43 replies to this topic

[B0oN]

Athom83, on 07 August 2018 - 03:04 PM, said:

No. This just promotes toxic play and metagaming to specific maps. You want to see constant 12 v 12 LRM duels on Polar LRMland? You want to see everyone in ERLL/ERPPC snipers on Frozen City? You want cheese to become the norm?

Youre way way way way way too late to avoid that fate .
Cheese became the norm in closed beta already .

[Weeny Machine]

Sedmeister, on 08 August 2018 - 04:33 AM, said:

This is my last attempt at explaining this to you.

"Hi, I'd like to buy the apple please."
Grocery puts an apple, a banana, an orange and a grapefruit on the counter and says "that will be $16 please".
I say, "Um, I'd just like the apple which costs $5 thanks."
Grocer says "You can't have the apple unless you buy the banana, orange and grapefruit as well."
I say "Even if I don't want and am not going to eat the other fruit? Even if I just want the apple?"
Grocery "That is correct."
Me "So I have to pay for all the fruit I don't want, to buy the one I do?"
Grocer "Yes."

Are we there yet?

PS - As I said, this will be my last post on this subject as I cannot think about how to make this point any clearer...

He gets it. He just wants to explain to you that you should see it as a "cost" / "requirement" to get the really potent stuff. You cannot have always only what you want all, all the time. Are we there yet?

[Sedmeister]

Bush Hopper, on 09 August 2018 - 12:23 PM, said:

He gets it. He just wants to explain to you that you should see it as a "cost" / "requirement" to get the really potent stuff. You cannot have always only what you want all, all the time. Are we there yet?

<sigh> Remember the mods? When we *already did* pay a price? But just for the things we wanted rather than having to be forced to pay the price for the things we wanted whilst at the same time being forced to pay the price for things we don't want?

<sigh> Are we there yet?

[Sedmeister]

Lykaon, on 09 August 2018 - 08:30 AM, said:

So what if you have to buy up some nodes you don't need or want. That isn't nearly as much of a burden as the cost to LRM users.

You will need to boat the crap out of launchers to penetrate AMS when it is in use. So there is a dedication to what amounts to a one trick pony build or using high mass chassis like assault mechs.

You will want Artemis at a cost of 1 ton per launcher.

You will need a TAG at a cost of 1 energy hardpoint and a ton

You will want an Active Probe to help reduce the impact of ECM counter measures.

And you will want several sensor nodes that no other build type cares about but an LRM user must have to have a hope in hades of being effective.

And then after all the &quot;taxes&quot; are paid an LRM carrier has maps to contend with. There are significantly more unfavorable maps to favorable ones. For ever match the Lurmer gets to play on Polar they had to play 3 x that on maps like mining collective and HPG.

And when all is said and done you don't &quot;need&quot; to buy any radar deprivation at all. even on Polar Highlands you can as a team over run an LRM heavy team. The advantage LRMs possess on polar is only good as long as you can keep the enemy away from you. In close quarters the LRM mechs are nigh unto defenseless and bearly capable of inflicting damage at all.


I primaraly pilot heavy I.S. brawlers these days (MRM Archer tempest or Roughnecks) I do not freak out when I see polar highlands (in particular when I'm in my Tempest it's got ECM and AMS) none of the roughnecks mount AMS and obviously no ECM. But, I know how to utilize defilade to close in on LRM heavy teams and frequently I make it my mission to destroy or supress LRM mechs on Polar because I know so many other players &quot;freak out&quot; on polar when they see some LRMs flying around.

Lykaon, you're making my point.

Back in the day, you want radar dep? Pay the 2.5 mil cost and use a slot. Done.

Now, you want radar dep? Pay the money, use a percentage of your skill node slots, done. But you have to pay the money and use a percentage of your node slots for stuff you don't want as well.

This cynical practice is imposed upon me, wanting radar dep only. It's imposed upon you wanting to run a custom LRM build only.

What I'm saying is, don't call skill trees a system that allows for customisation. I cannot customise the mech the way I want in the same way I did prior to skill trees. We are limited in our ability to customise. It's like saying in pre skill trees days, you want a custom LRM boat build? Well before you buy the Target decay mod, you have to purchase the quick ignition mod first. But what's quick ignition got to do with my custom LRM build? Nothing!

This is the beef I have.

Feel free to pick you LRM map and build, but let me be free to be able to counter it if I so choose, as should you.