1579 replies to this topic

[DAEDALOS513]

Kyoptik, on 19 May 2020 - 03:24 PM, said:

From an EU-timezone fan, I can only say thank you PGI, this is the first time group play with a friend of mine has been playable (<10 minute wait time) for over 6 months. I'd forgotten how much I love this game.

Apart from queue times consistently under 2 mins, there's been less Nascar, more team play, more communication and a return to the awesome fun I had when I first came to Mechwarrior Online. Please please keep the changes!

Your words brought a tear to my eye.. Play on my son.. Play on.

Edited by DAEDALOS513, 23 May 2020 - 08:45 PM.

[Kin3ticX]

FRAGTAST1C, on 23 May 2020 - 06:47 PM, said:

It is only fair that the experiments should continue but for the next month, remove QP and keep only FW, limit group size to 4-man and see how it goes. It is only fair.

The only experiment fraction play needs is to be rebuilt from scratch or to pretend it doesn't exist.

[FRAGTAST1C]

DAEDALOS513, on 23 May 2020 - 08:05 PM, said:

Why are you trying to drive players away from this awesome game? He's enjoying himself.. why you gotta ruin it? What's wrong with you ?

I'm not driving him away. I'm cautioning him about the current state of the game. [redacted]

Kin3ticX, on 23 May 2020 - 09:58 PM, said:

The only experiment fraction play needs is to be rebuilt from scratch or to pretend it doesn't exist.

I know but it is there to give respite from the soup queue. We might as well have FW forced on us for the next month in the name of experiment, no?

Edited by Ekson Valdez, 24 May 2020 - 10:31 PM.

[Raami]

Love it. Thanks.

[Knight Captain Morgan]

DAEDALOS513, on 23 May 2020 - 08:05 PM, said:

Why are you trying to drive players away from this awesome game? He's enjoying himself.. why you gotta ruin it? What's wrong with you ?

It's not a rando forum post driving the seals away from the clubbing grounds but the endless stream of stomps at the hands of competitive premade farm teams now that the seal reservation has been opened to hunting. Once they are gone, you and your "friend who you just wanna be able to drop with" will become the new seals targeted for clubbing. I suggest yolu enjoy these changes before they transform the new group queue into the old group queue and please, please use the increasing queue times to remember and reflect upon each of your present rando forum posts .

[Flyby215]

Just using pen and paper I wrote down my results on the weekend. As a group 51W 24L 40Stomps (12-4/4-12 or worse). As solo 41W 22L 31Stomps.

Stomps were 31W 9L as a group, 21W 10L in solo.

Not terrible, but noticeable.

I don't see what's wrong with an opt in opt out solution. The suggestion that "not enough players will opt in" is a direct acknowledgement that most solo queue players do not want a mixed queue.

However it plays out, player experience is subjective. You can tell me the data, but I am personally not enjoying the change. Make the door jokes if you really must, but if the mixed queue stays, I don't think I will be.



Edit: One of the numbers didn't add up. Corrected.

Edited by Flyby215, 24 May 2020 - 01:46 PM.

[Knight Captain Morgan]

Flyby215, on 24 May 2020 - 01:23 PM, said:

J 51W 24L 40Stomps (12-4/4-12 or worse).

or according to Russ's common core mathe 40 out of 75 = just 3%

[Nearly Dead]

Stomps are like ghost pepper sauce. A little goes a long way. I think that Russ/PGI are going to be shocked, (or elated depending on their reasons for making the change) by how many ordinary players they lose (get rid of) in the next few months.

I used to play hours and hours a day. Now I play a few games at a time and quit. I couldn't count the times I have exited a game with the intention of not coming back. It won't take too many more foul mouthed, hateful people or silent one sided games and it will tip the balance.

I think some of the people who are now playing in solo QP are part of the reason group queue shrank below viability. Now they have another pool to poop in.

[DAEDALOS513]

Knight Captain Morgan, on 24 May 2020 - 12:17 PM, said:

It's not a rando forum post driving the seals away from the clubbing grounds but the endless stream of stomps at the hands of competitive premade farm teams now that the seal reservation has been opened to hunting. Once they are gone, you and your "friend who you just wanna be able to drop with" will become the new seals targeted for clubbing. I suggest yolu enjoy these changes before they transform the new group queue into the old group queue and please, please use the increasing queue times to remember and reflect upon each of your present rando forum posts .

But that guy came on to tell us he's lovin the queue.. why does Frag have to discourage that? It's petty. This game needs fresh blood or are you guys too self interested to realize this?

Edited by DAEDALOS513, 24 May 2020 - 03:59 PM.

[Knight Captain Morgan]

DAEDALOS513, on 24 May 2020 - 03:19 PM, said:

But that guy came on to tell us he's lovin the queue.. why does Frag have to discourage that? It's pety. This game needs fresh blood or are you guys too self interested to realize this?

just like a lot of casual solo pugs were enjoying being able to drop against other casual solo pugs until pgi had to go and take that away by forcing them to drop against comp premade farm teams I guess, who know hy anyone does what they do or enjoys what they enjoy? I Suggest you meditate on your enjoyment of all this "fresh blood" as you describe it as your new group queue morphs into the old group queue with no solo queue with which to still enjoy drops <3

[DAEDALOS513]

Magic Pain Glove, on 23 May 2020 - 09:10 AM, said:

The funny thing is I didnt say that to you , I said that line of logic is , there is a difference . If you want me to be personal I will say I dont think you are dumb I think you are intentionally misleading others , avoiding discussing observable metrics , using faulty logic and selective player experience of a portion of the playerbase (who likes the change) as it suits your argument while disregarding others in attempt to rationalize and defend the current implementation of the soup queue . While you enjoy the change yourself you still have an irrational fear of it being reversed , which I assure you wont happen.

PGI barely reversed Long-Tom despite everyone being very vocal against it. It only took em 6 months after which faction play was already in ashes.

Now this here is the funniest thing of it all . You present a portion of forum commentators experience as "proof" to me while disregarding the other sizable portion who dislikes the change while at the same time claiming that all experience is subjective and all that while calling me a "hippocrit".

Should I [GOON] join a unit ? Should ASH [EMP] join a unit ? Should Brauer [MJ12] join a unit ? Once again , good advice but in reality it is a disguised attempt downplay the downsides of the current soup queue and place the blame on personal aspects/skills of individual players . Same thing with your previous "improve" argument . Disguised good advice aimed at redirecting blame for badly implemented change from developer to player.

You dont respond to anything objective if its gonna put you in a corner from which you cant weasel out with self-contradictory arguments you are using . I however don't have that problem .I am willing to debate anyone and explain my reasoning as clear and concise as I can .

You will tell Nearly Dead to "Improve" but you wont tell it to Proton.
You will tell some random pug to "join a unit" for the sake of argument but you wont tell it to me or other players I mentioned above.

10/10 Logic , not contradictory at all .

You didn't have to directly say it.. you know very well you implied it. Anyway it isn’t as black and white as saying ‘I like it.’ What I have been saying all along is that it was a necessary change.. for reasons I’ve listed more than once. As I’ve also stated more than once (because u guys keep making me repeat myself) now pgi must tweak it as we go .. maybe add some salt (changing max group size to 3) and pepper (adjusting lance spawn locations) to the soup and whatever else the recipe calls for.

These guys wanted proof that the queue isn't all bad and I gave it to them.. i don't understand what the problem is.. i never said i didn't acknowledge the guys not happy with the queue.. do I need to give them a cookie?

Yes I suggested to everyone that isn't in a unit to try joining one.. (not just certain players).. dropping with a partner with coordinated builds will up their gameplay a thousand fold. They can still drop solo even while in a unit but still get many of the advantages from joining.. For those that are in a unit but aren't happy with the queue try doing what I’ve been doin with some of my unit mates.. take non-meta out for a whirl and challenge yourself in this new queue.. Instead of relying on your builds to do the work for you.. try relying on your skill or lance coordination to do well.. you may find new joy in this.

PS. your mind is too easily blown o7

Edited by DAEDALOS513, 24 May 2020 - 10:52 PM.

[CatznDogz]

Really enjoying combined queue. Can play with friends anytime now and wait times are so much improved

Also easier to bring in new players now. You can group with new players anytime so its easier to show them the ropes. In fact, I find its the new players who are asking to group up now as their experience seems to be better with groups.

Also in general, the quality of games are not that much different from when solo and group queue were separate.

Combined queue is a big yes from me!

[-Paranoia-]

Just want to contribute my 2 cents to this topic --

I hope when this experiment is done that we can continue to drop with friends, rather than be forced to screw around with unreliable sync dropping. I've played more games this month than at any other points in the time I've been playing so far, just for the social aspect by itself, not to mention the benefits of having people in your lance who you know have your back. It's just more fun in general.

So far, I haven't really noticed that much difference in the games, as far as throwing off the balance or winning more often just because you have friends with you. Even with a 4-man drop, you can still easily lose if you get outplayed, even with no groups on the other team.

My biggest complain so far is that the spawns on some maps need to be adjusted based on tonnage -- for example, assaults in Alpha lance on certain maps (Canyon Network) can sometimes get screwed by where they spawn, and forced to walk through a death trap in order to regroup with the rest of their team.

[StuntChicken007]

Anomalocaris, on 21 May 2020 - 08:35 AM, said:

What's fun for one potato is not fun for another. A lot of us played solo because we didn't want to group drop. Now we're gone. Enjoy your game while it lasts.....

So, You mean you came on here just to call me and all the others potatoes? Please do go away lol. Go play MineCraft brah. I bet you got Stomped by us huh? You know you could have just asked and we would have invited you to a group also. Even with your crappy attitude lol.

Edited by StuntChicken007, 25 May 2020 - 06:09 AM.

[StuntChicken007]

Anomalocaris, on 22 May 2020 - 09:57 AM, said:

Sorry mate, you haven't been consistently rolling anyone this season. But cool story.

Look at this dude's profile over 800 forum post and most are about how much he hates the game and doesn't want to play anymore and is taking a break and never again. But, yet you are still playing and posting and have been for a very long time. Give it up man. You love the game and you love to troll. Just admit it. lol

[Sniper09121986]

StuntChicken007, on 25 May 2020 - 06:20 AM, said:

Look at this dude's profile over 800 forum post and most are about how much he hates the game and doesn't want to play anymore and is taking a break and never again. But, yet you are still playing and posting and have been for a very long time. Give it up man. You love the game and you love to troll. Just admit it. lol

Could it possibly be that he cares about the game and wants it to get better? Because if nobody cared whether MWO lives or dies, this topic would not have 80 pages and counting. And if posting on the forum is preferable to playing the game... well, what does that say about the latter?

[Magic Pain Glove]

DAEDALOS513, on 24 May 2020 - 07:52 PM, said:

For those that are in a unit but aren't happy with the queue try doing what I’ve been doin with some of my unit mates.. take non-meta out for a whirl and challenge yourself in this new queue.. Instead of relying on your builds to do the work for you.. try relying on your skill or lance coordination to do well.. you may find new joy in this.

The fact that you are telling this to someone who pilots a 2xHPPC spider in the queue on a regular basis makes it very funny. Indirectly telling me to self balance while I am probably someone who explored the most extreme self balance builds out there and runs a number of them on a regular basis . So telling me to "self balance" is very rich .( Plenty of video evidence for this )

But good to know you adhere to Bollock's MW5 logic ,like when people asked for improved AI he told them to "self balance".See how this works ?

Shifting blame from a badly implemented change/feature and placing it on player behavior and you are doing the same thing. And MW5 is a ghost town atm , partially thanks to pants on head arguments such as the one above.




Any other useful advice for players , something we can do to compensate for the shortcomings of the soup queue DAEDALOS513 ?

[East Indy]

Many of us have offered suggestions on how to improve skill-based matchmaking. A lot of them have merit, but all still deal with multiple factors that have to be experienced to be understood.

Here's an improvement that's straight arithmetic: weight class limits instead of tonnage limits.

In the end, tonnage matters. Each of us has seen games where our team (or the other) has better players but armor and firepower decide the score.

Under tonnage limits, maximum variances are much, much wider than with weight class limits.

4-man group:
Tonnage limit max variance: 160 tons*
100-100-40-40 versus 30-30-30-30

Weight class max variance: 65 tons
100-75-55-35 versus 80-60-40-20


3-man group:
Tonnage limit max variance: 175 tons
100-100-55 versus 30-30-20

Weight class max variance (free): 110 tons
100-75-55 versus 60-40-20

Weight class max variance (with A-H-L or A-H-M enforced): 50 or 70 tons
100-75-55 versus 80-60-40 or 80-60-20


2-man group:
Tonnage limit max variance: 160 tons
100-100 versus 20-20

Weight class max variance (free): 115 tons
100-75 versus 40-20

Weight class max variance (with A-H, A-M, H-M or A-L enforced): 35, 55, or 75 tons
100-75 versus 80-60, 80-40, 60-40, 80-20


Again, straight arithmetic. This is a no-brainer for reducing tonnage imbalances. Group Queue can satisfy groups who insist on creative tonnage combinations. Mixed Queue is not a place for special snowflakes: it's a reasonable solution to meet needs of all players remaining in the game.


* The original limit of 280 tons apparently reverted a few days ago. Subtract 20 for 260 tons.

[Darknhoji]

First post of the forum and just wanted to say that I really enjoy being able to play with friends and enjoy the combining of the queues. If anything you may want to limit groups to 3 instead of 4 however this is still a massive improvement VS solo and group queue.

As an old player i find that the stomps are not that much more common then they were however until the matchmaker is improved it will happen regardless of how the queues are implemented.

Thanks for running this test and hope it continues!

[Kin3ticX]

280 tons es grande mucho