77 replies to this topic

[The6thMessenger]

The6thMessenger, on 24 July 2018 - 03:26 AM, said:

LPPC is lame as hell with it's supposedly target chassis. We could buff damage, but then what's the point of PPC if it's at 6 damage?

Lets buff CD for the LPPC instead, allowing a different and more aggressive playstyle for lights. It will also be tuned with heavier chassis because they fit better with the recycle time of ACs. Either 3s or 2.5s works. It will still be balanced by immense heat/sec.

Lets get this off the ground! It's just a relatively simple buff.

[POLL]

[Abaddun]

I'll be happy with a 2.5s CD. Maybe reduce range just a little bit, by about 75-100 metres.

[Raso]

I also think it could use a range buff, like the light guass.

[Shaggath]

Or simply add that into the game :

http://www.sarna.net...i/PPC_Capacitor

One slot one tons 5 more heat 5 more damage.

With that light ppc are good for 3 slot 4 tons 10 heat 10 damage.

And heavy ppc become really good too.

Edited by Shaggath, 24 July 2018 - 07:24 AM.

[process]

3 seconds would be a good place to start to begin making the weapon feel useful. However, 2 LPPC shouldn't be better than a single PPC. Any cooldown reduction to LPPC will give them better DPS and tonnage versus worse heat efficiency and crit slots. The whole PPC family needs some TLC.

[Inatu Elimor]

LPPC, in IMHO, is not about the dmg but tactics. A light with LPPC can distract the enemy to advantage of the whole team. For instance I have the Osiris 1V loadout 3 mpl and 1 lppc.
No, that' s not a meta. If the lppc would be buffed I can only welcome it.

[El Bandito]

Increase LPPC GH threshold from 3 max, to 4 max.

[Shaggath]

process, on 24 July 2018 - 07:22 AM, said:

3 seconds would be a good place to start to begin making the weapon feel useful. However, 2 LPPC shouldn't be better than a single PPC. Any cooldown reduction to LPPC will give them better DPS and tonnage versus worse heat efficiency and crit slots. The whole PPC family needs some TLC.

it's not weapon stat it's and addon like artemis for all IS ppc to add 5 damage 5 heat with a charge system.

Edited by Shaggath, 24 July 2018 - 07:42 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

process, on 24 July 2018 - 07:22 AM, said:

3 seconds would be a good place to start to begin making the weapon feel useful. However, 2 LPPC shouldn't be better than a single PPC. Any cooldown reduction to LPPC will give them better DPS and tonnage versus worse heat efficiency and crit slots. The whole PPC family needs some TLC.

How about this?

LPPC -> 2s cooldown and 4.5 heat
PPC -> 3.5s cooldown

El Bandito, on 24 July 2018 - 07:41 AM, said:

Increase LPPC GH threshold from 3 max, to 4 max.

Why, then LPPC just compete with PPC and you've created an arms race.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 24 July 2018 - 08:46 AM.

[Zigmund Freud]

90% pro buff, 10% against. I wonder what PGI will do? Oh, I know, nothing, because they don't care.

[El Bandito]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 24 July 2018 - 08:40 AM, said:

Why, then LPPC just compete with PPC and you've created an arms race.

In return they can fiddle with range and other stuff to make them distinct.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

El Bandito, on 24 July 2018 - 08:46 AM, said:

In return they can fiddle with range and other stuff to make them distinct.

Except fiddling with range then puts you either into snub nose or ER territory

[Daurock]

I've always been of the opinion that PPCs are not meant to be fast firing, spammy weapons. They've always been Hot, Hard hitting, and long range, meant to be pinpoint, and not meant to be used gratuitously. If I want to spam fire, I would gravitate towards ACs and Pulse Lasers. As such, I'm not big on buffing the cooldown of the LPPC, or any PPC for that matter.

I do agree though, that several PPCs, including the LPPC need a little bit of help when compared to the plethora of lasers out there. The Light PPC would would be fine with a simple damage buff, (Probably to 6 or so, with a corresponding rise in heat) which would make the weapon a Lighter weight, but harder hitting for the tonnage Standard PPC. To keep it from replacing the PPC in masse, keep the ghost heat limits low, to force stagger fire if you're boating more than 3 of them.
As for my opinions on the other PPCs, the Snub could use an improvement in the heat department, (Making it actually useful for its intended short range) and the Standard PPC could use a 1ish point Damage buff. The clan one, and HPPC are actually OK right now, IMO.

Edited by Daurock, 24 July 2018 - 08:48 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Daurock, on 24 July 2018 - 08:46 AM, said:

The Light PPC would would be fine with a simple damage buff, (Probably to 6 or so, with a corresponding rise in heat) which would make the weapon a Lighter weight, but harder hitting for the tonnage Standard PPC. To keep it from replacing the PPC in masse, keep the ghost heat limits low, to force stagger fire if you're boating more than 3 of them.
As for my opinions on the other PPCs, the Snub could use an improvement in the heat department, (Making it actually useful for its intended short range) and the Standard PPC could use a 1ish point Damage buff. The clan one, and HPPC are actually OK right now, IMO.

By increasing the damage on Standard PPCs and LPPCs, you've successfully changed nothing and kept the status quo.

[Daurock]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 24 July 2018 - 08:48 AM, said:

By increasing the damage on Standard PPCs and LPPCs, you've successfully changed nothing and kept the status quo.

Among the PPCs alone, sure. Not a lot changes. The main point would be to bring them slightly up when compared to all the laser options out there.

[Abaddun]

I wouldn,t be opposed to the PPC capacitor turning the PPC into an energy version of the gauss. If I remember correctly the capacitor explodes when crit too. I will add that it must be 1 capacitor per PPC.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Daurock, on 24 July 2018 - 08:53 AM, said:

Among the PPCs alone, sure. Not a lot changes. The main point would be to bring them slightly up when compared to all the laser options out there.

That doesn't do anything though, if you can't compete with other PPCs which serve the same exact role, why would I bother mounting the lesser options.

[Daurock]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 24 July 2018 - 08:55 AM, said:

That doesn't do anything though, if you can't compete with other PPCs which serve the same exact role, why would I bother mounting the lesser options.

You do it in the lighter chassis, where you don't have the tonnage for heavier options. It would be then, just as it is now, Ton for ton the best IS PPC. The only changes I made slightly exaggerated that difference (I.E. when paired it would gain 2 points of damage, over the Std. PPC's 1 extra damage.)

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Daurock, on 24 July 2018 - 09:02 AM, said:

You do it in the lighter chassis, where you don't have the tonnage for heavier options. It would be then, just as it is now, Ton for ton the best IS PPC. The only changes I made slightly exaggerated that difference (I.E. when paired it would gain 2 points of damage, over the Std. PPC's 1 extra damage.)

I suppose, but I would still be concerned about bigger mechs taking advantage of this. For example this does help bigger mechs that can mount pairs like 4 PPCs or 6 LPPCs since they would have to stagger anyway (since there are breakpoints for these weapons (3 LPPC -> 2 PPC -> 2 HPPC -> 4 PPC -> 4 HPPC). Whereas a cooldown approach limits the real benefits those mechs get because heat is a limiting factor. It would improve their burst a bit more but that would be about it.

Lasers are still different from PPC even in the case of cooldown because of the fact they are hitscan duration weapons that are typically quite a bit lighter.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 24 July 2018 - 09:12 AM.

[Viking Yelling]

Voted no.
A cool down of 4 would be better. LPPC spam is already fairly capable on larger mechs, but is more of a derp build. Its also already better than regular PPC, being that, provided the hardpoints, 2 Lppc is 1 less ton and 1 more slot than 1 reg PPC which is better for light mechs.
And light mech snipers are already annoying enough with erLL. A 2.5 or 3 CD would only make LPPC better in dps than a Large laser, which isnt the purpose of the light PPC.

[b]However,[b/] i would be interested to see Light PPC and Light Gauss see similar ghost heat penalties.
It feels odd that a heavy Ppc and a heavy gauss are capped like a light ppc and a light gauss, while their damage yeild and dps are so different. (Esspecially per ton)
Like, give light gauss and light PPC combos another slot, for dual LG/LPPC, dual LPPC/lighy gauss.
I feel like it should be avalible since it can be enjoyable for some. Gauss/PPC got hit hard and theres no reason it wouldnt work more managably with light gauss and light PPC, given the lower alpha strikes and likeliness of JJ on mechs using Light weapons.