83 replies to this topic

[Thorqemada]

Override is a weak Gameplay mechanic to me.

It is for People to lazy to hit "Override Shutdown" when the shutdown countdown blares it warnings while still noticing the Pilot of overheating issues.

It should be an All or Nothing mechanic:
Disable the Overheat Shutdown but at the expense of no longer receive any overheat warnings - take full responsibility for your decisions and now monitor your heat yourself with the biggest care or cook yourself into oblivion !!!

[HammerMaster]

Blames "mechdads" for lore implementation.
Sounds like bigoted against "mechdads"
Poor idea. Poor attitude.
BTW you're supposed to be slapping that override Everytime.

Edited by HammerMaster, 21 July 2019 - 07:35 AM.

[Jman5]

I'm all for giving people an option to have override on by default and to remove the warning on the HUD. That said, when I watch over-riders on Twitch, the amount of casual and completely unnecessary damage I see many of them taking from override is pretty wild. These are good players too.

[Ssamout]

Its QoL thing for longtime 'over-riders' so forget about it. Why would anyone make features that help retain players?

Thorqemada, on 21 July 2019 - 07:22 AM, said:

It should be an All or Nothing mechanic:
Disable the Overheat Shutdown but at the expense of no longer receive any overheat warnings - take full responsibility for your decisions and now monitor your heat yourself with the biggest care or cook yourself into oblivion !!!

Sounds good. That hissing sound when your heatsinks are melting is sufficent indication that its time to cool down.

Jman5, on 21 July 2019 - 09:17 AM, said:

That said, when I watch over-riders on Twitch, the amount of casual and completely unnecessary damage I see many of them taking from override is pretty wild. These are good players too.

And its probably intentional. In most matches its perfectly ok to take some heat damage. Especially in FP.

[Jman5]

Ssamout, on 21 July 2019 - 09:52 AM, said:

And its probably intentional. In most matches its perfectly ok to take some heat damage. Especially in FP.

Sometimes, you're right. Like when they're on one of those auto-win group queue teams and it's basically just a damage race. It's ok to take damage because you're going to 12-2 them anyway. Or if you're in a hopeless situation and you want to go down swinging. I'm not really talking about those situations. I can also see certain unique situations in faction play where it would make sense.

However a lot more times it's the wrong thing to do no matter how you look at it. It's either an accident or they are just underestimating just how many hitpoints they are throwing in the trash for relatively little gain.

I don't think people realize how much damage they are doing to their internals. It's hard to quantify in real time so you have to carefully watch a recording in slow-mo. You do 7% damage to yourself from overheat and that's about 1/5 of your total structure health. In an assault mech that's 60-80 hitpoints. At that point you're almost certainly doing more damage to yourself than to your opponent even if he didn't touch you.

Now granted, if you're an assault and it ticks mostly in your legs it's probably no big deal, but that's only a 2/7 chance. if your arms are completely useless than that barely puts you over the 50% it misses a critical torso. If you have arm weapons it's extremely likely you will damage an important component.


Again though, I'm in favor of adding these options into the game. It's your mechs after all, not mine!

Edited by Jman5, 21 July 2019 - 11:41 AM.

[Gagis]

Please. Forgetting to override is my #1 cause of death in MWO. Its far more dangerous than the enemy team.

[Ssamout]

Jman5, on 21 July 2019 - 10:45 AM, said:

However a lot more times it's the wrong thing to do no matter how you look at it. It's either an accident or they are just underestimating just how many hitpoints they are throwing in the trash for relatively little gain.

I don't think people realize how much damage they are doing to their internals. It's hard to quantify in real time so you have to carefully watch a recording in slow-mo. You do 7% damage to yourself from overheat and that's about 1/5 of your total structure health. In an assault mech that's 60-80 hitpoints. At that point you're almost certainly doing more damage to yourself than to your opponent even if he didn't touch you.

Now granted, if you're an assault and it ticks mostly in your legs it's probably no big deal, but that's only a 2/7 chance. if your arms are completely useless than that barely puts you over the 50% it misses a critical non-torso. If you have arm weapons it's extremely likely you will damage an important component.

For me it changes a lot depending on situation and how important that match is. If its a tight match I try to ride that fine line between internal damage and 100% heat cap. Almost in any other situation if armor looks good, its time to throw dice on damage location. One splash of heat damage isnt really that bad unless you got gauss in there..

Also I like to have control over my mech and powerdown when its appropriate and not in front of a firing squad. Its like windows updates. Who wants them to be automatic and stop you from working when the updater decides its time to install, or do you want to have control when to do it.

Its reasonable to have it setup like this for newer players but I know a lot of people who have asked for this to be in settings for years.

[Jman5]

Ssamout, on 21 July 2019 - 11:32 AM, said:

For me it changes a lot depending on situation and how important that match is. If its a tight match I try to ride that fine line between internal damage and 100% heat cap. Almost in any other situation if armor looks good, its time to throw dice on damage location. One splash of heat damage isnt really that bad unless you got gauss in there..

Also I like to have control over my mech and powerdown when its appropriate and not in front of a firing squad. Its like windows updates. Who wants them to be automatic and stop you from working when the updater decides its time to install, or do you want to have control when to do it.

Its reasonable to have it setup like this for newer players but I know a lot of people who have asked for this to be in settings for years.

Yeah, you might do it fine, I don't know. I've seen some players manage override smartly. I just see more players than not screw themselves with it and it's very easy to miss or underestimate.

Quote

Its like windows updates. Who wants them to be automatic and stop you from working when the updater decides its time to install, or do you want to have control when to do it.

Well if missing the update eventually caused my computer to explode, I'd probably just leave it on automatic!

[Ssamout]

Jman5, on 21 July 2019 - 11:51 AM, said:

Well if missing the update eventually caused my computer to explode, I'd probably just leave it on automatic!

Yeah, I hear ya. Though I might be more inclined to go linux at that point. Damn microsoft and its fusion exploders.

[Void Angel]

Jman5, on 21 July 2019 - 11:51 AM, said:

Yeah, you might do it fine, I don't know. I've seen some players manage override smartly. I just see more players than not screw themselves with it and it's very easy to miss or underestimate.

Unless they fixed it and I forgot, the override damage has a small chance to headshot you, too. =) But memory is tickling me that it might have been changed...

[Mystere]

BackShot, on 20 July 2019 - 02:19 PM, said:

and also remoove this HUGE override missile warning or make it smaller in a corner

FTFY.

Feral Clown, on 21 July 2019 - 12:13 AM, said:

Cause PGI felt if they were going to aim for, you could at least hold a button. The lurm community was having none of this though and quickly found away around it so they could run around the entire match making sure the enemy could see them and knew what weapons they had.

JediPanther, on 21 July 2019 - 06:35 AM, said:

I find it funny when I see some one with the tag set up that way. To me it's just waving an here-i-am-shoot-me sign. None of my lrm boats use it. None of my lights use it. My sniper builds do because my hard ware is old and what I think I see isn't always what the server sees. Also mgs 1's socom laser sight gave me a bad habit. Uavs I throw out like joker's parade in the 89 movie. So much c-bills spent on auto-fill uavs.

TAG should be invisible to the naked eye. <shrugs>

Edited by Mystere, 21 July 2019 - 01:18 PM.

[Alcom Isst]

Dakkalistic, on 20 July 2019 - 02:26 PM, said:

Sounds immersion-breaking to me. Are there any lore examples of mechs having an auto-override function? Does this really improve the new player experience? It is what it is, I doubt they'll be able to fit this into their already stacked roadmap, but never say never, right?

Immersion of what? What sort of experience are you trying to have that having an option to auto-override would disrupt? Does it significantly disrupt your immersion? Does other players using this option disrupt your immersion?

It would be good for players in general, being able to automate a crucial first step that many forget simply because of the human limits of one's attention span.

Thorqemada, on 21 July 2019 - 07:22 AM, said:

It is for People to lazy to hit "Override Shutdown" when the shutdown countdown blares it warnings while still noticing the Pilot of overheating issues.
It should be an All or Nothing mechanic:
Disable the Overheat Shutdown but at the expense of no longer receive any overheat warnings - take full responsibility for your decisions and now monitor your heat yourself with the biggest care or cook yourself into oblivion !!!

Lazy is a poor word for it. There's nothing arduous about pressing O, simply sometimes there's a passing butterfly when the match starts and you get distracted and forget to press the game's most important button.

Sounds pointlessly unfriendly, you're making a worse UI by removing the warnings.

HammerMaster, on 21 July 2019 - 07:32 AM, said:

Blames "mechdads" for lore implementation.
Sounds like bigoted against "mechdads"
Poor idea. Poor attitude.
BTW you're supposed to be slapping that override Everytime.

I feel the divide between the immersion-focused "mechdad" and the gameplay-oriented player should be poked every once in a while. I'm learning a lot from reading the replies.

What would be cool is if you didn't have to smash the button everytime, automate that step so you don't have to remember.

Edited by Alcom Isst, 21 July 2019 - 03:34 PM.

[Nightbird]

I trained a neuro net to automatically press override

[Jman5]

Nightbird, on 21 July 2019 - 03:45 PM, said:

I trained a neuro net to automatically press override

[Xmith]

Hazeclaw, on 20 July 2019 - 03:40 PM, said:

shutting down in front of anyone who knows what they're doing is a 100% death sentence, that's how people farm headshots

menu toggle for override should have been a feature from day one, but at this point pgi isn't gonna do anything

I have no idea what that would be like. Firing weapons with red mechs in front of me until I shutdown from overheating is something I would never do. Mainly because I rarely overheat. So, building a mech with minimal chance to overheat with sustained fire is the way to go.

[Prototelis]

HammerMaster, on 21 July 2019 - 07:32 AM, said:

Blames "mechdads" for lore implementation.

Board game implementation

Quote

BTW you're supposed to be slapping that override Everytime.

Another case where board game rules are bad for an action game.

[50 50]

Oh come on guys, you can make up better BS than that.

"The specifications for the SLDF Neural Link Interface (NL) v7.9.4 OS (standard OS for the mech and pilot interface since 2442) excluded an option allowing for techs to change the default override setting. This was following several very costly and fatal accidents during subsequent combat testing and deployment of the Mackie after it's introduction in 2439 where blackbox recordings and maintenance logs showed that the override setting had been changed resulting in over-eager inexperienced pilots cooking themselves and their mechs.
With mech development spreading to other regions of the InnerSphere and the great houses developing their own NLIOS, each house came to the same conclusion and excluded the option to change the default override setting with the notable exception of the NLIOS in certain Draconis Combine units which contained a 'Kamikaze Protocol' that could be activated via an encryption key and contained a number of other features.
Change of the override setting therefore rested in the sole hands of mechwarrior and was only included in advance heat management training such as the Federated Suns NAIS College of Military Science extracurricular course 'Adv Heat Management (EAA20113)' or the Sun Zhang Mechwarrior Academy 'Heat as Resource' (RM-H-14002) course.
Changes to this setting is recorded in the blackbox of the mechs and the information has commonly been used in reviews by a mechwarrior's peers for disciplinary action, unit training regimes or as part of a bloopers reel."

[Mister Maf]

>OP suggests reasonable optional quality of life change for a video game to reduce hassle for players who use override as a rule
>Some monkeys claim it's bad because it violates lore, somehow

????????

If it's really that big of a deal to you, have the setting represent the mech pilot pressing the button. It's not that hard guy!! It's real easy fam!! There's no reason not to!! If you don't want to use it then don't!!

[Funky Bacon]

Sometimes I even undo override when mech gets hot cause I forgot I already activated it. ._.
And because red blinky warnings are pretty much always there during combat they are automatically filtered out by my brain and ignored as they would be really distracting otherwise.

[Feral Clown]

Mystere, on 21 July 2019 - 01:07 PM, said:

FTFY.

[/size]

[left]TAG should be invisible to the naked eye. <shrugs>

No role play harder. My mechs are equipped with high tech coating on cockpit glass that allows me to see infrared while also making water bead so that wipers are unnecessary.

It's call infrared-x.

That you think they should remove incoming missile warning is silly.