60 replies to this topic

[Nightbird]

No more overheat shutdown when over 100% heat. When >100% heat, your mech gets a -2% to agility/top speed for every 1% over 100 heat. Basically, at 110% heat, you'll get -20% to agility and top speed. At >=150% heat, your agility and speed drop to 0 and all weapons are frozen, you're basically a smoldering statue. Scale the damage from overheating down by 90%, linearly scaled to the heat over 100% again, so overheat death is much rarer.

Normally, the trigger becomes blocked when over 100% heat, but override gets rid of that.

Shutting down does not mitigate overheat damage anymore.

I think this system is more casual friendly and lore accurate. If you consider all the affected scenarios, the penalties for accidentally overheating is greatly decreased compared to today, and the ways to abuse going over 100% today are also reduced (free big alpha and shutdown to avoid damage, or overriding to 250% and beyond to suicide)

Penny for your thoughts

Edited by Nightbird, 13 December 2018 - 02:18 PM.

[HammerMaster]

No.
No it doesn't sound more fun.
It sounds like more of the same high heat, pin point , alpharrior drek we are already saddled with and SICK OF!
More fun would be :
Print a record sheet.
Use the established rules for overheat.
Hit penalty (the jumpjet crosshair dance)
Speed penalty
Pilot damage.
Ammo cook off
Stackpole (exlpode)
Over 100% is asenine.

Suggestion reeks of old MW4 no heat/no ammo server. Disgusting!

Edited by HammerMaster, 13 December 2018 - 01:56 PM.

[Prototelis]

+1 for stackpole

[Nightbird]

Currently, you're at 90% heat with a alpha build, the other mech is open CT, you do a full alpha, he dies, you shutdown automatically and then recover having taken only 1-2% overheat damage.

With this idea, in the same situation, you alpha and he dies still, but you can no longer mitigate the internal overheat damage by shutting down and will take around 10% damage. If you have ammo, it can cook off.

Currently, if you misjudge your heat by 5%, you shutdown and in a bad spot will probably die.

With this idea, you'll be sluggish for a few seconds, and then recover.

Currently, if you want to deny a kill to the other team, you can alpha over and over again while overriding, getting over 250% heat and dying from internal damage.

With this idea, you can only get to 150% heat before becoming frozen even with override. Even getting to 125% heat in a 1vs1 situation will easily allow the other mech to target your components or maneuver behind you for a back shot.

I'd say there are plenty of trade-offs.

[K O Z A K]

I think this might create quite a buff to static firing lines (You can comfortably keep shooting in the 100-150% range if you are stationary), it would become much tougher to attack on siege maps, no?

[HammerMaster]

Sorry.
You missed my assertation that the current system is trash also.

[Nightbird]

Hazeclaw, on 13 December 2018 - 02:08 PM, said:

I think this might create quite a buff to static firing lines (You can comfortably keep shooting in the 100-150% range if you are stationary), it would become much tougher to attack on siege maps, no?

Well, you will die from internal overheat damage. Without shutdown being a free avoid overheat damage mechanic, you'll die in about 1 min if you run over 100% heat for that long, instead of 5-10 seconds today when overriding. There are 0 benefits to DPS as your dissipation doesn't increase, and you're taking critical damage as well so losing HS, weapons, ammo left and right.

Basically, the penalties from accidentally going over 100% is greatly decreased, and the ways to abuse going over 100% as in today's mechanics are greatly reduced as well.

Edited by Nightbird, 13 December 2018 - 02:15 PM.

[Nightbird]

QuakeRiley, on 13 December 2018 - 02:12 PM, said:

So what you're saying is that I could run 4 UAC/10s on an ANH and not care about being slower because I'm already going as fast as glaciers move?

Yes! If you don't mind being 25, 50, or even 100% slower!

[Nightbird]

HammerMaster, on 13 December 2018 - 02:08 PM, said:

Sorry.
You missed my assertation that the current system is trash also.

No problem. I'm against stackpoling due to fusion mechanics. I believe the % agility/speed penalty does translate the speed & aiming penalty you want. In addition, with no free shutdowns anymore, you'll see a lot more overheat components destroyed and ammo explosions (though % chance is obvious low compared to TT). No pilot HP implemented ingame, though I'm not against a blur effect to vision based on heat.

[HammerMaster]

Stackpoling is extreme but a consequence of pushing that limit too far.
I'm for the oringal Record Sheet heat mechanics.
Nothing more. Nothing less.

[Nightbird]

HammerMaster, on 13 December 2018 - 02:29 PM, said:

Stackpoling is extreme but a consequence of pushing that limit too far.
I'm for the oringal Record Sheet heat mechanics.
Nothing more. Nothing less.

*shrug* if offered half of what you ask for, you'll always walk away then?

[HammerMaster]

Principles.

[Nightbird]

HammerMaster, on 13 December 2018 - 02:41 PM, said:

Principles.

A man willing to accept half of what he asks for will eventually have half of everything he's ever wanted. Whereas a man not willing to compromise will have...

[K O Z A K]

Unless I'm misunderstanding, part of your proposal means you take 10% damage of what it is now in the 100-150% range at the cost of mobility penalties. In a static firing line this would mean you can easily fire off up to an extra alpha per mech and take much less damage than now, and not have to shut down, no? In the context of multiple mechs this means you can drop a few more enemies with less overheat damage if you don't mind the mobility penalty.

It's not that it's worse than what we have now, but I don't see how it's really much better, just different

Edited by Hazeclaw, 13 December 2018 - 02:50 PM.

[Nightbird]

Hazeclaw, on 13 December 2018 - 02:49 PM, said:

Unless I'm misunderstanding, part of your proposal means you take 10% damage of what it is now in the 100-150% range at the cost of mobility penalties. In a static firing line this would mean you can easily fire off up to an extra alpha per mech and take much less damage than now, and not have to shut down, no? In the context of multiple mechs this means you can drop a few more enemies with less overheat damage if you don't mind the mobility penalty.

It's not that it's worse than what we have now, but I don't see how it's really much better, just different

Well, it depends on when you take that >100% heat shot. Suppose you're in a firing line, and a team is brawling into you.

If you do it early in the fight and take yourself to 140% heat, then if you want to maintain your DPS you will be taking internal damage the entire time of the fight. You're unable to re-position with -80% speed. If you are targeted by a brawler, you will be unable to spread damage or arm shield with -80% agility. Even if the enemy is not shooting at you, you will die after 1 min. All this for ONE ALPHA, since a second will put you over 150% and in stunlock.

If you do it late when several brawlers are on top of you, you take little overheat damage but the agility nerf will mean you die anyways. There's also no chance to fire off several extra alphas when overriding.

Basically, this is a nerf to ways to intentionally game the heat system that exists today.


For example, you can alpha over 100%, power down, power up, alpha, power down, over and over again while minimizing internal damage despite being way over 300%.

[HammerMaster]

Nightbird, on 13 December 2018 - 02:44 PM, said:

A man willing to accept half of what he asks for will eventually have half of everything he's ever wanted. Whereas a man not willing to compromise will have...

Not sold his soul to compromise.
Unless your married of course.

[Nightbird]

HammerMaster, on 13 December 2018 - 03:04 PM, said:

Not sold his soul to compromise.
Unless your married of course.

I was just going for 'Princlples', maybe I should have put the quote below my text.

[FupDup]

HammerMaster, on 13 December 2018 - 01:54 PM, said:

Ammo cook off

That penalty has always been stupid because it exclusively punishes mixed builds that use ammo-based weapons while their energy weapons cool down. Energy boats with no ammo are completely immune to this penalty.

[Kubernetes]

If the integrity of your soul is dependent on MWO heat mechanics...

[HammerMaster]

Well sir. The aim is not to punish mix builds as I am a huge advocate of them.
The punishment is for people who keep riding the heat curve.
Despite the fact that here your heralded as skillful for doing so rather than exlpoiting the lack of consequences.