121 replies to this topic

[Gas Guzzler]

FupDup, on 19 March 2019 - 02:44 PM, said:

I think the health value reductions are more important than giving AMS 25 extra meters of range.

Uhh yeah, most definitely!

[Johny Rocket]

AMS shooting through terrain wasn't much of an issue when the arc was high and broke cover but it is messing with direct fire badly and needs to be fixed.

Im guessing this is effecting srms and mrms as well.

Yeah nerfing missile health was bs but it just compounds this existing problem.

Edited by Johny Rocket, 19 March 2019 - 08:56 PM.

[Nightbird]

They need to tune with percentages... LRM5 to 20 is a 30% reduction in hp per missile, MRM10 to 40 is a whooping 60% reduction in missile health. They must really hate MRMs lol!

[The6thMessenger]

Nightbird, on 19 March 2019 - 08:57 PM, said:

They need to tune with percentages... LRM5 to 20 is a 30% reduction in hp per missile, MRM10 to 40 is a whooping 60% reduction in missile health. They must really hate MRMs lol!

It's sad how their concept seems good on paper. Because really having smaller launchers with higher health to compensate for AMS is good, but their execution is just so god damn poor.

[Khobai]

I think the idea behind nerfing SRM and MRM missile health was to make AMS more impactful at shooting down SRMs and MRMs.

The problem is SRMs and MRMs already do crappy damage without AMS obliterating them.

If theyre going to make AMS more effective at shooting down SRMs/MRMs then SRMs/MRMs need their damage increased proportionally so they dont suck and so they punish people who dont bring AMS.

They probably shouldve increased SRMs to 2.5 damage and MRMs to 1.25 damage.


If missiles are going to have equipment that counters them then missiles need to be more powerful than weapons than dont have equipment that counters them (like lasers). Otherwise missiles are just weaker than other weapons for no good reason, as the case appears to be now.

Edited by Khobai, 19 March 2019 - 10:34 PM.

[The6thMessenger]

Khobai, on 19 March 2019 - 10:25 PM, said:

I think the idea behind nerfing SRM and MRM missile health was to make AMS more impactful at shooting down SRMs and MRMs.

The problem is SRMs and MRMs already do crappy damage without AMS obliterating them.

If theyre going to make AMS more effective at shooting down SRMs/MRMs then SRMs/MRMs need their damage increased proportionally so they dont suck and so they punish people who dont bring AMS.

They probably shouldve increased SRMs to 2.5 damage and MRMs to 1.25 damage.


If missiles are going to have equipment that counters them then missiles need to be more powerful than weapons than dont have equipment that counters them (like lasers). Otherwise missiles are just weaker than other weapons for no good reason, as the case appears to be now.

I don't mind the MRM and SRM (and SSRM) damage buff. Brawling needs to be a bit more attractive to do nowadays.

[KursedVixen]

Scout Derek, on 19 March 2019 - 02:02 PM, said:

We also learned this;


So enjoy the AMS buffs, because literally any mech that uses SRMs or MRMs now will be gimped. Lasers and Dakka are the only ones left.


We did private testing. Sorry about that, thought you'd know because I would think you'd have discord.

and also if there are more than 2 ams Srms are useless and so are atms..

[Monkey Lover]

KursedVixen, on 19 March 2019 - 10:52 PM, said:

and also if there are more than 2 ams Srms are useless and so are atms..

Maybe just dont fire srm at a 4ams mech at 200m? You only have to worry about 4 mechs....

I dont see this being much of an issur with srm. As its a short range brawl weapon.

MRM i can see.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 19 March 2019 - 11:17 PM.

[dwwolf]

Monkey Lover, on 19 March 2019 - 11:16 PM, said:

Maybe just dont fire srm at a 4ams mech at 200m? You only have to worry about 4 mechs....

I dont see this being much of an issur with srm. As its a short range brawl weapon.

MRM i can see.

Er yeah....but....the problem is that AMS fires through terrain and at all missiles within range. So that 4 AMS mech obliterates every salvo ..Even for other mechs...which it never did per BT rules.

[Robinson Crusher]

The6thMessenger, on 19 March 2019 - 02:43 PM, said:

Some people thought that the LRM rework is an overall nerf due to lower arc not clearing soft covers, but it's actually the AMS. Damn PGI being PGI.

lol, I'll support the second statement, but the first isn't quite right. While the AMS is definitely an issue (a 40 lrm volley often does nothing now) the lower arc is an issue. I use my lrms most at ranges of 150 to 300 metres, so it's not hard to eyeball the flight path. I'm getting lot's of indirect shots that fly using the flat arc and end up hitting team mates and hills...

[Aidan Crenshaw]

At these ranges, at least they inflict even less teamdamage than they would have on the enemy.

[Curccu]

It was amusing to spectate lurm timber Yesterday it was shooting LRM20, I heard shoooosh sound but no missiles flying, all of them were shot instanty they exited tubes.

[Monkey Lover]

dwwolf, on 19 March 2019 - 11:37 PM, said:

Er yeah....but....the problem is that AMS fires through terrain and at all missiles within range. So that 4 AMS mech obliterates every salvo ..Even for other mechs...which it never did per BT rules.

The number of ams on the field will balance out. We have more ams than is needed and people will learn this.

After people boating need to change builds. Stop running 3x20lrm. Boat 6xlrm10.

Change mrm40 to 2xmrm20. And so on.

[KursedVixen]

Monkey Lover, on 19 March 2019 - 11:16 PM, said:

Maybe just dont fire srm at a 4ams mech at 200m? You only have to worry about 4 mechs....

I dont see this being much of an issur with srm. As its a short range brawl weapon.

MRM i can see.

but now that 4 ams mech can protect it's allies.... so you have to worry about it whever it can be thus....

[FRAGTAST1C]

Are these changes really as bad as they seem to be? A good chunk of my mechs are SRMs or MRMs with a big AC or some pulse lasers accompanying them. For e.g., the Kraken has a dual MRM30 + AC20 loadout. How would this fair still? I used to do well in it back in December.

[Dee Eight]

FRAGTAST1C, on 19 March 2019 - 11:59 PM, said:

Are these changes really as bad as they seem to be? A good chunk of my mechs are SRMs or MRMs with a big AC or some pulse lasers accompanying them. For e.g., the Kraken has a dual MRM30 + AC20 loadout. How would this fair still? I used to do well in it back in December.

No because only forum warriors are actually fitting AMS (if they didn't already) to mechs. The meta comp players and everybody who doesn't read the patch notes still aren't carrying AMS on many mechs.

[Khobai]

Dee Eight, on 20 March 2019 - 12:09 AM, said:

No because only forum warriors are actually fitting AMS (if they didn't already) to mechs. The meta comp players and everybody who doesn't read the patch notes still aren't carrying AMS on many mechs.

Irrelevant. It doesnt matter if people actually use AMS or not, because thats a personal choice. Its the very fact that AMS exists that means missile weapons like SRMs/MRMs need to be stronger than other weapons, such as lasers, that DONT have counters.

If someone is using missile weapons against you, and you dont have AMS, you should immediately regret not taking AMS. Otherwise missiles arnt at the proper balancing point. If AMS is going to counter SRMs/MRMs then SRMs/MRMs need to hit way harder to punish people for not taking AMS and remind people why AMS exists.

Having SRMs/MRMs be crappy weapons that get even crappier when people have AMS is unacceptable. If PGI wants AMS to be important enough to tip the scales without rendering missiles weapons useless, then SRMs/MRMs should be below average in the presence of AMS and above average in the absence of AMS.

For that to happen, SRM/MRM damage needs to be increased.

Edited by Khobai, 20 March 2019 - 12:28 AM.

[Xeno Phalcon]

Can I has reflective and reactive armor naoh?

[zerosouL]

Khobai, on 20 March 2019 - 12:14 AM, said:

Irrelevant. It doesnt matter if people actually use AMS or not, because thats a personal choice. Its the very fact that AMS exists that means missile weapons like SRMs/MRMs need to be stronger than other weapons, such as lasers, that DONT have counters.

Other weapons cant shoot you without LOS and over obstacles like LRMs. And thats why we have AMS to counter that.

[K O Z A K]

If they fix ams going through terrain and adjust mrm and srm health values to make sense, this will be perfect