81 replies to this topic

[MisterSomaru]

Please stay out of faction until you've gained a proper roster of mechs for the two major ranges in faction, mid, and long.
And, take the time to learn the maps, and take the time to learn to twist, shoot, and kill. As is, you won't have a good time there amongst those that can instantly nuke your mech, nor will your own team appreciate a 25+ minute long sandbag along for the ride.
This is just to alleviate problems on both sides of the spectrum. Spend time in quick play until you are ready. There's even a warning as soon as you go to the faction screen.

[_Magno_]

Our unit now has 9 members and we're staying away from faction play for the most part, but after putting in collective 300-400 games of QP inbetween FP, we like to try out FP but we're still learning what to do in FP and we see that there are strategies and such that you just can't trial in QP.

There is significant coordination that takes place that we still need to learn and we can't trail that in QP.

MrSomaru, on 04 January 2020 - 12:13 AM, said:

Please stay out of faction until you've gained a proper roster of mechs for the two major ranges in faction, mid, and long.

This is just to alleviate problems on both sides of the spectrum. Spend time in quick play until you are ready. There's even a warning as soon as you go to the faction screen.

Will you provide further criteria for folks to self-determine.

What are the bands for mid and long range? 150-400m for mid. 400-1000 for long?
"Proper roster?" Meaning all 4 mechs are for mid and another all for long range?

"until you are ready"
Please provide more detail and explanation if you would. We have unit members who insist they are ready, and we know they are not.
We have unit members, like myself, who know we are not good caliber in FP, but feel compelled to test out our growth after putting in a good 50-60 inbetween FPs, lots of time in training gournds, etc.

Most of have 2 or 3 drop different drop decks of 91 skill pointed mech built-up with cooperation in mind.
I.e., "I'll bring a LRM deck, you bring the ERLaser Deck, and you bring the Guass deck."
"This map, how about you bring the ECMed mid ranged deck and I'll bring the RAC supression deck."

That's the level we 're at, but its less about our ability to target, torso twist, read the mini map, call targets and open components, etc..

Where we are at is, learning the faction play specific strategies outside of Siege missions. An assault mission on Crimson Straights takes on a very different strategy than in Quick play and there isn't a lot of resources online to understand what that is.

Edited by _Magno_, 04 January 2020 - 05:00 AM.

[Vxheous]

400-600m is mid range. Usual types of builds are laser vomit, gauss vomit, dakka builds (UAC5s + 10s), MRMs to an extent, RACs to an extent.

900-1110m is long range. Usual types of builds are ERLL, CERLL, ERPPCs, CEPPCs, mass AC2 spam.

Brawl (MPLs and SRM pushes) "can" work, but you literally need all 12 players to NSR into the enemy team together, or you'll string out and get focused down.

Edited by Vxheous, 04 January 2020 - 04:58 AM.

[Ssamout]

_Magno_, on 04 January 2020 - 04:52 AM, said:

Please provide more detail and explanation if you would. We have unit members who insist they are ready, and we know they are not.

One way to gauge how you are doing in fp is to look at damage scores after the match.

On a win, you side has roughly 14,5k damage to split between you all. That averages to about 1200dmg / player. If one doesnt do 1k damage in a fp, it means someone has done a bit of carrying for you. Sure if you have good fp players on your side in a drop, they will gulp most of the potatoes and do average of 2-3k damage, even a lot more. So if you see like 2 players on your side doing 3k, rest of you prob do about 800dmg avg, and thats ok, there are some monsters out there.
Doing less than 400dmg means you are always carried, and you die too fast. 400dmg = 100dmg/mech = 2 shots / mech.

Damage numbers might differ if lrms/ssrms/mrms/farming happens, that ~14,5k is thought as direct fire dmg. But in anycase, aim for 1k+ damage and you have done your part.

[Ignatius Audene]

If u score 500 dmg in a regular qp (Non lrm streak, atm) i would give fp a try. Better though try do get in touch with other teams to pick u up. That can save u lot if time buying mechs that u will never need afterwards and get your hands on proper load outs for the map. U might also learn the basic strategies like gathering points, dont reinforce etc.

Edited by Ignatius Audene, 04 January 2020 - 01:07 PM.

[thievingmagpi]

to unpack a bit; FP is endgame content. Late game raids. Boss fights.

bring you best mechs, bring your A game, be prepared to pay attention and learn. FP isn't a place for cadets, it's not a place for trial mechs, it's not a place for clown tier bracket builds and bUt Im HaViNg FuN. You will die, you will get farmed, you will cost other players a match.

Most of the frustration that is generated is because people bring trial mechs, play terribly and don't learn. There's a high probability that your strats are wrong and bad. For now the only strat you have to worry about is delivering damage and lots of it.

Bring the maximum tonnage you can bring. No one needs your first wave narc raven. No one wants your "lrm support". Shoot the enemy.

None of that is intended to be negative. You can never be too ready for for FP- but you certainly need to be prepared before dropping in. If you're genuinely concerned with doing well and not catching the ire of better players, you need to pay attention to your positioning and mech loadouts from game to game. Why you died, what killed you, and who/what were doing well.

[MisterSomaru]

_Magno_, on 04 January 2020 - 04:52 AM, said:

Our unit now has 9 members and we're staying away from faction play for the most part, but after putting in collective 300-400 games of QP inbetween FP, we like to try out FP but we're still learning what to do in FP and we see that there are strategies and such that you just can't trial in QP.

There is significant coordination that takes place that we still need to learn and we can't trail that in QP.



Will you provide further criteria for folks to self-determine.

What are the bands for mid and long range? 150-400m for mid. 400-1000 for long?
"Proper roster?" Meaning all 4 mechs are for mid and another all for long range?

"until you are ready"
Please provide more detail and explanation if you would. We have unit members who insist they are ready, and we know they are not.
We have unit members, like myself, who know we are not good caliber in FP, but feel compelled to test out our growth after putting in a good 50-60 inbetween FPs, lots of time in training gournds, etc.

Most of have 2 or 3 drop different drop decks of 91 skill pointed mech built-up with cooperation in mind.
I.e., "I'll bring a LRM deck, you bring the ERLaser Deck, and you bring the Guass deck."
"This map, how about you bring the ECMed mid ranged deck and I'll bring the RAC supression deck."

That's the level we 're at, but its less about our ability to target, torso twist, read the mini map, call targets and open components, etc..

Where we are at is, learning the faction play specific strategies outside of Siege missions. An assault mission on Crimson Straights takes on a very different strategy than in Quick play and there isn't a lot of resources online to understand what that is.

Mid range on IS usually involves a combination of uac5s and uac10s on assaults, uac5s on heavies, occasional uac10, LL+ERML combos, Gauss and erml, and then for lights/meds, the mpl wlfhound, 7 ML Javelin, MPL Vulcan, SRM assassin, srm commando, spl flea.
Long range on IS side usually involves ERLL BLR-1G, ERLL Anni 1P, ERLL on any mech that can boat up to 5 ERLL, really for assaults and heavies. Additionally, ac2 boating for heavies and assaults. Lights and meds anything that can fit erppcs with suitable quirks and/or mounts, really.

Clan mid range also consists of big fucc dakka, uac5/uac10 spam. Blood Asp or MCII-B. anything that fits within that range with synergizing weapons, like gauss vomit which is gauss and combination of LPL, ERLL, HLL, or ERML. The lighter mechs should usually consist of erml or srm bombing, maybe big fucc weapons if the mech can fit it. And the Piranha 1,2, or 3.
Long range clan will be ERLL Basp, ERPPC warhawk, ac2 boating on anything that can boat a significant number of ac2s (6 or more). Heavies, like the ERLL hellbringer are very consistent in this range bracket, so grab the Virago should you have the MC for it. Rifleman IIC is also very competent at range, but very fragile. In the medium bracket, if you can fit ppcs on it, you're gucci. Lights are usually reserved for erppcs like the adder or cougar.

Not super specific help, but it's an okay guideline. Once you get better, you can deviate into pepega territory.

[Nightbird]

Stay out of FP until you feel like everyone in QP are idiots for playing that boring mode

[DarkFhoenix]

New players hungry for cbill,s and mechbays won't resist that sweet sweet payday FP offers . I was playing FP matches in trial mechs about 3 days when I started this game .

MJ12 team ups paid for a couple of my mechs. XD

Also there are very few other game modes here . Nobody will stay in QP till their mechs and skills are somewhat half decent .

Edited by DarkFhoenix, 04 January 2020 - 10:33 PM.

[Grumpy Old Man]

So, assuming that I can only afford to buy and kit out one Dropdeck (Inner Sphere) and acknowledging that I am **** at playing Assaults, what would that one Dropdeck look like? Mechs and Build wise?

[Vxheous]

Grumpy Old Man, on 04 January 2020 - 11:48 PM, said:

So, assuming that I can only afford to buy and kit out one Dropdeck (Inner Sphere) and acknowledging that I am **** at playing Assaults, what would that one Dropdeck look like? Mechs and Build wise?

The answer would be probably be 3x Warhammer + 55 tonner. Unfortunately, FP almost always requires that you bring at least one assault, or your team will suffer for it (unless you are extremely good, then you can carry with whatever mech choices you want, but that's not the case here.

Edited by Vxheous, 04 January 2020 - 11:52 PM.

[Grumpy Old Man]

I forsee problems skilling an Assault, but what would you suggest if I was able to bring one?

[Vxheous]

Grumpy Old Man, on 05 January 2020 - 12:13 AM, said:

I forsee problems skilling an Assault, but what would you suggest if I was able to bring one?

First question is, what do you play now? In terms of weapons, what do you use most? FP matches, like previously mentioned, usually occur in two ranges of fighting: mid range, and long range. So if you're a short ranged type of player, you're most likely SOL unless you join up with a unit that only NSR's

[KhanBhacKeD]

You can do ANH-2A, WHM-6D/6R, WHM-6D/6R, Flea/Commando

ANH-2A is quite good on all range. (for 6AC2 and 4erml or 6AC2 and ERLL/ERPPC or just 6AC2)

WHM 6D going to be laser vomit workhorse (so LPL and ERML)

WHM 6R going to be 2 gauss/4erml or 2Uac/10 with some erm (this one is a bit hotter but gauss not "noob" friendly)

I recommand the Flea as last mech with the -17 variant. (2mpl/ersl or bunch of spl you're choice.


Another suitable Dropdeck could be : ANH-2A, WHM-6D/6R, BSW-X1, VL-5T

Here Bushwacker is 2UAC 10 (you can do triple rac2 on it but i don't like it at all)

The vulcan is one of the best mech in game with 5mpl

The decks are more mid range oriented but you can still be in a quite more open map.

Problem here : On siege like boreal or on Polar you are going to be a deadweight for your team, you really need long range deck for these two maps.

(@Vxheous : feel free to correct me if i had said somthing wrong)

Edited by KhanBhacKeD, 05 January 2020 - 12:29 AM.

[Vxheous]

KhanBhacKeD, on 05 January 2020 - 12:28 AM, said:

You can do ANH-2A, WHM-6D/6R, WHM-6D/6R, Flea/Commando

ANH-2A is quite good on all range. (for 6AC2 and 4erml or 6AC2 and ERLL/ERPPC or just 6AC2)

WHM 6D going to be laser vomit workhorse (so LPL and ERML)

WHM 6R going to be 2 gauss/4erml or 2Uac/10 with some erm (this one is a bit hotter but gauss not "noob" friendly)

I recommand the Flea as last mech with the -17 variant. (2mpl/ersl or bunch of spl you're choice.


Another suitable Dropdeck could be : ANH-2A, WHM-6D/6R, BSW-X1, VL-5T

Here Bushwacker is 2UAC 10 (you can do triple rac2 on it but i don't like it at all)

The vulcan is one of the best mech in game with 5mpl

The decks are more mid range oriented but you can still be in a quite more open map.

Problem here : On siege like boreal or on Polar you are going to be a deadweight for your team, you really need long range deck for these two maps.

(@Vxheous : feel free to correct me if i had said somthing wrong)

Yeah, that all sounds pretty good, honestly, there's better people than I to comment on the most current FP decks since I rarely play FP (although I've been playing it more and more lately since group queue RIP). I can tell people what doesn't work, but there's a huge variation to what does work that's personal preference (some groups love their AC2 spam, others love their lasers, etc). Also varies with how "rich" people's accounts are, for some, spamming multiple heroes is no big deal (2 Cyclops Sleipnirs, 3 Hellbringer Viragos, etc) while others don't own a single hero mech.

Edited by Vxheous, 05 January 2020 - 12:34 AM.

[Grumpy Old Man]

Vxheous, on 05 January 2020 - 12:27 AM, said:

First question is, what do you play now? In terms of weapons, what do you use most? FP matches, like previously mentioned, usually occur in two ranges of fighting: mid range, and long range. So if you're a short ranged type of player, you're most likely SOL unless you join up with a unit that only NSR's

I mostly use Lasers and/or UACs. I dislike builds that run out of ammo and am often not good at judging the velocity of my weapons... I do own a Warhammer 6R and a Bushwacker X1 (using Triple Rac2s). I do own a couple of Hero Mechs, but I am not realy rich. 12 Mill CBills is what I currently have.

But let's assume I am going with a long range Deck.

[MisterSomaru]

Grumpy Old Man, on 05 January 2020 - 01:31 AM, said:

I mostly use Lasers and/or UACs. I dislike builds that run out of ammo and am often not good at judging the velocity of my weapons... I do own a Warhammer 6R and a Bushwacker X1 (using Triple Rac2s). I do own a couple of Hero Mechs, but I am not realy rich. 12 Mill CBills is what I currently have.

But let's assume I am going with a long range Deck.

Alright, for long range on IS, you have some options. More than clan. For this, I generally run the 5 erll ANH-1P, with a TC8, max standard engine, and every SHS known to man and some known to fish. It's one of the very few builds/mechs that actually benefit from SHS. I would also grab a BLR-1G and give it ERLL. it's a very good hill humper. Then, you can run a Blackjack with a pair of ERPPCs and either humpjump small hills, or straight up poptart with it. it's not high DPS, but will deal optimal damage out to 1 kilometer. I also have Advanced Look Far skilled in, because I can't see which component I'm shooting past that ******* reticule, nor lead properly if they're so far that the reticule is covering the target regardless.
For other mechs and builds, please take a look here https://grimmechs.isengrim.org/ for ideas one what you should be doing for some of these mechs. You can also follow some faction streamers on twitch for builds and the like, or see if you can tag along for drops.

[Vxheous]

Grumpy Old Man, on 05 January 2020 - 01:31 AM, said:

I mostly use Lasers and/or UACs. I dislike builds that run out of ammo and am often not good at judging the velocity of my weapons... I do own a Warhammer 6R and a Bushwacker X1 (using Triple Rac2s). I do own a couple of Hero Mechs, but I am not realy rich. 12 Mill CBills is what I currently have.

But let's assume I am going with a long range Deck.

Long range deck, personally I prefer Battlemaster 1G with 6 ERLL (upside is this Battlemaster 1G build uses a standard engine, so cheap to kit out). My long ranged deck consists of 2x Battlemaster 1G with 6 ERLL, 1x Warhammer 6D with 5 ERLL (or Grasshopper 5P with 5 ERLL), and 25 tons left over (usually just run a 20 ton Flea 17).
Here's the Battlemaster 1G:


Warhammer 6R you can run 2xGauss + 4-6 ERML with an LFE engine

Edited by Vxheous, 05 January 2020 - 01:45 AM.

[MisterSomaru]

Vxheous, on 05 January 2020 - 01:41 AM, said:

Long range deck, personally I prefer Battlemaster 1G with 6 ERLL (upside is this Battlemaster 1G build uses a standard engine, so cheap to kit out). My long ranged deck consists of 2x Battlemaster 1G with 6 ERLL, 1x Warhammer 6D with 5 ERLL (or Grasshopper 5P with 5 ERLL), and 25 tons left over (usually just run a 20 ton Flea 17).
Here's the Battlemaster 1G:


Warhammer 6R you can run 2xGauss + 4-6 ERML with an LFE engine

I really should swap my BLR to something like that, but I tend to prefer the DPS with 5 erll, and being able to perform the forbidden squeeze once in a while when absolutely needed.

[Vxheous]

MrSomaru, on 05 January 2020 - 02:06 AM, said:

I really should swap my BLR to something like that, but I tend to prefer the DPS with 5 erll, and being able to perform the forbidden squeeze once in a while when absolutely needed.

I feel weird running 5 ERLL on a 85 tonner (my stalker runs 5ERLL, but it's still weird to me), considering my 65-70 ton heavies run 5 ERLL. Granted my Anni has 5 ERLL, but that's mount limited.

Edited by Vxheous, 05 January 2020 - 02:18 AM.