20 replies to this topic

[Funky Schnitzel]

I've just come back to mwo after a very long time away, and faction play is still a hot mess. Most of the fights are clan vs IS, and IS doesn't stand a chance,so every match is a stomp. This drives IS players away, so that when you finally get IS vs IS there's no one around and it takes ages to get a match. Why do PGI hate battletech so much?

[Sniper09121986]

Funky Schnitzel, on 16 April 2020 - 03:00 AM, said:

Most of the fights are clan vs IS, and IS doesn't stand a chance

Probably agree about the BT attitude though.

[Brauer]

Funky Schnitzel, on 16 April 2020 - 03:00 AM, said:

I've just come back to mwo after a very long time away, and faction play is still a hot mess. Most of the fights are clan vs IS, and IS doesn't stand a chance,so every match is a stomp. This drives IS players away, so that when you finally get IS vs IS there's no one around and it takes ages to get a match. Why do PGI hate battletech so much?

IS have great mechs, better mechs in some weight classes than clan, and are definitely not out-classed. You're just wrong.

The reason you're likely getting stomped is that you're solo-dropping into FP without the ability to carry an FP match, or (if you're dropping with a group) the group you're with isn't very good. Faction balance is not the problem here.

[Funky Schnitzel]

Brauer, on 16 April 2020 - 04:50 AM, said:

IS have great mechs, better mechs in some weight classes than clan, and are definitely not out-classed. You're just wrong.

The reason you're likely getting stomped is that you're solo-dropping into FP without the ability to carry an FP match, or (if you're dropping with a group) the group you're with isn't very good. Faction balance is not the problem here.

But if I'm getting stomped because I'm solo dropping, surely the same should happen to the clans about half the time, right? Out of about 15 games I've played in the last few days only one was a win. Surely that would indicate some sort of matchmaking issue?

To back up that statement, I finally got to play IS vs IS a few times today, and the matches were very well balanced. I really don't think this is a "git gud" issue. I think there is a genuine lack of balance here. Sure, a well organised IS team probably stands a good chance, but the fact that two random teams leads to a clan stomp almost every time is a major issue.

[Brauer]

Funky Schnitzel, on 16 April 2020 - 05:02 AM, said:

But if I'm getting stomped because I'm solo dropping, surely the same should happen to the clans about half the time, right? Out of about 15 games I've played in the last few days only one was a win. Surely that would indicate some sort of matchmaking issue?

To back up that statement, I finally got to play IS vs IS a few times today, and the matches were very well balanced. I really don't think this is a "git gud" issue. I think there is a genuine lack of balance here. Sure, a well organised IS team probably stands a good chance, but the fact that two random teams leads to a clan stomp almost every time is a major issue.

Let me put it this way, in the latest Worlds tourney IS mechs were taken in the light, medium, and assault categories more often than clan by a pretty wide margin, and Clan mechs were only taken more frequently in the heavy class iirc. There's a reason for that, and the reason is that a number of top choices are IS mechs. IS have great ERLL assaults, great dakka assaults, excellent medium skirmishers, and nearly all of the best lights.

Given the choice I would happily take IS mechs for just about any role in FW. The primarily places I'd consider clan would be fast brawl, any of the Vapor Eagles over a 50-55 ton IS mech, the piranha over a flea (that last one is personal preference, and I love taking WLFs and Vulcans as a last mech), or maybe if I wanted to run a brain-dead Skill-eagle (ATM vapor eagle, or really ATMs in general). If anything I prefer dropping on the IS side because I get to use Sleipnirs, Annihilators, and other absolute top mechs over less optimal clan options.

I haven't seen any evidence that clan PUGs lose to IS pugs more often than not. If they do though it is absolutely not an issue of faction balance because if anything IS is better off over clan right now.

You also haven't really gone into how the game mode, or groups involved might have influenced your string of losses, or your own performance. All of those could easily play a role. For example, if when you were dropping you happened to face organized groups on the other side with some frequency you might not be discounting those games as in most cases a group should smash PUGs. You also might not be accounting for whether you were on the attacking side on siege. All things being equal the defenders have a big advantage on siege maps. I'm sure there are more factors that could be at play here, but trust me you'll have a hard time finding players with any kind of understanding of the meta who think Clans are OP right now.

[Funky Schnitzel]

Brauer, on 16 April 2020 - 05:38 AM, said:

Let me put it this way, in the latest Worlds tourney IS mechs were taken in the light, medium, and assault categories more often than clan by a pretty wide margin, and Clan mechs were only taken more frequently in the heavy class iirc. There's a reason for that, and the reason is that a number of top choices are IS mechs. IS have great ERLL assaults, great dakka assaults, excellent medium skirmishers, and nearly all of the best lights.

Given the choice I would happily take IS mechs for just about any role in FW. The primarily places I'd consider clan would be fast brawl, any of the Vapor Eagles over a 50-55 ton IS mech, the piranha over a flea (that last one is personal preference, and I love taking WLFs and Vulcans as a last mech), or maybe if I wanted to run a brain-dead Skill-eagle (ATM vapor eagle, or really ATMs in general). If anything I prefer dropping on the IS side because I get to use Sleipnirs, Annihilators, and other absolute top mechs over less optimal clan options.

I haven't seen any evidence that clan PUGs lose to IS pugs more often than not. If they do though it is absolutely not an issue of faction balance because if anything IS is better off over clan right now.

You also haven't really gone into how the game mode, or groups involved might have influenced your string of losses, or your own performance. All of those could easily play a role. For example, if when you were dropping you happened to face organized groups on the other side with some frequency you might not be discounting those games as in most cases a group should smash PUGs. You also might not be accounting for whether you were on the attacking side on siege. All things being equal the defenders have a big advantage on siege maps. I'm sure there are more factors that could be at play here, but trust me you'll have a hard time finding players with any kind of understanding of the meta who think Clans are OP right now.

In that case, maybe I need to stop pugging and get myself into some proper teams. I used to group up via teamspeak, but I can't find any of the old channels I used to use. Any advice on the best way to find a group these days?

[John Bronco]

A lot can depend on what time of day you are playing as well. Playing in NA Prime I am often forced to play clan to get a match simply because there are more people stacked up on IS side.

Agree with Brauer faction balance is far less important than pilot balance.

[Ignatius Audene]

Break 1000 dmg and ask for an invite after the drop. Your friends list will rise again and u will get ninja invites.

[justcallme A S H]

Funky Schnitzel, on 16 April 2020 - 03:00 AM, said:

IS doesn't stand a chance

Never has more rubbish ever been posted on this forum.

IS is RIDICULOUSLY STRONG.

The issue with IS is ------- You need to know how to play. Clan requires less skill.

Simple.

[Sniper09121986]

justcallme A S H, on 16 April 2020 - 08:41 AM, said:

Clan requires less skill.

[Funky Schnitzel]

justcallme A S H, on 16 April 2020 - 08:41 AM, said:

Never has more rubbish ever been posted on this forum.

IS is RIDICULOUSLY STRONG.

The issue with IS is ------- You need to know how to play. Clan requires less skill.

Simple.

I'm not a man to stick to my guns in the face of evidence. I'd love to hear how to play IS properly if you have any good resources. At this time, my experience has always shown me that IS lose random matches far more often than they win.

[K O Z A K]

I don't see how clan requires less skill, but I'd say the sides are very well balanced. If you're losing a lot playing IS you've probably just been unlucky and getting games where there are better players on the clam side.

[-Mean Machine Angel-]

If you have been away for sometime it maybe a good idea to check your armour on your mechs in mechlab.Some mechs need to have their armour reapplied after an update along time ago,Also these days where the pop is so small often you will come up against very strong groups made up of very skilled players while solo dropping,so honestly if your dropping solo expect to lose but have fun doing it except snow maps which are an abomination.Noone has fun on snow maps.

[Brauer]

Mean Machine Angel x, on 16 April 2020 - 01:47 PM, said:

If you have been away for sometime it maybe a good idea to check your armour on your mechs in mechlab.Some mechs need to have their armour reapplied after an update along time ago,Also these days where the pop is so small often you will come up against very strong groups made up of very skilled players while solo dropping,so honestly if your dropping solo expect to lose but have fun doing it except snow maps which are an abomination.Noone has fun on snow maps.

I like snow maps. What's wrong with a good blue-lightsaber fight?

Funky Schnitzel, on 16 April 2020 - 12:39 PM, said:

I'm not a man to stick to my guns in the face of evidence. I'd love to hear how to play IS properly if you have any good resources. At this time, my experience has always shown me that IS lose random matches far more often than they win.

On a long range map bring an ERLL or ERPPC ANH-1P or two, or two BLR-1G or STK-5S with ERLL, along with your choice of good light IS mechs (VL-5T, ASN, WLF, UM-K9, FLE). On mid-range maps bring some dakka (Sleipnirs, Annihilators, Black Widows, etc.) and again the aforementioned lighter mechs. Shoot the enemy until they are dead.

I'm sure there are other things that work, but if you can do those two things you'll contribute to your team. It's not super complicated.

EDIT: There is slightly more to it, like picking good positions, landing your shots, moving with your group, etc., but that's not FW specific like building a dropdeck is.

Edited by Brauer, 16 April 2020 - 05:35 PM.

[Hellbringer]

if anything clan mechs are too weak compared to the overwhelming armor/structure quirks of IS mechs.

Yes they usually have less firepower, but they have more sustainability. 4-lbx10 cyclops are bs. anni's are bs. pretty much all the best mechs are IS right now.

Just go check out the cyclops. has the agility of a friggin medium/heavy and can twist off damage like its nothing. great shield arms, armor quirks, just shoot, twist, shoot, twist.

Name one clan assault that can do this? try twisting a direwhale hahahha. twist a mcii-b and have your peww pewws blown off. best clam assault is bas-b

Edited by Hellbringer, 17 April 2020 - 08:40 PM.

[Sniper09121986]

Hellbringer, on 17 April 2020 - 08:39 PM, said:

if anything clan mechs are too weak compared to the overwhelming armor/structure quirks of IS mechs.

Yes they usually have less firepower, but they have more sustainability. 4-lbx10 cyclops are bs. anni's are bs. pretty much all the best mechs are IS right now.

Just go check out the cyclops. has the agility of a friggin medium/heavy and can twist off damage like its nothing. great shield arms, armor quirks, just shoot, twist, shoot, twist.

Name one clan assault that can do this? try twisting a direwhale hahahha. twist a mcii-b and have your peww pewws blown off. best clam assault is bas-b

The stretched-out chicken-walker type destroids like MCII and Marauder usually need to wiggle their nose at about 20 degrees either side or even less to spread damage, unlike humanoid gundams that need to twist full 90 degrees. Also a case could be made for IS heavies stealing the show of IS mediums with LFE, but that depends on exact builds. Clans do have some of best heavies and decent mediums, but less so with lights, and most of assaults are indeed walking trash.

[Swamp Ass MkII]

I do solo drop as clan, I can say I'm not the best player out there, so bad days look really bad! Anyhoot, with that being said, there are rounds that Clan gets stomped, and there are days that IS gets stomped. I don't play alot, but there is a rare occassion when it is down to the final Drop on both sides... It has to be more teamwork in FP than not.

Example, 3 IS hanging in the drop zone durring a offessive siege. Well, what do you think is going to happen then...

[Sniper09121986]

Swamp *** MkII, on 18 April 2020 - 08:15 PM, said:

I do solo drop as clan, I can say I'm not the best player out there, so bad days look really bad! Anyhoot, with that being said, there are rounds that Clan gets stomped, and there are days that IS gets stomped. I don't play alot, but there is a rare occassion when it is down to the final Drop on both sides... It has to be more teamwork in FP than not.

Example, 3 IS hanging in the drop zone durring a offessive siege. Well, what do you think is going to happen then...

Clan buffs?

[Swamp Ass MkII]

Sniper09121986, on 20 April 2020 - 02:06 AM, said:

Clan buffs?

Who knows...

[The Jewce Iz Loose]

IS op, please balance