and still do rely on targetting "too much". And I have poor hand and eye coordination. I'll be 60 years old this year and this is the first "shooter" game I've ever played. I need the ZOOM, lol.

In my two Tier 4 accounts, good sniping works very well. In my two Teir 2 accounts, not so great. Sort of like LURMing. But LRMing has gotten harder.

Nascar has changed both also. In fact, it has changed MWO. It is much much harder to find and stay at one spot for long.

I just shamed two teammates off of a postion in a Teir 2 account. . A Night Gyr and a Summonder in my Lance stopped in a raised postion and did not follow the rest of us. It is a very good sniping and LRMing spot but it is also 1200 ms away from the circle. I called them both out and said please join us.

One big dfference in the Tiers is what the other team does. At Teir 2, chances are that one of more lights will come for you. Instead of seeing you like a dangerous Sniper or LRMer you think you are, they see you as a easy kill.

A NARCer, Sniper, LRMer etc will get called out by a lot of players/teams.

What do you do against a Sniper or LRMer? You charge them taking a few hits then you kill them.

In Warfare and in MWO, it is not about one on one matchups. It is about finding and making two and three on one situations. And stopping it from happening to you.

I like Blackhawk's reasoning. I'm ex Military and I think I understand the idea. In RL or a lot of shooter games, you can take out a enemy in one shot. That is not the way it goes here.

I still have the bed habit of knowing where the enemy is coming and then posting myself there. And then I get ran over like a train hit me. One Mech is not going to 'hold the pass" etc. (do not stand on the railroad tracks)

There is no Magic Golden BB in MWO.

Sniping should be about denial of a area or of FREEDOM OF ACTION. It should be bad enough to take the enemy out of a standard plan.

Timing is always the hard thing. I do not convey this thought well in matches but just taking 2-3 enemy Mechs out of the fight for 1:37 can be very helpful. IF the rest of your team is ready to use it.

I alway wait until the main forces are in contact before I snipe.

Edited by Mechwarrior 37, 06 June 2019 - 07:19 AM.

[John McClintock]

I swear half the matches i end up tanking in a light while the big boys sit back and snipe.

[The Basilisk]

Darakor Stormwind, on 01 July 2018 - 08:01 AM, said:

This is an honest question. I started playing in late open beta, stopped playing, came back early this year and have been playing since. And the first thing I had to learn was to curb my impatience, because people do not seem to like actually doing something ingame.

I went through some different roles to find out what suited me. Brawler often didn't end well, on wide open maps. Tried sniping, but felt it was utterly ineffective. Tried scouting, but I was really bad at it. So in the end, I decided to mostly play short to mid range fire support. I go where other people go and shoot what other people shoot. I try to rotate into the front line when my armour is fresh and rotate out of the front line if I was shot up but not killed.

Back in Tier 5 and 4, "sniping" with lurms was the gameplay of choice. In Tier 3 this dropped down to almost nothing and people started really sniping. Hiding behind a rock, popping up, shooting, doing 20 or so damage, hiding again. Relocating. Popping up again, doing another 20 damage, hiding again. This feels too inefficient, I dunno.

It works wonders if there is one sniper, picking off weak targets while the rest fights the main force fights, but I have never seen this work well if the sniper was heavier than a Medium. Never works if there are more snipers than other roles.

I keep seeing single people very far in the back with very heavy Mechs, as if they were afraid to scratch the paint. I often have teams with 4 or more of them. That's usually when they stomp us really hard. I keep wondering at the motivation behind this gameplay. Which is where this post comes in. I mean, they obviously enjoy the sniping gameplay, that is easy to notice, but if you keep getting rolled over, maybe it is an idea to move to a second favourite role if it is more useful... Or is that just the german in me coming out?

I try to use Mechs/builds where I can fill more than one role in game, depending on what we were short of. So I do not really understand people that pigeonhole themselves into one task.

What is it that makes people hide behind a rock and ideally the same rock for the whole game? Cover is great, but it should be used to get to an objective. It sometimes feels like being in cover the only objective people have...

(PS: Yes, slight rant, I had a lot of games recently with people doing little more than hiding all game.)

So why do ppl snipe.....well cuz they want to play big stompy bots and are no damd effin squirrely twitchy kiddos and cant do the boom zoom stuff with their reflexes....or cuz it is just hillariously stupid to do the runaround shooting thing that is mostly going on at the moment....or cuz it is super hillariously stupid to take a 100T fusion powered war machiene to knife fighting range when I should be able to core a light from half a klick away with my PPC and Gauss....or cuz its just super effin stupid to endanger your team mates with team dmg when you just could simply stay at 800m+ for a shoulder to shoulder firing line and just mow all the brawlers down that are advancing in to you....could go on untill the editor limit with this....brawling is just effin dumb nothing more...the fact that it is possible on most maps shows one of the all to many aspects that went horribly wrong.

[Void Angel]

Except that those brawlers have a much higher DPS than you do, and every map has places to move under cover; If you stand out in the open in a firing line, mobility teams will tear you apart. The maps allowing brawling as an option are a thing the game gets right, and short-ranged versus long-ranged weapons are a staple of BattleTech.

[General Solo]

To me the core reason is if you out range the enemy you can hit without being hit

Which is best outcome possible

Like modern standoff weapons

A team of snipers with good aim is the ultimate, kinda like the real pro's play, depends on map doh
You see it, you can focus fire kill it in one volley if you can see it and your guys have good aim.

Never out of range
Never cant fire so more shots in compared to a brawler.

Brawler good if surprise get close through use of cover
Sniper don't need cover if out range enemy

Problems arise when the team ain't coordinated like in solo queue.

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 07 June 2019 - 02:28 AM.

[Mechwarrior 37]

OZHomerOZ, on 07 June 2019 - 01:56 AM, said:

To me the core reason is if you out range the enemy you can hit without being hit

Which is best outcome possible

Like modern standoff weapons

A team of snipers with good aim is the ultimate, kinda like the real pro's play, depends on map doh
You see it, you can focus fire kill it in one volley if you can see it and your guys have good aim.

Never out of range
Never cant fire so more shots in compared to a brawler.

Brawler good if surprise get close through use of cover
Sniper don't need cover if out range enemy

Problems arise when the team ain't coordinated like in solo queue.

I had a good example yesterday. It was at the HPG Manifold. I like to go up at around E6 or so. It is about 800-1,000 ms to targets trying to climb and poke at my teammates on the other side.

Depending on the Teir and the damage done, I will get attacked. A lot of times everyone allows the smaller snipers to make it to the end because they are not really doing damage.

But a Hellbringer can do damage. I ended up this game with almost 800 damage. And 3 kills. One thing a powerful sniper can do is I can find that one hurt enemy mech. And I CAN kill it. I have some head shots also.

This was "assault" and we were on the side where the base in on the side. Which is odd. So our base was right behind me out of the first door. Both teams were at 8 to 8 when their team really did disappear. They had backed down a number of times off of the ramps up because of me shooting them.

And I did not realise that our Base was behind me enough though if we are on the other side, I always push for a assault right from the beginning right to their Base.

So this time I'm on the Mic saying they have al gone down and I bet they are coming towards me (Once, the other team did try a basement push). And sure enough, they ALL pour out at me. And all this time I'm asking my team to MOVE. And no one did.

I even wonder if they were like "whatever, stupid lame sniper". But the other point was that they were going to go through me to our base. I got my 3rd kill and they won by capping our BASE.

I've found that a important thing is to not be clearly seen. So do not take easy shots where they can also see you shoot them. And even wait to start shooting. Shoot the guy peaking over the ramp at your teammates.

Anyway....I want to add a 6 AC Direwolf to my collection ($17 M??)

[Mechwarrior 37]

I've been getting into sniping. My big thing is now is Anti Nascar Sniping. I will try to explain it later. The domation map is the easist to explain. I want to get beyound/behind/near our alpha.

First find a place, 2nd hide. 3rd, allow the lights to go pass you running in a circle first (this is hard to do). Then light up the assaults and heavys.

I've alsp tried about 15 more mech as my snipers then just my Hellbringers.

Remember, the first thing after a sniper finds his postion, his job is is to not be seen. I found this top secert British film on it.

Edited by Mechwarrior 37, 23 July 2019 - 02:51 AM.

[Mercworks]

Renzor the Red, on 11 January 2019 - 12:10 AM, said:

I enjoy sniping, but in the non-LRM variety. One of my favorite mechs is my Arctic Cheetah that I use to run around at the edges of fights, flank, and hit backs and components with my 2 C-ER-LL's. It's a lot of fun. There is a learning curve, though, and just splashing that kind of damage isn't very effective. Now that I'm getting better at it, I really enjoy that style. I reach out well over 1000 meters with that.

I usually use a single ERPPC in my Cheetah and a heavy medium for closer in work. Back that up with ECM and at least one UAV and try to spot for the team as much as possible and pick off the wounded components they're hiding from everyone else.

[Rioting Baboon]

Hello, I don't participate on the forums much, but here goes.

I've found that as the match progresses, it goes through different phases.

The first one is almost always a sniping/poking/peek-a-boo phase until someone spots/or creates a hole in the other team's line. After that, a skirmish ensues, quickly turning into a brawl, or it could go back to sniping/poking if both teams are disciplined enough.

If both teams are good, then both sides will lose an even number of mechs and it will boil down to who teamplays better. I've seen some games where we managed to wipe the other team's Charlie lance without losing a single mech, then proceed to lose the match. I assume this is because the competent pilots mechs got banged up in wiping out their assaults and were consequently unable to carry the fight, while the other half of the team were of the sniper/LRM boat variety that crumbles under fire.

Personally I prefer medium to short distance mechs, staying at medium range and using terrain for hit and run tactics to maximize damage while receiving little in return. Sadly, I almost always get relegated to brawling because very few want to do it. Due to this, I gravitate towards faster moving mechs, though tonnage doesn't matter as much as speed, which shouldn't drop below 70kph. (obviously this eliminates some other mechs for me, but I can be versatile and cope)

I've just come back to the game after being away for 5+ years. I was a terribad player (the potato variety) back then so I'm currently T5, but it seems to be rising.

I'm enjoying my CN9-AH(L) mech a lot, as well as the Timberwolf, Linebacker, Raven (3L), Zeus, Orion, Shadowcat, and a bunch of others. Mostly fast, hard-hitting, and/or utility/support types that engage in sniping early on before closing in on enemy flanks and really bringing the hurt, or stepping up and tanking/sharing armour when the heavier mechs get in trouble.

I'll usually bring one weapon that can reach out and tag someone that will remain effective at closer ranges. (Snub nose PPC, ER Large, ER LPL, ER MED, autocannons, and the like.) while the rest of my weapons can be volleyed quickly at close range, where I use torso twisting and damage spreading to stay alive long enough to take down a few mechs.

TL;DR: Sniping is a part of the game, it's usually within the first few minutes of a match that it is relevant. Some people don't want to/can't move past this phase.

[Void Angel]

Er, you mean c-LPL? An ER LPL could be terrifying.

At any rate, you're describing what I like to call the Hillbilly Moonshiner school of Battlemech combat.

See, it's like two different clans of mountain boys have started up a feud. Things are getting out of hand, but nobody wants to get shot over it yet. So, they scatter out along opposing ridgelines and start to trade desultory gunfire whilst drinking up their product to pass the time. Eventually, after one side or another gets in enough good hits - or imbibes enough liquid courage - they'll feel themselves at an advantage, and start to move in for the kill, eventually culminating in a brawl and maybe some stragglers being hunted down like raccoons.

See also: Canyon Network.

Edited by Void Angel, 31 August 2019 - 12:14 AM.

[Rioting Baboon]

Void Angel, on 31 August 2019 - 12:13 AM, said:

Er, you mean c-LPL? An ER LPL could be terrifying.

At any rate, you're describing what I like to call the Hillbilly Moonshiner school of Battlemech combat.

See, it's like two different clans of mountain boys have started up a feud. Things are getting out of hand, but nobody wants to get shot over it yet. So, they scatter out along opposing ridgelines and start to trade desultory gunfire whilst drinking up their product to pass the time. Eventually, after one side or another gets in enough good hits - or imbibes enough liquid courage - they'll feel themselves at an advantage, and start to move in for the kill, eventually culminating in a brawl and maybe some stragglers being hunted down like raccoons.

See also: Canyon Network.

Yeah, I meant a C-LPL instead of an ER. Regardless

Call it what you want but not all styles revolve around the rock 'em-sock 'em style of play. Some prefer to engage at arms reach and everyone quickly learns that charging in aggressively results in getting shot by multiple mechs and any flanking manouvres require one to get a feel for the enemy position before execution or face getting blasted. This is where the early trade comes in. We may not like it, but it gives each team a feel for the other team, kind of like how two fighters jab at each other in early boxing rounds.

TL;DR: It aint stupid if it works.

Edited by Rioting Baboon, 01 September 2019 - 01:51 AM.

[Mechwarrior 37]

This is why they call it "sniping".

[Void Angel]

Rioting Baboon, on 31 August 2019 - 06:58 PM, said:

Yeah, I meant a C-LPL instead of an ER. Regardless

Call it what you want but not all styles revolve around the rock 'em-sock 'em style of play. Some prefer to engage at arms reach and everyone quickly learns that charging in aggressively results in getting shot by multiple mechs and any flanking manouvres require one to get a feel for the enemy position before execution or face getting blasted. This is where the early trade comes in. We may not like it, but it gives each team a feel for the other team, kind of like how two fighters jab at each other in early boxing rounds.

TL;DR: It aint stupid if it works.

"If it's stupid and it works, it's still stupid, and you got lucky."
- Maxim 43

You're assuming things about my playing style, and reading things into my response, that are incorrect. I've talked about this exact subject at length on other threads, but the gist of it is that the Hillbilly Moonshiner effect is a bad tactical paradigm. It's caused by an array of things, from players blindly aping the meta to the psychological effects of certain game mechanics, but the upshot of it all is that many players don't understand and adjust their tactics to the map. Rather, they vote for the maps (canyon network, for example) that best support their tactical monomania - and then complain bitterly about maps that make them try something else.

You should also not assume any criticism of your 'mech builds. I build my own brawlers the exact same way.

[TheBlackBear]

snipers get all the ladies because the brawlers die in battle.

Edited by TheBlackBear, 18 July 2020 - 08:21 AM.

[Bhodi Li773]

Sniping is a part of the game. Some do it well, some don't. Complaining that your" not sharing armor ,thats why we lost" is the norm.Depending on your build this is true to a point. If your running a lrm catapult ,which it is designed to do,some will still complain. However most people don 't want to share their armor when their team abandons them to die by nascarring around the map.The truth is most are unwilling to "share armor" because as soon as they get hit they back off/hide, while telling their assaults "to get to the front and tank the damage". Until everyone stops running in circles a lot of assault/snipers will stay in the back as will their armor. MWO is designed as a team/co-operative playstyle game but most abandon that to circle the map.Assaults are less played because of nascar which is why most games are fast mechs 80+km or better leaving your 50 km assaults to die. If you want assaults to share armor they need to be with your group not a grid away being killed by light mechs.

[KursedVixen]

Phoenix 72, on 01 July 2018 - 08:01 AM, said:

This is an honest question. I started playing in late open beta, stopped playing, came back early this year and have been playing since. And the first thing I had to learn was to curb my impatience, because people do not seem to like actually doing something ingame.

I went through some different roles to find out what suited me. Brawler often didn't end well, on wide open maps. Tried sniping, but felt it was utterly ineffective. Tried scouting, but I was really bad at it. So in the end, I decided to mostly play short to mid range fire support. I go where other people go and shoot what other people shoot. I try to rotate into the front line when my armour is fresh and rotate out of the front line if I was shot up but not killed.

Back in Tier 5 and 4, "sniping" with lurms was the gameplay of choice. In Tier 3 this dropped down to almost nothing and people started really sniping. Hiding behind a rock, popping up, shooting, doing 20 or so damage, hiding again. Relocating. Popping up again, doing another 20 damage, hiding again. This feels too inefficient, I dunno.

It works wonders if there is one sniper, picking off weak targets while the rest fights the main force fights, but I have never seen this work well if the sniper was heavier than a Medium. Never works if there are more snipers than other roles.

I keep seeing single people very far in the back with very heavy Mechs, as if they were afraid to scratch the paint. I often have teams with 4 or more of them. That's usually when they stomp us really hard. I keep wondering at the motivation behind this gameplay. Which is where this post comes in. I mean, they obviously enjoy the sniping gameplay, that is easy to notice, but if you keep getting rolled over, maybe it is an idea to move to a second favourite role if it is more useful... Or is that just the german in me coming out?

I try to use Mechs/builds where I can fill more than one role in game, depending on what we were short of. So I do not really understand people that pigeonhole themselves into one task.

What is it that makes people hide behind a rock and ideally the same rock for the whole game? Cover is great, but it should be used to get to an objective. It sometimes feels like being in cover the only objective people have...

(PS: Yes, slight rant, I had a lot of games recently with people doing little more than hiding all game.)

The last patch really buffed sniping....

[PocketYoda]

Funnily after the bad PPC patch all the snipers come out of the wood work and necro old posts to justify how great snipers they are by doing nothing all match.. with their horrible cooldown ppcs..

Grats i guess PGI now we have Lurmers and poptart heroes to lose with.

Edited by Samial, 18 March 2021 - 03:33 PM.