43 replies to this topic

[Brizna]

Patch notes are basically a reference to a 12 page long forum thread, so can someone actually provide some information on how does the new PSR system work?

Also, was MS changed in any way? Damage has always had too much importance imo, but the worst offender was AMS, has AMS match score been rectified in any way? Otherwise it seems like one can still cheat his own MS very easily and thus manipulate its own PSR.

[UnofficialOperator]

Brizna, on 03 July 2020 - 12:22 AM, said:

Patch notes are basically a reference to a 12 page long forum thread, so can someone actually provide some information on how does the new PSR system work?

Also, was MS changed in any way? Damage has always had too much importance imo, but the worst offender was AMS, has AMS match score been rectified in any way? Otherwise it seems like one can still cheat his own MS very easily and thus manipulate its own PSR.

BrioS does an explanation here in his video.

https://www.reddit.c...is_gameplay_by/

Edited by UnofficialOperator, 03 July 2020 - 02:42 AM.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

also this, since you seem to have missed the pinned threads
https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6339427

[Brizna]

What about match score?? Did anyone bother to nerf AMS at least, or can one, if you want to, get to tier 1 by spamming AMS.

[Tarl Cabot]

Brizna, on 05 July 2020 - 11:40 AM, said:

What about match score?? Did anyone bother to nerf AMS at least, or can one, if you want to, get to tier 1 by spamming AMS.

How MS is correctly being calculated/weighed had not been touched. But to counter some, shooting down incoming Missiles would allow the player and his/her teammates the potential to live last longer by reducing incoming damage. And while living longer, forcing LRM/ATM users to launch MORE missiles, assisting in potentially emptying the ammo bins sooner than later. Devil's advocate.. I think more players should equip AMS.

[Brizna]

Tarl Cabot, on 05 July 2020 - 11:50 AM, said:

How MS is correctly being calculated/weighed had not been touched. But to counter some, shooting down incoming Missiles would allow the player and his/her teammates the potential to live last longer by reducing incoming damage. And while living longer, forcing LRM/ATM users to launch MORE missiles, assisting in potentially emptying the ammo bins sooner than later. Devil's advocate.. I think more players should equip AMS.

Yes... and??? Use it please but if you award so much match score as it does now and then use match score as a metric of skill, you skill metric is way of, which is a problem to create balanced games.

[Sjorpha]

Brizna, on 05 July 2020 - 11:59 AM, said:

Yes... and??? Use it please but if you award so much match score as it does now and then use match score as a metric of skill, you skill metric is way of, which is a problem to create balanced games.

For matchmaking purposes, it is predicted impact on winning chances that is the interesting value, not some idea of what "skill" is.

So IF equipping AMS does actually improve the chances of winning games, it is correct for it to have whatever match score value that matches that impact. Now I'm not convinced AMS is that strong, so I agree it's probably overvalued in the current MS calculation, I'm just pointing out that with PSR we're actually looking to predict match impact rather than "skill", so it doesn't really matter for matchmaking purposes if the impact is from player skill play or some other factor like the strength of the mech and build etc.

Edited by Sjorpha, 05 July 2020 - 12:19 PM.

[Vindicated]

Brizna, on 05 July 2020 - 11:40 AM, said:

What about match score?? Did anyone bother to nerf AMS at least, or can one, if you want to, get to tier 1 by spamming AMS.

That sounds fair though, because some people are going to get to T1 by spamming LRMs

[VonBruinwald]

Sjorpha, on 05 July 2020 - 12:18 PM, said:

So IF equipping AMS does actually improve the chances of winning games, it is correct for it to have whatever match score value that matches that impact. Now I'm not convinced AMS is that strong, so I agree it's probably overvalued in the current MS calculation

The best way to balance AMS MS is to have it equal to the MS the destroyed missile would grant on a hit.

It's a 1 to 1 trade off.

[John Bronco]

VonBruinwald, on 05 July 2020 - 03:37 PM, said:

The best way to balance AMS MS is to have it equal to the MS the destroyed missile would grant on a hit.

It's a 1 to 1 trade off.

You are suggesting tripling the MS for AMS. Still sound like a good idea?

[Monkey Lover]

VonBruinwald, on 05 July 2020 - 03:37 PM, said:

The best way to balance AMS MS is to have it equal to the MS the destroyed missile would grant on a hit.

It's a 1 to 1 trade off.

Why give it match score at all? just give it a small cbill reward.

[OneTeamPlayer]

Monkey Lover, on 05 July 2020 - 03:43 PM, said:

Why give it match score at all? just give it a small cbill reward.

AMS gives matchscore because when it didn't no one used it and everyone complained about LRMs despite LRMs being the only weapons system in the game with a direct equipment based counter (yes, i know they changed AMS, ams worked fine before then i know because i got propel together and tested).

Now that it gives matchscore you see people using the single, double, and triple slots they have and LRMs are often a complete non issue (to the point where they show up significantly less in queue).

[VonBruinwald]

BlaizerP, on 05 July 2020 - 03:40 PM, said:

You are suggesting tripling the MS for AMS. Still sound like a good idea?

Doesn't that highlight how overweighted damage is towards MS.

[Monkey Lover]

OneTeamPlayer, on 05 July 2020 - 03:54 PM, said:

AMS gives matchscore because when it didn't no one used it and everyone complained about LRMs despite LRMs being the only weapons system in the game with a direct equipment based counter (yes, i know they changed AMS, ams worked fine before then i know because i got propel together and tested).

Now that it gives matchscore you see people using the single, double, and triple slots they have and LRMs are often a complete non issue (to the point where they show up significantly less in queue).

I think people would use it way more if it gave cbills. Basically only thing most people care about. I could care less about match score. I normally only look at kmdd haha

Edited by Monkey Lover, 05 July 2020 - 04:11 PM.

[OneTeamPlayer]

Monkey Lover, on 05 July 2020 - 04:10 PM, said:

I think people would use it way more if it gave cbills. Basically only thing most people care about. I could care less about match score. I normally only look at kmdd haha

Given that PSR is based on match score now, a lot of people care about it again.

Many players have multiple hundreds of millions of Cbills they will never spend. I'm thinking about buying a mech just for the heck of it as it just piles up after a while.

Assassin or Annihilator i'm thinking.

[John Bronco]

VonBruinwald, on 05 July 2020 - 04:09 PM, said:

Doesn't that highlight how overweighted damage is towards MS.

Even if damage weight is reduced you're still talking about a massive increase to AMS, which most seem to agree is already too high.

[Thorn Hallis]

OneTeamPlayer, on 05 July 2020 - 04:18 PM, said:

Assassin or Annihilator i'm thinking.

Why not both?

[OneTeamPlayer]

Thorn Hallis, on 05 July 2020 - 05:08 PM, said:

Why not both?

Not enough space in my stable, not going to buy more slots or play FW for them.

Plus I have all the mechs I want, this is literally just to have an excuse to spend some cbills.

[Jman5]

Monkey Lover, on 05 July 2020 - 03:43 PM, said:

Why give it match score at all? just give it a small cbill reward.

For the same reason that we give matchscore rewards for using ECM, and UAVs. These are often useful things to use that help improve the chances of your team winning. There is plenty of value in non-damage related actions and the matchscore should reflect that.

The matchscore system is already heavily weighted to favor large damage dealers like Heavies and Assaults. Raw damage is always going to be the biggest source of matchscore points. Getting rid of the few existing support bonuses like AMS or ECM would just tilt that balance even further in their favor.

People are spending tonnage, slot space, and skill points equipping AMS. It should be included in matchscore calculation.

Edited by Jman5, 06 July 2020 - 03:30 AM.

[Brizna]

Jman5, on 06 July 2020 - 03:20 AM, said:

People are spending tonnage, slot space, and skill points equipping AMS. It should be included in matchscore calculation.

No one is saying it shoudn't contribute to MS, at leas I am not, but it contributes way too much. One season I decided to play mostly Nova with 3 AMS+12 cERSL just to see how high I could get in the ladder and bumped my average MS by 50 points, it's not even a good build... just a decent one.

It's very clear AMS contributes too much to MS, the same can be said of Damage too, but imo in this case the overweighting of it is a lot more reasonable.