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Spot Target Wall Hack...


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#21 Grus

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 07:11 AM

#inb4lock

#22 TheCaptainJZ

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 08:04 AM

Rather than disappearing, the notification on the minimap should drop at the xy coordinates of the enemy at that time and never follow the target. It's only a few moments that it appears on screen and then it doesn't matter if it's LOS or not.

#23 Sjorpha

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 08:20 AM

View PostTheCaptainJZ, on 13 June 2019 - 08:04 AM, said:

Rather than disappearing, the notification on the minimap should drop at the xy coordinates of the enemy at that time and never follow the target. It's only a few moments that it appears on screen and then it doesn't matter if it's LOS or not.


+1, that would be a perfect solution.

#24 GweNTLeR

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 08:26 AM

I'm pretty sure TS is some random LRM noob that wants "equality" with red square mechanics. Show where those evil ballistics guys touched you.

#25 Grus

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Posted 13 June 2019 - 08:30 AM

View PostGweNTLeR, on 13 June 2019 - 08:26 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure TS is some random LRM noob that wants "equality" with red square mechanics. Show where those evil ballistics guys touched you.


Careful with the "E" word...

#26 dario03

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Posted 17 June 2019 - 05:47 PM

View PostWillard Phule, on 13 June 2019 - 06:13 AM, said:


So....putting SP into target retention should be ignored. Nice thinking.



If you have acquired target then it can stay for as long as the target box is up, if not then it can drop with loss of LOS.

#27 Cipher2012

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Posted 28 June 2020 - 08:32 PM

Don't be so ****. The spot feature does nothing to targets breaking Los other than leaving a mark on them. So missle locks are not buffed and still fall off when you break Los. And you have to physically press R before you can spot them. So if you have ecm you can only be targeted if they are close enough to lock you as a target. The feature is there for people who do not have a mic to still communicate an enemy's location on the fly. There is a cooldown and you can only spot one target at a time. You want to complain about something. Why not complain about the high rate of speeds that heavy and assault mechs can move. The result has been nascar after nascar of mechs back stabbing that's more annoying than being spotted for 10 seconds.

#28 dario03

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Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:29 PM

View PostCipher2012, on 28 June 2020 - 08:32 PM, said:

Don't be so ****. The spot feature does nothing to targets breaking Los other than leaving a mark on them. So missle locks are not buffed and still fall off when you break Los. And you have to physically press R before you can spot them. So if you have ecm you can only be targeted if they are close enough to lock you as a target. The feature is there for people who do not have a mic to still communicate an enemy's location on the fly. There is a cooldown and you can only spot one target at a time. You want to complain about something. Why not complain about the high rate of speeds that heavy and assault mechs can move. The result has been nascar after nascar of mechs back stabbing that's more annoying than being spotted for 10 seconds.

Not sure why this got bumped from a year ago but I think the suggestions from then still hold true and would still allow no mic people to relay information without the extra benefit of no los tracking that the current system gives.

View Postdario03, on 12 June 2019 - 09:28 AM, said:

It should be changed so that it drops once LOS is broken, or changes the icon to something that indicates last seen position.


View PostTheCaptainJZ, on 13 June 2019 - 08:04 AM, said:

Rather than disappearing, the notification on the minimap should drop at the xy coordinates of the enemy at that time and never follow the target. It's only a few moments that it appears on screen and then it doesn't matter if it's LOS or not.


I think the best would be like Captain said but the icon shows which way they were going if moving, and maybe the weight class. That's about as much if not more info as you get from most mic calls.

#29 Nesutizale

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Posted 29 June 2020 - 01:43 AM

Just read into the op I think he is talking about the command wheel function. Yes that its there longer then the LOS, even with decay, would alow is strange. It should be connected to each other. So even if you use the command wheel the target should disapear when there is no LOS from any friendly or yourself.

What I would like to see is something like in WoWs where you get a grey marker that shows the last position and heading. That way you don't have an exact position but a general idea.

#30 Nearly Dead

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Posted 29 June 2020 - 05:38 AM

In reality, this whole game is nonsensical. In real life no one would spend crazy amounts of money to land on a planet and blow stuff up with mechs at great personal risk when you can pick up a basket of nickel iron asteroids on the way to orbit, add Pave Tack type packages to them, and destroy anything from a tank to a city from orbit.

#31 Nesutizale

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Posted 29 June 2020 - 11:23 AM

As soon as you have space supperiority any kind of ground combat is stupid. Maybe except you want to steal something intact or maybe to dissable ground-orbital defances and send in an insergent team...but that is not the point of BT and big stompy robots ^_^

Still some game mechanic need to make sense, for a belivable envoirment and also to have certain game elements.
The current "I press a key and can then see you forver" isn't good in both cases.

#32 OneTeamPlayer

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 07:52 AM

What is with this forum's users and digging through ancient posts instead of creating a brand new one?

If the beginning of a post was nearly a year ago and the thread isn't a guide, set of strategies, or some other form of long term information, what do you guys gain out of resurrecting like this?

#33 Sergeant Destroy

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 08:15 AM

View PostOneTeamPlayer, on 14 July 2020 - 07:52 AM, said:

What is with this forum's users and digging through ancient posts instead of creating a brand new one?

If the beginning of a post was nearly a year ago and the thread isn't a guide, set of strategies, or some other form of long term information, what do you guys gain out of resurrecting like this?


Why not? New topic, old topic its always the same **** anyways.

#34 Willard Phule

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 10:17 AM

View Postdario03, on 17 June 2019 - 05:47 PM, said:


If you have acquired target then it can stay for as long as the target box is up, if not then it can drop with loss of LOS.


If you're basing your opinion on that of a human meat mech being able to predict movement of something out of LOS, but we're not. We're talking about something that's supposed to have a computer running multiple types of sensors and tying them into a fire control unit.....you know, a big, stompy robot.

This isn't counterstrike. Your ability to react is supposed to be limited to the reaction speed of the machine you're driving. You're supposed to be limited to the sensor capability of the machine you're driving. If you put "points" into upgrading your sensors, at the expense of not upgrading other things, you're supposed to be able to predict where the enemy is going.

#35 dario03

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 11:47 AM

View PostWillard Phule, on 14 July 2020 - 10:17 AM, said:


If you're basing your opinion on that of a human meat mech being able to predict movement of something out of LOS, but we're not. We're talking about something that's supposed to have a computer running multiple types of sensors and tying them into a fire control unit.....you know, a big, stompy robot.

This isn't counterstrike. Your ability to react is supposed to be limited to the reaction speed of the machine you're driving. You're supposed to be limited to the sensor capability of the machine you're driving. If you put "points" into upgrading your sensors, at the expense of not upgrading other things, you're supposed to be able to predict where the enemy is going.


Well depending on target decay and radar deprivation the target box can stay up for a while after LOS so that is already covered. Adding in a command wheel function that lets you follow the target isn't needed.

#36 V O L T R O N

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 07:58 PM

View PostMenas, on 12 June 2019 - 07:22 AM, said:

Hello forumites, I've been playing for years but don't post much. Recently though the spot target wall hack 'feature' has been beginning to bother me. A lot. Why when no mech on your team has line of sight do you get to see where an enemy mech is going for the next 10 seconds just because someone pressed a button on the keyboard? You don't even need to target a mech to activate it. Is space magic involved?

In my opinion it's a badly implemented feature that makes the game less fun and less challenging. Less fun when you're chasing other mechs and don't have to really think about how to find them because you can wall hack them. And less fun when you're on the other end trying to save your skin (or metal rear plating).

It also makes no logical sense whatsoever. (And yes I'm aware that this is a game of giant stompy futuristic lazor-firing dakka-spewing missile-launching war machines, so logical sense is relative...)

tl;dr version: Spot target wall hacks be damned, Sir!! Damned, I say!!! Grumble grumble...

I'll show myself out now...

we were talking about this the other day. I think if you have radar deprivation then that should help out with the targeting.

View Postdario03, on 14 July 2020 - 11:47 AM, said:


Well depending on target decay and radar deprivation the target box can stay up for a while after LOS so that is already covered. Adding in a command wheel function that lets you follow the target isn't needed.

If everyone spots targets you dont need target decay unless you have missles.

#37 Willard Phule

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 04:17 AM

View Postdario03, on 14 July 2020 - 11:47 AM, said:


Well depending on target decay and radar deprivation the target box can stay up for a while after LOS so that is already covered. Adding in a command wheel function that lets you follow the target isn't needed.


True, but it lights it up on your teammate's sensors and considering the disparity of both experience and situational awareness in this whole "tier" thing, anything that tells your teammates where the enemy was a few seconds ago is a bonus.

#38 dario03

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 04:58 AM

View PostV O L T R O N, on 14 July 2020 - 07:58 PM, said:

If everyone spots targets you dont need target decay unless you have missles.


The issue is with it tracking targets even after LOS and decay have been lost.

View PostWillard Phule, on 15 July 2020 - 04:17 AM, said:


True, but it lights it up on your teammate's sensors and considering the disparity of both experience and situational awareness in this whole "tier" thing, anything that tells your teammates where the enemy was a few seconds ago is a bonus.

If it only told you where they were a few seconds ago or while in LOS/sensors it would be fine. It still tracking the target after LOS and sensor loss is the issue.

#39 Willard Phule

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 05:06 AM

View Postdario03, on 15 July 2020 - 04:58 AM, said:


The issue is with it tracking targets even after LOS and decay have been lost.

If it only told you where they were a few seconds ago or while in LOS/sensors it would be fine. It still tracking the target after LOS and sensor loss is the issue.


Don't understand why it's an issue. If it's out of LOS, then it's only vulnerable to indirect fire.

OH....that's the problem. I get it now. Those that rely on indirect lurms are tired of being killed by others that rely on lurms. Gotcha.

Interestingly enough, those of us that have played for more than a week and a half have already figured out that ECM and AMS prevent damage from the elite, world class LRM turrets. Imagine that.

#40 Xiphias

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 05:27 AM

View PostWillard Phule, on 15 July 2020 - 05:06 AM, said:

Don't understand why it's an issue. If it's out of LOS, then it's only vulnerable to indirect fire.

Because tactical knowledge and positioning are important even if you aren't taking damage.

Take the case of a light harassing an assault at close range. There is a building that the light runs behind. The light can either run out from the left or change direction and run out from the right to try and get the jump on the assault mech. But wait, the assault uses target spotted and now knows exactly where the light is for several seconds, can see which side the light is coming from, and can set up to shoot them.

Scenario two: A ranged mech is trading against another one. He drops behind cover, but has been hit with target spotted (no way of knowing). When he peeks back out to trade the other side is already aimed and the spot and ready to fire, he eats a facefull of damage.

Scenario three: A light mech is being chased down by a fast medium. He uses the terrain to break line of sight and hides under a bridge to sneakily lose the medium and disengage. Unfortunately, thanks to target spotted the medium knows exact where the light was moving it is able to find and kill it.

Theses are a handful of examples, but there are many, many more that don't have anything to do with LRMs. Knowledge and information are important and giving it away with targeted spotted which is free and has absolutely no counter is the equivalent of a limited wall hack that has been implemented by PGI. It was enough of an advantage that they removed the entire command wheel from Solaris so that players couldn't use targeted spotted to track their opponents. Why would they do that if it wasn't able to give a big advantage.





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