544 replies to this topic

[Daeron Katz]

Hello, MechWarriors! I agree, talk is cheap.

Unfortunately, I can't be super active communicating on the forums right now, because I'm still very much processing your feedback (every single related post on the MWO forums, reddit threads, Discord group threads and DMs, emails, Twitter posts and DMs, PDFs and Google docs sent in by the community), as well as listening to podcasts, Twitch streams and recordings, YouTube videos, dropping in matches and talking to the players, and anything else I can do or get my hands on. It's a lot!

The last 2-3 weeks have been all about receiving, understanding, and documenting all of the feedback and input we asked for and you have provided, to say the least.

Every Friday I've been doing an "update" podcast with Phil on NGNG, the most recent can be seen at the end of this post. With my current workload and deadlines, that's the easiest way for me to keep in regular contact with the community. I understand there are plenty of you that don't listen to the podcast, but if you're seeking that current information, that's where it can be found for now. As I continue to get adjusted to my new position, responsibilities, and schedule, I will try to expand on that.

As I mentioned in the most recent update podcast, this week (yesterday) I had a meeting with Russ and Matt about all of the feedback that we have gathered to date, and we started to look at possible paths forward using that data. Now we are taking all of that feedback and organizing it into an outline of a plan, that we will then bring back to the community to hash out the details and priorities. This will then go through a technical review process, in which the devs will tell us what is possible, and how much work and time we can expect everything to take. Then it's back to you to finalize and move forward!

I promise you this is happening, this is real, and you, the MechWarrior community, are going to play a massive role in helping guide it and make it all happen. This is a huge undertaking, so please have a little patience with me, as we are working hard to make sure we do this right by you.

As the title in the podcast below states, we are getting close to the next step, which will be presenting you with the first outline of a plan based on your initial feedback. From there we will have much to discuss, and technical reviews with the devs, and I promise you will be informed and involved every step of the way. I'm very excited about the future of MWO, and I hope you are too!

[The6thMessenger]

Daeron Katz, on 28 October 2020 - 01:07 PM, said:

I'm very excited about the future of MWO, and I hope you are too!

Sure I guess?

But i'm not really that hyped, I don't want that much emotional investment if it all blows up in my face. And if PGI stays being PGI, it's likely to eventually do.

[Heavy Money]

Daeron Katz, on 28 October 2020 - 01:07 PM, said:

I'm very excited about the future of MWO, and I hope you are too!

Sounds good, looking forward to seeing what you guys can put together! I've been keeping up with the podcasts, and I think you're doing a good job.

I'd like very much to see something like a list of suggested features, with comments on both their technical and financial viability. I think it'd be helpful for the community to understand why a specific feature is or isn't being implemented. If you come back and just say what you're going to put in, there's a lot of people who will be bitter because they'll assume you dismissed their ideas for bad reasons, when often its just technical limitations. I have worked on similar projects before, so I have a good idea of what is technically feasible and what isn't. But as you have no doubt seen on these forums lately, a lot of people just don't have a good map of how complex any given feature is to implement.

I assume that some suggestions will have to be dismissed straight away due to technical limitations, and then out of those remaining, you'll be trying to make choices based on overall vision of the game, or develop an overall vision based on what's feasible. So being open about that decision and choice making process will probably be a good way to mollify the community.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

I can only hang on for the ride I suppose. My feelings on most of the things at issue have been known for years.

I can only hope to see even a slight change towards what I'd like, regardless of that, I'm looking forward to seeing where the community takes this game.

[Alreech]

C337Skymaster, on 28 October 2020 - 12:32 PM, said:

I think we need to give up on "quickly" and focus on "quality". Having just read the first four pages of a pre-launch thread titled "Minimum Viable Product", and having been depressed to realize that thread reads identically to this one, I'm realizing that we've been settling for the Minimum Viable Product out of PGI for 8 years, and it's time to stop settling.

Have you also read the defenition of "Minimum Viable Product" on Wikipedia?
It's the base of every early access Video Game.

Most of MWOs problems are not missing features but the focus on quickplay and the struggle to improve it (Tiers & matchmaking).

Mechwarrior Online is 8 years old, time to move on and make a succesor with new engine.
That doesn't mean that Quality of Life changes can't be done to MWO, but only if they don't take to much time & money. So quickly means that, not poor execution.

Quality should be focus on all works done to the successor, and that should IMHO base on Mechwarrior 5.
Technically, but also comercial
Selling preorder Mechpacks for real cash won't work again
Selling new campaings for MW5 and colors / skins / Mechs with 30% C-Bill Bonus in it's faction based multiplayer mode may work.

Quote

This is already not true: we search for minutes, or hours on end, then get locked into a match,

During that search the matchmaker is running.

Quote

THEN have 90 seconds to reconfigure our drop decks from whatever saved valid 'mech configurations we have in our 'mech bays. Admittedly, that's more like 80 seconds in practice, but it's still after the match is determined and before the actual game begins

At that point you are in the lobby of a new server, connected to a new instance.

How does the lobby works?
The player have a set of valid dropdecks he can choose from.

How does the server knows that the dropdecks are valid?
Because the status of the dropdecks are checked before the matchmaker is started

That happens if you change a Dropdeck compensition during matchmaking or in the lobby?
The Status must be checked again to prevent invalid drop decks.

Maybe it would possible to add the validator to the lobby, but it would take time and money and may cause bugs.
Also all players have to wait for the guy who "just have to fix a dropdeck"...

Comparsion:
Setting the min player / max player variable for groups in faction play to 2/4 would probably took 15 minutes, and 10 of those due "getting a cup of coffee before making a small change".

Edited by Alreech, 28 October 2020 - 02:58 PM.

[thievingmagpi]

Lockheed_, on 28 October 2020 - 03:05 PM, said:

Daeron I still dont understand how you guys at PGI dont understand how much a little bits of feedback from you on a regular basis, something that one can write in two minutes, would mean in terms of building trust with the community. It's a tiny investment compared to going through all the data you must be flooded with, but it has so much impact. Keeping people in the loop is so important whether it is in a business,a team, or with the customer.
Talk, if done right, can be a very cheap investment creating lots of value.

What information do you feel you're entitled to? Information that can be relayed, has been. Everything seems to still be in the "we're discussing things" phase. If in fact Daeron was reading the large amount of feedback and suggestions, I don't see what information can be shared?

Look, I don't particularly know where I feel on the trusting PGI thing, but it appears the gears are only starting to turn now.

Daeron Katz, on 28 October 2020 - 01:07 PM, said:

As the title in the podcast below states, we are getting close to the next step, which will be presenting you with the first outline of a plan based on your initial feedback. From there we will have much to discuss, and technical reviews with the devs, and I promise you will be informed and involved every step of the way. I'm very excited about the future of MWO, and I hope you are too!

That's the important paragraph.

[Joshua McEvedy]

Daeron Katz, on 28 October 2020 - 01:07 PM, said:

I'm very excited about the future of MWO, and I hope you are too!

What future? Russ declared the game effectively at End of Life/Maintenance Mode in May 2019, or did you miss that update?

Oh wait...

[Heavy Money]

Joshua McEvedy, on 28 October 2020 - 04:40 PM, said:

What future? Russ declared the game effectively at End of Life/Maintenance Mode in May 2019, or did you miss that update?

Oh wait...

And now they've declared that they are going to put more into it. Did you miss that?

[CycKath]

I want to believe, but I'm scared that its far to late.

[Joshua McEvedy]

Heavy Money, on 28 October 2020 - 05:06 PM, said:

And now they've declared that they are going to put more into it. Did you miss that?

I've been here since November 2011. Don't get your hopes up.

[Kamikaze Viking]

Great news Daeron!

I cant wait to see your plan and get involved in refining the priorities and community feedback.
I haven't really felt the need to say much lately because much of what I think is already being covered by the Community.

I did find an interesting discussion on Outreach HPG regarding 8v8 vs 12v12 and some interesting perspectives on match sizes for solo queue (it seems everyone is in agreement on 8v8 for group, but its very split on solo queue with good ideas on both sides)

[LastKhan]

Gonna need a hat trick to breathe any life back into here. First, how bout we ditch the solaris 7 stuff? Dont need to base the game on a mode that no one plays.

Ill be watching to see how this plays out.

[jss78]

There's so much feedback given already that it feels superfluous to say anything, but still I feel strongly about this general direction.

I think in the first months you should give utmost priority to improve new-player experience. I believe with the Steam launch of MW5 you have a window here to attract some new blood. So how do you make these people stick around:

• Better new-player packages: give them an easy start. Would it be possible to give them a handful of champion (or equivalent) 'mechs with a simple and effective default builds -- possibly even locked in and not customizable -- so they are steered to try the game with somewhat sensible builds? (It's really an exceptional game among its competition in how utterly you can cripple your 'mech if you don't know the ins and outs of mech building.)

• Skill tree: ruthlessly roll back or replace it. This is already a very complex game. Some of it like the mechbay is a rewarding layer of complexity. The skill tree is an unnecessary and unrewarding layer of complexity. Make the skill system simple and straight-forward. (This change should please both new and old players, so IMO it's a very high-priority item.)

• Any simple and quick fixes to solo queue. This is where the new guys play, and also where the bulk of the old guys play. Look into the balance issues of the 3 and 4-man groups there. If it seems too much, take it down to 2-man.

Edited by jss78, 29 October 2020 - 09:49 AM.

[RRAMIREZ]

I'm happy Daeron made this short post here, on official forum. I think it was necessary. Even if there's not much more information than on the podcast, it make sense to have this quick com here.

Daeron Katz, on 28 October 2020 - 01:07 PM, said:

As I mentioned in the most recent update podcast, this week (yesterday) I had a meeting with Russ and Matt about all of the feedback that we have gathered to date, and we started to look at possible paths forward using that data. Now we are taking all of that feedback and organizing it into an outline of a plan, that we will then bring back to the community to hash out the details and priorities.

Looking forward that, as everybody I guess.

[Bud Crue]

Daeron Katz, on 28 October 2020 - 01:07 PM, said:

Hello, MechWarriors! I agree, talk is cheap.

Hey Daeron.

So, how'd the Wednesday meeting with Russ go? Not looking for intimate details. Just some hint that he didn't ghost you, and that he is indeed allowing you to proceed with something (hopefully somethingS) other than just making adjustments to the store.

Thumbs up or thumbs down is all that is needed here.

Edit:

Just saw the your response on the previous page. So it looks like you are moving forward and he appears willing to go along with at least something. Fingers crossed I guess. Look forward to the next update.

Edited by Bud Crue, 29 October 2020 - 03:49 AM.

[Alreech]

Quality of Life improvments for MWO: VOIP

Status Quo:
MWO uses Teamspeak as VOIP solution.
Everytime the player joins the pre match lobby he is connected to a Team Channel on a Teamspeak server, and disconneced after leaving it.

If you play in a group, you need an external VOIP Solution to talk to the players in your group before and after that match: TS or Discord ect...
You need to invite other players to your VOIP Server to talk to them
Player needs this App installed and configured
Potential fuss with sending server IP, or setting rights for a new user on that VOIP Server

VOIP QoL 1:
VOIP in Group screen

Changes:
Create a Group channel during group creation, connect players in that group to that channel

Improvements:
The group can now use VOIP before the match and afterwards without external VOIP Solution
No need to "invite strangers to your own TS", huge improvement if you invite players from the LFG Lobby


VOIP QoL 2:
Use TS Subchannels during the match

MWO VOIP now:
Channel TeamA

• Player 1, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 2, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 3, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 4, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 5, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 6, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 7, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 8, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 9, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 10, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 11, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 12, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....

A player always talks to all 11 other players in the channel and that is confusing, so MWO uses "Push to talk" for mic activation to reduce radio chatter.





Change:
Channel Team A
Sub Channel Lance1

• Player 1, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 2, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 3, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 4, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....

Sub Channel Lance2

• Player 1, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 2, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 3, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 4, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....

Sub Channel Lance3

• Player 1, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 2, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 3, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....
  
• Player 4, Teamspeak ID XAFG-J145A-....

Improvements:
Now a player can only talk to the other 3 players in the same Sub channel and that is way less confusing. Using "Voice activation" for mic activation is now possible, allowing talking to your lance mates with out pressing a key.

To talk to the complete team the function Whisper To Group - All Clients - Channel Family can be used by pressing the VOIP Key

Change the Whisper to: Groups
Group Whisper Type: all Clients
Group Whisper Target: Channel family

Edited by Alreech, 29 October 2020 - 04:37 AM.

[V O L T R O N]

Thanks for taking your time to listen. Things I would like to see happen.
1. Lances organized by speed regardless of group #PUBS
2. CW rewards for each phase to units. Once phase starts you cannot switch sides. #MC
3. Solaris 2VS2's, Take away the 7 divisions and just make one. It takes too long to coordinate between two people and to get the proper mechs, and there is no balance in 2vs2 anyway. Where 2 partners may not even have the same mechs. It just takes too much organization to drop Solaris and thats why 2vs2 is a dead aspect.
4. CW que should show how many matches are in progress as well as in Que
5. Comp season should be all season just like Solaris, but all modes/maps should be random. Have it one night a week, similar to the way it is now and the rewards to be more balanced and even as it is in Solaris.
6. Maps, bring back the old ones, Terra therma, river city, and make CW siege maps into the regular que. Just remove the gates.
7.Modes Domination-Perhaps move the yellow stain throughout the center of the map from end to end. Assault mode, perhaps bring back turrets so they stop rotation a bit. Maybe have a mode in quick play that has just one base and one team has to attack or defend.
8. Weapons, make flamers apart of match score. Light Gauss a ton lighter or like 9 damage per shot.
9. Fix lance drops in certain maps and modes that start too far from the rest of their team.

Well, this is all I can think of right now. Maybe someone will like them.

[Windscape]

If it has not been said already, I would highly suggest looking at the discussion to improve MWO on Mwoleagues if you have not looked already.

With that being said, I have a few suggestions that I would like to add to that pile:

As part of fixing the grind, change XP values. You need 72,800 XP to get 91 skill points. It has already been discussed that skill tree is way to large and complex, and I agree with that, i just have one more additional measure.

Make the minimum XP value 800xp, or at least a much higher value than it already is. Right now, if you lose a game, there is a chance that you can get 40xp in one match, and you can get 2000+ in another. If this disparity was reduced, this should keep new player retention as they could skill their mech at a faster pace regardless of their skill level.

Halving the skill tree XP values is also a viable solution and was discussed in the Mwoleagues podcast iirc.

Solaris, the simplest fix imo would be reducing the season time. Make it at least one month or a couple weeks, while keeping the rewards, and the gamemode would be a lot more active. In the future, if possible, it would be nice to remove the 14+ buckets, and make Solaris a more specialized gamemode. Say for 2 weeks, there is a mini tournament where you can only play a WHM in Solaris, put the mech (and mechpack) on sale for the duration of the event, and the winner wins some WHM related rewards, for example. Having someone picking what "theme" to do for Solaris would be more work for Matt, and more work for whoever is responsible for coding any necessary elements in, but could potentially pay off if you really wanted Solaris to be your seller and branding for the game.

FP changes, and QP queue stuff has already been discussed in detail, and I agree with what has been discussed on the Mwoleagues podcast.

Edited by Windscape, 29 October 2020 - 10:35 AM.

[evil kerensky]

if you want to fix solaris, make it just 4 buckets, and get rid of 2v2s. one bucket per weight class. 14 buckets will never fill, and good luck getting 7 to fill.

id honostly consider 2 buckets, heavies and assaults in 1, and mediums and lights in another, but 4 would probably be fine. that or do a free for all mode, but thats already been written off as undo-able.

[Bowelhacker]

For chirstsakes, if you're going to base some decisions on the "community" here then lower the weighting you give it. Because we are all ******* dickheads.