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I Hope That A Big Patch Is Coming . . .


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#1 RoiEt

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Posted 29 December 2019 - 01:02 PM

Two stories, from back to back missions:

Early in the game, I'm doing the mission where you have to kill the captain of the enemy merc unit, and supposedly once he's dead, the rest of the company won't have any stake in it and back off. So, after several restarts (I hate losing components early in the game) I work my way around, batter my way through the storm of tanks and helicopters, whack the guy, and then of course they drop a couple of mechs on my head. Not a big problem, but what happened to the storyline?

Next mission, I'm doing one of those randomly created destroy missions, trying to take out a base on some hellhole of a planet - so uninhabitable that it's covered in belching fumaroles.

Uninhabitable, of course, other than the regiment of tanks and the other regiment of helicopters. That appear from nowhere. Because that's how it works with tanks and helicopters.

I can't see them of course, because they appear about three feet behind me and my marvelous 31st Century radar and display can't show anything behind me. Technology certainly has degraded . . .

But it wouldn't matter anyway if they were dropped 800 meters in front of me, because the same marvelous radar loses lock when we have a tiny hill between us.

Side note: I was both a tanker and an air-defense radar operator in the Marines, and I can assure you that the ancient crap we used to use is more advanced than what's in my Mech. Also, do you know how much it takes to maintain even a company of tanks? You need a lot of support, and your average bandit or merc company isn't likely to have that sort of cash and resources just lying around. Let alone the manpower needed. But I digress.

No, what eats my lunch is the two Urbanmechs (!?!?) armed with AC-10s that get dropped behind me, inevitably blowing arms off my starter Centurion.

I try and try, using tactics just like Battletech taught me, going around the long way (swatting a couple of helicopters and tanks on the way), attacking the objective from far outside in order to draw out defenders, but it never matters. Inevitably, something gets dropped right behind me and I start losing components.

Why do I even have long-range weapons when the spawns happen too close to make them useful? On the plus side, I've saved a lot of LRM ammo.

Now, I suppose that I should "git gud, n00b." Which is fair, although I'm getting a whole lot better at hitting a gunship with an AC-10 from range.

But I think that the developers missed what makes Mechwarrior different from a fast-twitch shooter. It should be obvious - the slow, lumbering walk of a Mech is totally different than speedrunning around a map with an assault rifle.

The tactics for a Mech game are completely different. There's more time to consider your actions when piloting a mech, and the game should allow us to do it.

So, my unwanted recommendations:

Get rid of the spawns. Completely. If it's not on the map at the beginning of the game, then then it doesn't come in. Or in the alternate, have limited and specific reinforcements that come in from a distance. So you can see them coming, which you should be able to do, with any sort of radar.

Sid Meier said that when developing, he "emphasizes the fun parts" of a simulation and throws out the rest.” The autospawns, right on top of us, are not fun.


This also actually allows us to use tactics - circling around the base, picking off the defense turrets, looking for outlying sentries, etc.

Next, improve the radar. You can't tell me that a Mech can't use radar to see behind itself and over hills - at least well enough to know that someone is there. Four previous Mechwarrior games and Battletech certainly did it. My Mech should be able to see anything metal moving within at least 800 meters, unless it is powered down.

Third, nerf the tanks and helicopters. We all came for Mech vs. Mech combat, not getting pecked to death by a literal division of tanks. Tanks and helicopters are part of the power fantasy, shrugging off their attacks like flea bites and destroying them almost without thought. They should never be a major challenge. I know that this differs a bit from the tabletop rules, but this sort of adaptation preserves the fun.

Lastly, the AI of both the companions and the enemy needs to be improved. I'm sure you are working on this. It would also help alleviate any need for autospawns.

Does this make the game easier? Sure, but you can implement difficulty levels, allow us to choose the autospawns, the strength of the tanks and helicopters, the number of enemy mechs we might see, etc.

I suppose that another way to put all of this is "make it more like the previous Mechwarriors." After all, they all had everything that I've just discussed.

Anyway, other than restarting the same mision over and over and over, it's a fun game and I enjoy stomping around in my Mech. But not enough to overcome the frustration.

Looking forward to the patches.

Edited by RoiEt, 29 December 2019 - 03:32 PM.


#2 FRAGTAST1C

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Posted 29 December 2019 - 07:40 PM

It helps to have different lances for different types of missions.

It basically boils down to two missions types where one you need long-ranged weapons and the other you need weapons that burst out a lot of damage.

Early on, I suggest going with Centurion, Blackjack and a Jagermech with the last slot filled by a light mech. Even a locust is fine. The loadouts should include weapons that can kill enemies at 400+m away. I'm talking AC2s, AC10s, LRMs. Obviously, the Locust will have MLs and machine guns and will not attract a lot of aggro, so it'll be relatively safe. You can use this lance for Raid, Assassination and Demolition missions.

Early on, you won't have the luxury of getting good mechs but I suggest keeping an eye out for the Quickdraw with MLs and SRM 4+6s. It can run at 81kph and is a good brawler. It works even better when you put DHS in it. This is good for missions like Defense and Warzone 'cause the enemies come straight at you from a short way out and on Defense missions especially, you can use the base as additional armour.

As for spawns, only a couple of missions like Demolition and Raid have unlimited spawns. The rest have 3-4 waves of enemies at regular intervals and the rest spawn near the base or around your vicinity. Apparently, the spawn points were worked on and it is better than before but still needs more tweaks.

#3 RoiEt

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 07:00 AM

Great advice; thank you. Demolition was probably a bad mission to start on with my Centurion, Jenner, and Javelin.

#4 AurioDK

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 08:40 AM

View PostRoiEt, on 30 December 2019 - 07:00 AM, said:

Great advice; thank you. Demolition was probably a bad mission to start on with my Centurion, Jenner, and Javelin.


I just restarted and for some reason non story missions seem to be a lot easier, not sure if I just got better with time or the AI has less or more suited spawns.

1. Demolition jobs: Take only payout for insurance and job, do not choose salvage. Destry as quickly as possible only targeting vehicles of opportunity, do not engage the enemy mechs. Just get out as soon as destruction is over, it´s fairly easy once you get the hang of this.

2. Warzones: Max Salvage and some insurance, get out once the last needed mech/vehicle is destroyed. Losing arms and their respective weapons cost a ton more than the meager rewards for killing extra stuff.

3. Raid: Salvage, payout and insurance. I use F1/F3 3-4 times on each mission. I place my lance mates in relative safety (behind something) while backing into them after luring each sites defense, that has done me well and havn´t had a lot of problems with raids since I started with that tactic, you need at least one LRM for this.

4. Defense. I have stopped thinking about not destroying the friendly base myself and havn´t failed one completely. I just target and destroy, no real tactics here. My lance mates are too blind to understand friendly buildings and will wreck them regardless of what I do. As for mission payouts I always go for max salvage and a bit of the two others.

5. Multi contract: Nope, I don´t do them since you need at least two lances and there are constantly plenty of other contracts around. Too expensive to keep that many mechs on active duty.

#5 Peter2k

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 08:44 AM

To be honest, for tanks and Heli, should be on the map as is and not reinvorce at all, or not beyond a first wave
I'm not sure how other fellow players see it, but swatting dozens of small targets is not really fun and since killing them in the thousands will get me nothing as reward either, ehh

I'd rather have more mech reinvorcements through drop ship, a good distance away


Btw the radar is quite in lore, can't see stuff behind you in MWO
That said, to be honest not being too close to lore would be nicer here in MW5 and just give a 360° one, or certain mech equipment or a skill
On the other hand, if the spawns where better and I wouldn't be busy hitting 30 small targets in front off me while trying to find out if the blip is in the sky or on the ground I would certainly have better awareness of what is going on in my surroundings

#6 RoiEt

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 11:30 AM

I've got the Battlemech Manual right beside me, and I'm not going to disagree with you about the lore. For that matter, the strength of the tanks and helicopters is fairly accurate as well. Battletech (the pc game) handles this reasonably well; while there are 80-ton tanks that will core you with their twin AC20s, you can see them coming from far enough to have options.

But not everything in a tabletop game translates well to an action PC game, and I'm 100% in agreement with you.

#7 xX_Nero_Xx

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 12:20 PM

blew threw everything on the game with ease,ppc and small lasers. later on in the game made , I had tag and / or narc on Ai mech.I ran a stalker with 2 lrm 15 +arty and 2 lrm 10 with arty and 3300 rounds 4 small lasers make sure you chain fire the lrms. I just obliterated everything before they could reach me.





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