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My Shadow Cat Buıld


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#1 Berkhan

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Posted 01 July 2019 - 09:13 PM

Just wanted to ask ıf my build is viable for the shadow cat? Its the P variant with 6 heavy machine guns in the left torso and left arm. An SRM 6 in the right torso. An SRM 6 and medium pulse laser in the right arm. Its a good ambush mech but let me know what you guys think.



https://mwo.smurfy-n...650b349e45afcdc

Edited by Berkhan, 01 July 2019 - 09:17 PM.


#2 CFC Conky

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Posted 01 July 2019 - 09:44 PM

Search ‘MWO shadow cat’ on YouTube and you should see some workable builds for the mech. Most of the SHCs I see are running around under ecm cover sniping with c-erppcs, but your build looks like it could be useful when protecting your assault mechs from enemy lights, or finishing off damaged enemies. The SHC is quite mobile, so try to use that to your advantage if you can.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

Edited by CFC Conky, 01 July 2019 - 09:46 PM.


#3 John McClintock

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 11:10 AM

High dps. Low heat. I can see it working good. I tend to avoid hmg in favor of better dps/ton mg or even lmg to match range with mpl. You dont have a lot of excess tonnage in a shadowcat. I would likely use 6mg, 2xssrm6 and a hml. Im on my phone and cant do builds right now. But it sounds about right. I love streaks to mess with lights.

#4 Tesunie

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 11:33 AM

View PostBerkhan, on 01 July 2019 - 09:13 PM, said:

Just wanted to ask ıf my build is viable for the shadow cat? Its the P variant with 6 heavy machine guns in the left torso and left arm. An SRM 6 in the right torso. An SRM 6 and medium pulse laser in the right arm. Its a good ambush mech but let me know what you guys think.
https://mwo.smurfy-n...650b349e45afcdc


I would do some of what this guy said for a bit:

View PostJohn McClintock, on 03 July 2019 - 11:10 AM, said:

High dps. Low heat. I can see it working good. I tend to avoid hmg in favor of better dps/ton mg or even lmg to match range with mpl. You dont have a lot of excess tonnage in a shadowcat. I would likely use 6mg, 2xssrm6 and a hml. Im on my phone and cant do builds right now. But it sounds about right. I love streaks to mess with lights.


Go with MGs for reduced tonnage (or even LMGs), however not for SSRMs (and I hope he's also considering an AP so ECM doesn't shut it down). See about taking the Artemis upgrade so your punch is more likely to hit a single location.

My second point would be to move your ammo around. You have ammo stashed everywhere. With Clan mechs, you come with free built in CASE, so place your ammo where your weapons are. You have SRM ammo in your MG arm, and MG ammo in your SRM arm. Consolidate some of that so it's closer to the appropriate weapons.

You also have a LOT of ammo on these at the moment (not that it's an issue). I'd remove some ammo to finish taking Artemis, and then also maximize armor. There is no reason not to be running max or near max armor on your mech. You where short on armor on the arms, legs and CT. The legs and CT are critical components people will aim for. The arms you might be able to get away with under armoring, but you've also got a lot of weapons in those arms...

My suggested fixes. (Edit: Might want to consider switching the .5 ton MG ammo for 1 ton, and 1 ton SRM ammo for .5 ton. Think that will match ammo consumption better.)
https://mwo.smurfy-n...c3def02aa5e833a

And if you are determined to have HMGs (as I wont tell you that you can't):
https://mwo.smurfy-n...1fbd8cf6fab0889

PS: I also removed the lower arm actuators so all your weapons will be better converged onto your target. It will help land more weapons where you want, especially with those MGs. (Though I can't blame you for wanting a nice looking hand to fill in a blank spot.) This is optional, as you could also just play with Arm Lock turned on and not care.

Edited by Tesunie, 03 July 2019 - 11:50 AM.


#5 John McClintock

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 03:04 PM

thanks for reminding me to put the C-AP in there. Almost Forgot. I dropped a ton of MG ammo just for the C-AP. Although I might drop a half ton of s-srm to add a half ton of MG. Anyways, here is what I ended up with. Haven't played it yet, but it looks like it could do pretty good.

keep the lower arm actuators, never know when you might need them to help hit a fast mover.

Posted Image

Edited by John McClintock, 03 July 2019 - 03:05 PM.


#6 Tesunie

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 03:20 PM

View PostJohn McClintock, on 03 July 2019 - 03:04 PM, said:

thanks for reminding me to put the C-AP in there. Almost Forgot. I dropped a ton of MG ammo just for the C-AP. Although I might drop a half ton of s-srm to add a half ton of MG. Anyways, here is what I ended up with. Haven't played it yet, but it looks like it could do pretty good.

keep the lower arm actuators, never know when you might need them to help hit a fast mover.

(Image removed due to space)


Although I will not tell you what specifically to use with your build, I do believe that SSRMs are not only less tonnage efficient (considering the additional AP tat is needed), but also not of much assistance when considering the nature of the build's intent.

The problem with SSRMs is that they spread their damage all over a mech. MGs want to get to juicy tender bits without armor. For this build, you are taking missiles and other weapons to help punch through armor so the MGs can do their nasty work. As SSRMs spread damage so much, it will be harder to stripe through armor on anything tougher than a light mech for those MGs. This leaves you with a bit of a conflict in roles and not generally helpful to such a specialized builds as the Shadowcat would require.

The other problem with SSRMs on the build is the lack of amount of them. Two missile slots is not enough to overcome the typical weaknesses of SSRMs (spread damage), which means you are even less threatening to even light mechs. If you really want to use SSRMs, Arcticwolves, Stormcrows or even a Huntsmen (etc) would be far better in that light killer dedicated role. They can all place 4+ missiles on, which becomes a threat to lights and even some mediums.


As for that lower arm actuator (once more with a note of "I'm not saying you can't do it) is that you will spread your damage even more. Though the SSRMs wont care, and the ML is on the arm so it wouldn't care, your MGs would be split up between your arm and torso, meaning your MGs, which need to remain on target as long as possible, will become split up as you attempt to track a target. The Shadowcat should also be nimble enough to keep a target tracked with it's torso.

Now, say you had taken only three MGs on that arm and had the ECM torso or even a different torso with additional missile hardpoints (more SSRMs) or even no weapons, having that lower arm actuator would become more helpful. This is, of course, with exception to if you toggle your arm lock on/off as the situation requires. Still, 3 MGs on a light target might not be effective due to how little duration you'd keep on target... then again sometimes every bit of damage can count.


I'll repeat, just because I can, I do not wish to say what you can or can't bring nor due. That's for you to decide. I'm just saying why another way may be easier or something to consider.

#7 John McClintock

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 03:31 PM

Not only are you correct about the problems with clan S-SRMS, but you left out, low dps compared to IS ssrms.

But dps per ton, they aren't too bad.

You missed that I made it a heavy LARGE laser. Posted Image

Still, toggle that arm lock as needed and MG is fine.

I'm still learning how to use it.

Not used to such a "different" build. I always have my MG linked to right button, and this is making me use my left side for MG and right for laser. I have the same problem with a a few builds. Wish I could mirror the UI or something. It's gonna take several more matches to get the hang of it. This was my third match and it still feels awkward because the buttons are backwards.

Posted Image

Posted Image

#8 Tesunie

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 03:59 PM

View PostJohn McClintock, on 03 July 2019 - 03:31 PM, said:

Not only are you correct about the problems with clan S-SRMS, but you left out, low dps compared to IS ssrms.

But dps per ton, they aren't too bad.

You missed that I made it a heavy LARGE laser. Posted Image

Still, toggle that arm lock as needed and MG is fine.

I'm still learning how to use it.

Not used to such a "different" build. I always have my MG linked to right button, and this is making me use my left side for MG and right for laser. I have the same problem with a a few builds. Wish I could mirror the UI or something. It's gonna take several more matches to get the hang of it. This was my third match and it still feels awkward because the buttons are backwards.



I actually did notice it was a HLL (right after I made my post). That can be considerable firepower in that arm. The longer duration helps with the MGs, but the long recharge times kinda can be a problem. Especially in the scuffle most MGs find themselves in. I personally just changed my Shadowcat to a similar build as I suggested above, but haven't played it yet. I feel the MPL may be better in a brawl because it reloads faster with shorter duration.

If you are using arm lock as a toggle (I don't have enough keys near my figures to do that in game, plus I learned how to play before arm lock was even a thing, so I'm use to not having it), then a lower arm actuator doesn't hurt you at all.

On remark to weapon groups, you can always just flip them around to what buttons you are most comfortable with. I normally set it up so right arm is right mouse etc, but I have a few builds I've switched it around because it felt strange otherwise and I was constantly shooting the wrong weapon.


I just feel that SRMs would serve the build better overall than SSRMs would. As stated before, I'm not going to tell someone they can't do something. I'll only advise what I feel may be better options. If the SSRMs are working for you and you like their performance, then by all means keep with them. I will warn that; much like LRMs, MRMs and (to some extent) ATMs; SSRMs tend to get higher damage scores due to spread, and though all damage is good, some damage is more valuable than others depending upon where it lands. Keep that in mind when evaluating your build.

#9 John McClintock

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 04:19 PM

View PostTesunie, on 03 July 2019 - 03:59 PM, said:


I actually did notice it was a HLL (right after I made my post). That can be considerable firepower in that arm. The longer duration helps with the MGs, but the long recharge times kinda can be a problem. Especially in the scuffle most MGs find themselves in. I personally just changed my Shadowcat to a similar build as I suggested above, but haven't played it yet. I feel the MPL may be better in a brawl because it reloads faster with shorter duration.

If you are using arm lock as a toggle (I don't have enough keys near my figures to do that in game, plus I learned how to play before arm lock was even a thing, so I'm use to not having it), then a lower arm actuator doesn't hurt you at all.

On remark to weapon groups, you can always just flip them around to what buttons you are most comfortable with. I normally set it up so right arm is right mouse etc, but I have a few builds I've switched it around because it felt strange otherwise and I was constantly shooting the wrong weapon.


I just feel that SRMs would serve the build better overall than SSRMs would. As stated before, I'm not going to tell someone they can't do something. I'll only advise what I feel may be better options. If the SSRMs are working for you and you like their performance, then by all means keep with them. I will warn that; much like LRMs, MRMs and (to some extent) ATMs; SSRMs tend to get higher damage scores due to spread, and though all damage is good, some damage is more valuable than others depending upon where it lands. Keep that in mind when evaluating your build.


Now you are triggering my ptsd AND ocd... gratz.

putting weapons on the opposite side of the mouse button?

I'm already dyslexic.

You want to give me a stroke too?

Seriously.

You don't even want to see my keyboard layout. I dripped hot glue on my C key to make a raised button so I can hit masc WHILE using jump jets. I used to switch UI buttons (spacebar) until I discovered my beloved shadowcat had jj AND masc.

Talk about a trip.

I like streaks, and they get me a lot of kills, solo kills too. If you test them, frequently more than one missile will go to one component. If it does it to a red ct or xl st, you get a kill. easy peasy. Streaks keep lights in check too.

Bonus.

almost, about to get the hang of this thing.

Check it out, 2 kills, a kmd, and a solo with only, how much damage?

129

Does the solo count as a kmd? IDK

I stopped to take a screen shot and got wacked, just so I could show off my 11% 10% health.

Fail. Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

Edited by John McClintock, 03 July 2019 - 04:21 PM.


#10 John McClintock

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 04:26 PM

I use L control for arm lock toggle.

L shift = zoom toggle (used constantly)

caps lock = talk.

L alt = target.

e = max zoom (hardly used anymore)

It gets weird from there.

ECM = R control

weapon door = \

right shift = stealth.

my stuff is all weird.

used to play all keyboard in mw2 days, (and descent) and get away with it.

I have to take my hand off my mouse to hit half my buttons.

totally worth it.

I love how world of warcraft has effected keyboard layout.

Edited by John McClintock, 03 July 2019 - 04:28 PM.


#11 Tesunie

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 05:15 PM

View PostJohn McClintock, on 03 July 2019 - 04:19 PM, said:

Check it out, 2 kills, a kmd, and a solo with only, how much damage?

129

Does the solo count as a kmd? IDK


SSRMs are more likely to get KMDDs compared to other weapons at least, because of the high amounts of damage that can be achieved (when used solitary) before the target finally dies. KMDD only cares that you have dealt the most damage to said target. However, that spread, as you mentioned, can have it's advantages. Its a similar aspect with LRMs and MRMs. It does not invalidate those options, it's just a statement of fact.

Kills only depend upon landing that final point of damage, so it's actually possible to get a kill and yet only deal a single (or even less) point of damage to a target.

Solo kills are when you've landed that last killing blow (got the kill) and dealt the most damage to said target (KMDD). When you've earned a solo kill, you'll also get a KMDD reward as well.

Mostly just FYI stuff.

#12 John McClintock

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Posted 03 July 2019 - 06:34 PM

View PostTesunie, on 03 July 2019 - 05:15 PM, said:


SSRMs are more likely to get KMDDs compared to other weapons at least, because of the high amounts of damage that can be achieved (when used solitary) before the target finally dies. KMDD only cares that you have dealt the most damage to said target. However, that spread, as you mentioned, can have it's advantages. Its a similar aspect with LRMs and MRMs. It does not invalidate those options, it's just a statement of fact.

Kills only depend upon landing that final point of damage, so it's actually possible to get a kill and yet only deal a single (or even less) point of damage to a target.

Solo kills are when you've landed that last killing blow (got the kill) and dealt the most damage to said target (KMDD). When you've earned a solo kill, you'll also get a KMDD reward as well.

Mostly just FYI stuff.


Wow, man.

Thanks for explaining that.

Starts to make sense now.

Math, how does it work?

Without known variables,

It don't make know since. Posted Image

#13 panzer1b

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Posted 16 November 2019 - 03:04 PM

If you wanna run MG shadowcat, try 2ERLL/HLL+6LMG. It gives you the MG crits without forcing you to commit to point blank range, and your lasers are still viable enough on their own. Its vulnurable to fast movers that can spread your laser burns, but it evicerates anything you manage to get behind and has enough range to be useful early game too.





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