52 replies to this topic

[Variant1]

The fault lies squarely on the community on this one. BUT pgi shouldve had only 1 bucket instead of 7.......
that was a major oversight

[Burning2nd]

MWWGA

Make mechwarrior great again,

reset it back to 2012.... let everyone keep there mechs and weapons
roll the weapons back to 2012 *so we have 90degree lrms
change the physics back to how it use to be.. so we can go "dragon bowling" again

Reintroduce turrets and escort, BUT make that escort either faster or armed.. Or controlled (i know this is to hard)

Solaris, Just remove it... and make a FFA mode,

make larger maps, with more spawns, *something between the 45 min it takes to do a round of FW and the 60 seconds that happens on Qp

make a object able match.. Where there is more then just shooting each other *collecting batters is the closest thing to an objective we have

Bring back a selective option for use of Old maps

Variant1, on 26 January 2019 - 10:16 PM, said:

The fault lies squarely on the community on this one.

yeah because they keep on listening to grown a s s men ***** and complain about video game needs and wants...

It should be like you have to have prior experience with Mechwarrior to make suggestions..

I realize some of you power players never saw MSDos (also some of the people working for PGI) lol

[Dogstar]

Burning2nd, on 27 January 2019 - 01:08 AM, said:

yeah because they keep on listening to grown a s s men ***** and complain about video game needs and wants...

PGI's problem is that they _don't_ listen to the community in any detail - all they do is look at a few selected tweets and headlines and then go off in a completely stupid direction

All the major recent features are like this:

Solaris was desired by the community but PGI made a complete balls up of the implementation because they didn't actually listen to any suggestions about the detail of the feature

A skill tree/mech customisation feature was asked for by the community but PGI managed to implement it in a totally annoying way that lost them a third of the player base

Weapon changes were asked for by the community but PGI ignored the detailed suggestions, made changes to heat sinks instead and lost another third of the player base

PGI have a history of epic fails but Solaris was probably the most expensive and embarrassing one

[NRP]

It always seemed to me that Solaris was made to facilitate PGI's eSports ambitions. So if pro gamers embrace Solaris and have big tournaments around it, I guess Solaris would meet PGI's goals and thus be successful.

Not sure if that has happened though. I don't pay much attention to eSports or pro gaming.

[DarkFhoenix]

I think Solaris is a nice add on . MWO needs more stand alone game modes .

[Burning2nd]

yeah well... IDK if you guys know this or not.. BUT mechwarrior And battletech in general has a small population worldwide, as it is

Its the closet nerd game... This isnt star craft (i hate to use that example) ITS never been battle feild 2

a half a million people bought mechwarrior 2 in 1995
there are give or take a average of 1000 people playing mwo...


Im not knocking it.. its the only mechwarrior game we have.. and until something else comes out, this is all We got.. Its just sad that PGI didn't actually consider the voice of people who have been mechwarriors for the last 30 years

[R Valentine]

Variant1, on 26 January 2019 - 10:16 PM, said:

The fault lies squarely on the community on this one. BUT pgi shouldve had only 1 bucket instead of 7.......
that was a major oversight

How does the fault lie with the community? If people liked it, they'd play it. Clearly they don't. What we like and don't like is not our fault. It's PGI fault for not giving us what we'd actually pay for.

[Ilfi]

Solaris is fun but the C-Bill rewards are pathetic. There's easily 5 minutes of downtime between each 90 second fire fight, for something like 50,000 C-Bills. It's chump change with no rewards system.

[GeminiWolf]

Brizna, on 26 January 2019 - 04:02 AM, said:

Solaris is fundamentally flawed, more maps wouldn't fix it. It was actually pretty obvious to anyone who had done one or two 1 vs 1 player run tournaments that 1 vs 1 is nice to have some relaxed fun with friends every few months but that it is immensely dull and uninteresting in the long run, it simply lacks the depth and variation required to stay interesting. Thing is I don't think people who run this game play much of it and are out of touch with reality, so they wasted a huge deal of effort in a doomed game mode and are probably still wondering why Solaris failed so miserably.

Actually their problem was listening to the Top Players who post on the forums, they are the ones who wanted Solaris. Considering they are a very small group, PGI basically put resources into something that few wanted. No I am not badmouthing the Great Pilots, I simply stating the fact that they are a smaller group than the average Pilot.

[Y E O N N E]

GeminiWolf, on 27 January 2019 - 04:10 PM, said:

Actually their problem was listening to the Top Players who post on the forums, they are the ones who wanted Solaris. Considering they are a very small group, PGI basically put resources into something that few wanted. No I am not badmouthing the Great Pilots, I simply stating the fact that they are a smaller group than the average Pilot.

Almost none of the top players wanted it. It was almost entirely a "Phil, Daeron, NGNGTV chat, and Russ want it so we're going to do it" affair.

[Wil McCullough]

Y E O N N E, on 27 January 2019 - 04:38 PM, said:

Almost none of the top players wanted it. It was almost entirely a "Phil, Daeron, NGNGTV chat, and Russ want it so we're going to do it" affair.

A lot of the "lights op" crowd wanted it as well.

Solaris ahowed them that it wasn't lights that were op, but they themselves were up when they die to everything from locusts to atlases. A lot of them quietly quit the game mode pretty quickly.

They're still whining on the forums though.

[Renzor the Red]

I very much dislike Solaris. I did the one 'participate in 7 matches for a million c-bills' challenge, but I hate the min-maxed mechs. I've brought many of my well-balanced PUG mechs in there--mechs that I'm pretty good in in normal games--and get wasted every time by max damage weapons.

[Alcom Isst]

renzor51, on 27 January 2019 - 07:55 PM, said:

I've brought many of my well-balanced PUG mechs

Bad mechs. You've brought bad mechs. If you have to complain that you're losing because your opponents have better mechs then you have bad mechs.

[Burning2nd]

dont feel bad i won 3 in a row then popped my top 6 times

i refuse to rebuild a mech that i do great with out in the field.. BUT is not designed to 1v1

[PhoenixFire55]

Spheroid, on 26 January 2019 - 12:07 PM, said:

With a clean slate they could have chosen any fire mechanic they wanted to for MW5 and did not choose the above. I assume you are one of two opinions, either alphas should be unlimited or there should be spread. Please declare where you stand.

This has been discussed over and over and over for the entire time this game exists. The fact that you don't see the solution and PGI doesn't see or refuses to see the solution doesn't mean the solution doesn't exist.

Manual limited speed convergence for arm-mounted weaponry. Fixed pre-set distance convergence for torso-mounted weaponry.
And no, I am not going to elaborate for the 100th time.
That is all.

[Horseman]

Burning2nd, on 28 January 2019 - 01:08 AM, said:

dont feel bad i won 3 in a row then popped my top 6 times
i refuse to rebuild a mech that i do great with out in the field.. BUT is not designed to 1v1

Build for brawl, problem solved.

[Variant1]

Kiran Yagami, on 27 January 2019 - 12:56 PM, said:

How does the fault lie with the community? If people liked it, they'd play it. Clearly they don't. What we like and don't like is not our fault. It's PGI fault for not giving us what we'd actually pay for.

because they were the ones who wanted this mode? Ya should have known when they said they could only code red vs blue and no ffa that was the first red flag yet everyone kept say "please add solaris" and so they did.

RussianWolf, on 16 February 2017 - 07:24 AM, said:

Solaris mode was supposed to happen in 2014. Then it was supposed to happen shortly after CW was implemented.

Then a joke was added to the private matches and called Solaris.

I've given up hope and closed my wallet permanently.

This should have been considered low hanging fruit and been one of the first things in the game. Lack of foresight on PGIs part. That it has never been implemented in 5 years show lack of competence in PGIs management.

and other links of community asking for solaris:
https://mwomercs.com...l-solaris-mode/
https://mwomercs.com...176244-solaris/
https://mwomercs.com...it-for-solaris/
https://mwomercs.com...-solaris-arena/
https://mwomercs.com...s-announcement/
https://mwomercs.com...king-for-input/
https://mwomercs.com...on/page__st__20
https://mwomercs.com...we-get-solaris/
https://mwomercs.com...aris-game-mode/
check and mate
Also there was one guy who called out that solaris would fail

Acehilator, on 20 August 2017 - 12:21 PM, said:

The whole thing will arrive piecemeal 9 month later than projected, with a trainwreck of epic proportions called "mech divisions" happening in the background. Lots of people will try it out, 95% of people will drop it like it's hot a week later. Manyears of work wasted on a feature that will see regular use by a few hundred people.

GG

PGI is so lucky to have hardcore BT fans as players of their game, nobody else would keep a game afloat this long were management decisions this bad are par for the course.

https://mwomercs.com...anting-solaris/

[R Valentine]

Variant1, on 28 January 2019 - 08:39 AM, said:

because they were the ones who wanted this mode? Ya should have known when they said they could only code red vs blue and no ffa that was the first red flag yet everyone kept say "please add solaris" and so they did.

Most threads are about 12 man or 8 man free-for-all Solaris, and the others are about possible additions like c-bill wagers. None of them are "GIVE US SOLARIS NOW WE WANT NOW GIVE PGI MAKE IT HAPPEN!" In fact, virtually all of them were made after Solaris was announced. Again, PGI did not give anyone something they wanted. Calling it "Solaris" doesn't make it the Solaris people wanted. Most people wanted 12 man free for all. And a few simple changes might at least give Solaris some life. For example, eliminate divisions. Separating a dead mode into 7 different buckets is just asinine. At least give the few people that still want to play access to play with one another. Then more people might be enticed to jump in.

Edited by Kiran Yagami, 28 January 2019 - 09:02 AM.

[Variant1]

Kiran Yagami, on 28 January 2019 - 09:00 AM, said:

Most threads are about 12 man or 8 man free-for-all Solaris, and the others are about possible additions like c-bill wagers. None of them are "GIVE US SOLARIS NOW WE WANT NOW GIVE PGI MAKE IT HAPPEN!" In fact, virtually all of them were made after Solaris was announced. Again, PGI did not give anyone something they wanted. Calling it "Solaris" doesn't make it the Solaris people wanted. Most people wanted 12 man free for all. And a few simple changes might at least give Solaris some life. For example, eliminate divisions. Separating a dead mode into 7 different buckets is just asinine. At least give the few people that still want to play access to play with one another. Then more people might be enticed to jump in.

exactly we wanted ffa but pgi said they could only do red vs blue. So after that the community shouldve of said to cancel solaris but they didnt. instead we ended up getting more of these:

Coolant, on 16 February 2017 - 08:20 AM, said:

would love Solaris

would love unlimited respawn

Rovertoo, on 20 August 2017 - 02:37 PM, said:

Why wouldnt you want it? Its an awesome idea! And before anyone says something about player population, the amount of people playing seems way higher now than it was a few years ago, having come back after 2 years hiatus the game is currently in a much better place than it was before (though I do miss my old maps), and I for one am 100% on board with all the features they proposed. My only gripe is just how long it takes them to implement anything, but oh well. I know me and my brother will have a ton of fun playing Solaris 2v2, and I really hope they figure out how to do a free for all like Russ wants, cause that would be amazing!

Monkey Lover, on 23 June 2017 - 09:48 PM, said:

1v1
2v2
Match viewing
cbill gambling (even with small limits)
handfull of small new maps
Free viewing option so friends can at least watch your matches.
Changeable rules. Option like no flamers or streaks.


I will buy this.

Templar Dane, on 15 August 2016 - 11:48 AM, said:

I want 1v1, 2v2, 4v4 etc

list goes on, community now reaps what it sows. If they wanted ffa they shouldnt have bothered cuz pgi cant code

Edited by Variant1, 28 January 2019 - 09:36 AM.

[Koniving]

Spheroid, on 26 January 2019 - 12:07 PM, said:

Not a waste at all. It is in fact the most labor efficient method of dealing with large pinpoint alphas that have been part of first person MechWarrior for over twenty-five years. The only ways of attacking pinpoint is either a cone of fire or random hit tables. Notice that no company in the history of first person BattleTech has gone this route. Do you think that is coincidence?

With a clean slate they could have chosen any fire mechanic they wanted to for MW5 and did not choose the above. I assume you are one of two opinions, either alphas should be unlimited or there should be spread. Please declare where you stand.

The "random hit tables" you speak of from tabletop isn't so much because "mechs can't aim", but because the weapons fire is spread across 10 seconds, with convergence only really happening for the arms (depending on the fluff and the mech, as some mechs have adjustable torso weapons and those have a bonus to their accuracy in design quirks), and in that same ten second period encompassing movement and the pilots also taking defensive and evasive action. Note you cannot "call the shot" unless the pilot is unconscious (the mech cannot automatically act or react without the pilot's intention), if the mech is shut down, or the mech is considered immobile (and note a movement point availability of zero does NOT count as immobile, as it can still "trash around" inside 30 meters, meaning it can still evade and block incoming fire even if it can't leave that 30 meter hex).

Think trying to aim at zombies in RE 2 remake, they aren't holding still for you. Try to hit one for ten seconds and tell me how many misses or accidental hits on the wrong parts you get.

That's what the random chance is trying to do.

---------

Cone of fire is unnecessary. Instead, the game needs PHYSICS.
Imagine hitting someone when your mech does THIS!?

And all they are doing is ******* walking! WALKING! But for their size, that would throw off their aim by several feet with EACH STEP.

Also the incompatability of ballistics and lasers is a bit of a problem that shouldn't be a problem.
If you're going 64.8 kph forward, and shooting 90s left, your shot should both be going the speed of the bullet to the direction your gun was facing + 90 degrees to its right at 64.8 kph (the velocity your legs are moving 'forward') for a combined velocity of to your 45 degree angle, so that where your crosshair ends up at the point of impact IS where your bullet actually ends up at the point of impact.

So if your target is here and lets assume it is stationary, and "down" is forward.
+ (and you fire at this moment) <--pow
_(ignorethisline)_____________/ (note I can't get the right angle in text)
______________________/
___________________/
________________/
____________/
______/
+Klink.

This is why hitting things in moving vehicles is so difficult, real world physics. All momentum is transfered, the shot isn't just going "straight", its going "straight + your direction" If you fire forward, the shot is going its native speed + your speed. If you fire while running away, the shot is going its native speed - your speed. And not just speed, velocity... the direction you go affects the bullet.

In other words, if you're running in that original circumstance, but the way you fired allowed you to hit the guy with your laser and he is also running in the same direction, every bullet you fired would hit provided he is going at the same speed. If not, adjust slightly forward and those bullets would hit. In real life if you and the target are going the same speed, you do not lead the shot if you want to hit, you only lead if you are going slower than the target and you subtract from the lead if you are going faster than the target.

In other words, in some situations you'd hit more often...and in many others a lot of players would be missing a lot without thinking... in a "Thinking man's shooter."

Pure.
Physics.
And its really effective.

This is one of the many reasons there's a lot of missing in tabletop, it tries to simulate this (and does a meh job of it). But no mech game ever has even tried it.

For a good example of this, try War Thunder and you'll get a good example of what I'm talking about; the shells have their own velocity + your velocity, as such like Battletech, you'll be a LOT more accurate when not moving versus when moving. This is also affected by the way the terrain affects you, as any bump, tilt, etc will throw it off.
This is done without cone of fire, without randomness, its pure physics.
Now outside of realistic mode, the shells do not include velocity of the tank making it quite a bit easier. But the physics of movement, aside from the inclusion of movement velocity to projectile, is there.


Skip to 7 minutes.

4 minutes in, start getting incoming fire and on the fourth or fifth shot I dodge it; this is what BT is assuming mechs are doing in tabletop, dodging and/or blocking shots as mechs are written to do this automatically [in addition to the pilot torso twisting] within their ability. This is why arm shots are so common, raise the arm to soak the fire; you can see this in MW2's intro, actually, wherre the Summoner raises up its arm to soak up fire away from the body.


Here's one in realistic, you might notice I do a lot more stationary shooting, as I was told ahead of time about this. Running around like an idiot and shooting might work if the other guy is doing it too, but if not...its just a good way to die. Mechs can tank more than these tanks can though.