18 replies to this topic

[SirNotlag]

So I was recently testing out machine guns and seeing how well the Rate of fire quirks worked. I got curious from seeing all the light mechs with ballistic cooldown quirks and wondered since MGs are ballistics if that helped their rate of fire, I was not actually expecting anything since MGs dont have a cooldown they just constantly shoot.

Sadly to anyone wondering they do not increase the rate of fire for machine guns. I wish they did though especially on light mechs as they can barley carry any of the ACs

[Aidan Crenshaw]

There's not so many (7 chassis, 13 variants total) light mechs with ballistic cooldown quirks. For MGs, there's ROF quirks.

[FupDup]

RACs are the same way as MGs in this regard, and there aren't even any mechs with RAC RoF quirks.

For light mechs we really do need Magshots and Light ACs for the IS as well as their Clan counterparts of AP Gauss and Protomech ACs.

Edited by FupDup, 26 January 2021 - 02:59 AM.

[VonBruinwald]

Aidan Crenshaw, on 26 January 2021 - 01:13 AM, said:

There's not so many (7 chassis, 13 variants total) light mechs with ballistic cooldown quirks.

There's also the generic cooldown quirk which has the same functions as the ballistic (and energy/missile) cooldown, still doesn't affect MGs though

[Willard Phule]

FupDup, on 26 January 2021 - 02:57 AM, said:

RACs are the same way as MGs in this regard, and there aren't even any mechs with RAC RoF quirks.

For light mechs we really do need Magshots and Light ACs for the IS as well as their Clan counterparts of AP Gauss and Protomech ACs.

I'd much rather see Hyper Assault Gauss instead of anything protomech.

[SirNotlag]

FupDup, on 26 January 2021 - 02:57 AM, said:

RACs are the same way as MGs in this regard, and there aren't even any mechs with RAC RoF quirks.

For light mechs we really do need Magshots and Light ACs for the IS as well as their Clan counterparts of AP Gauss and Protomech ACs.

Yeah id love if they released some of the later weapons. I know they probably aren't as the games kinda old but it'd be fun to run around in a light mech carrying some decent cannons or mini gauss rifles. Wonder how they could work in this game.

The clan AP gauss is an anti personnel weapon so being a super machine gun that generates a little heat would make sense. Like 1.5 damage per second out to an optimum 270 meters.
I don't think the IS magshot got any bonus against infantry so it being a mini gauss rifle that deals like 2 damage out to 270m could be fun. preferably without the charge mechanic since its so small but i mean at 0.5 tons you can bring as many as you have hard points on the mech has for it so it might be needed so bigger mechs dont have an easy extra pinpoint damage for little weight.

Light ACs for the most part work like regular just shorter range. If they are deemed too OP they can do the splitting the number of shots so the LAC 5 fires 2 bullets of 2.5 damage instead of the single 5. I don't think there would be a need for this with all the huge ultras ACs around but its an easy option.

IS X-Pulse laser could just be longer range pulse lasers that generate more heat but that wouldn't be fun. I think it would be neat to have them have a different firing pattern from other energy weapons. Instead of having a burn time it deals a small bit of damage instantly and has a short cooldown before it fires again.
For example the X-small pulse deals 1.4 damage out to 150m for 1.4 heat and 1 second cooldown
the X-medium pulse laser could deal 1.7 damage out to 270m with 1.7 heat and have a cooldown of only 1 second.
The X-Large pulse deals 1.4 damage out to 450m for 2 heat and a cooldown of only 0.6 seconds.
They become a good precision weapon but to get the most damage out of them requires a lot of face time and they generate a lot of heat. It would give the IS a good pairing to go with their machine guns similar to how the clans have heavy lasers.

Hell even the IS MML could be done to add in as an IS version of the clans ATMs since the ATM is supposed to work by using three different ammo types so its most effective at any range. Since MWO doesn't have multiple ammo types it just deals varying damage depending on range. Couple issues I guess are that ATM used ATM ammo where as MML fire LRMs or SRMs not its own type of ammo so would PGI have to create MML ammo and then it probably wouldn't work with any stock loadouts. Could be done but probably shouldn't.

Edited by SirNotlag, 26 January 2021 - 04:36 PM.

[FupDup]

Willard Phule, on 26 January 2021 - 04:47 AM, said:

I'd much rather see Hyper Assault Gauss instead of anything protomech.

The Clans already have high-tonnage ballistics for your heavies and assaults to use.

For low tonnage the lowest they go is 5 tons (UAC/2 or CAC/2), which even then can still be costly for a smaller mech. The PAC/2 by comparison is just 3.5 tons, making it far more affordable and might actually allow more mechs to effectively use dakka (HAGs would be great for mechs that are already good with ballistics but would do nothing for mechs that can't really do ballistics very well).

[FupDup]

SirNotlag, on 26 January 2021 - 01:23 PM, said:

The clan AP gauss is an anti personnel weapon so being a super machine gun that generates a little heat would make sense. Like 1.5 damage per second out to an optimum 270 meters.

Making the APG function as a Machine Gun would make all forms of Clan MGs useless. It should instead be oriented around doing a chunk of damage upfront (maybe like a mini LB 3-X) in exchange for a slow rate of fire. IMO the Light MG should have higher DPS than the APG (and Magshot) or else the LMG would be rendered entirely useless (it's already kinda sucky as-is). Take MGs if you want DPS, take Maghot/AP Gauss if you want frontloaded damage.

SirNotlag, on 26 January 2021 - 01:23 PM, said:

IS X-Pulse laser could just be longer range pulse lasers that generate more heat but that wouldn't be fun. I think it would be neat to have them have a different firing pattern from other energy weapons. Instead of having a burn time it deals a small bit of damage instantly and has a short cooldown before it fires again.
For example the X-small pulse deals 1.4 damage out to 150m for 1.4 heat and 1 second cooldown
the X-medium pulse laser could deal 1.7 damage out to 270m with 1.7 heat and have a cooldown of only 1 second.
The X-Large pulse deals 1.4 damage out to 450m for 2 heat and a cooldown of only 0.6 seconds.
They become a good precision weapon but to get the most damage out of them requires a lot of face time and they generate a lot of heat. It would give the IS a good pairing to go with their machine guns similar to how the clans have heavy lasers.

Given that all regular IS pulses have boosted range, X-Pulse should also be boosted beyond their TT values. IMO they should actually shoot FURTHER than IS standard lasers, getting close to or matching Clan pulse range.

Edited by FupDup, 26 January 2021 - 03:23 PM.

[The pessimistic optimist]

FupDup, on 26 January 2021 - 03:17 PM, said:

Making the APG function as a Machine Gun would make all forms of Clan MGs useless. It should instead be oriented around doing a chunk of damage upfront (maybe like a mini LB 3-X) in exchange for a slow rate of fire. IMO the Light MG should have higher DPS than the APG (and Magshot) or else the LMG would be rendered entirely useless (it's already kinda sucky as-is). Take MGs if you want DPS, take Maghot/AP Gauss if you want frontloaded damage.



Given that all regular IS pulses have boosted range, X-Pulse should also be boosted beyond their TT values. IMO they should actually shoot FURTHER than IS standard lasers, getting close to or matching Clan pulse range.

Yea my idea add X pulse upgrade for IS pulse lasers high heat longer range pulse lasers for IS

Edited by SirSmokes, 26 January 2021 - 03:33 PM.

[LordNothing]

Aidan Crenshaw, on 26 January 2021 - 01:13 AM, said:

There's not so many (7 chassis, 13 variants total) light mechs with ballistic cooldown quirks. For MGs, there's ROF quirks.

unfortunately they seem to all be on mechs with <= 4 guns.

[LordNothing]

SirSmokes, on 26 January 2021 - 03:32 PM, said:

Yea my idea add X pulse upgrade for IS pulse lasers high heat longer range pulse lasers for IS

id rather that just be a new weapon. in the last weapon pack is didnt get any new lasers and clan didnt get any new ballistics. so hags+xpulse would be awesome, perhaps also include streak lrms and mmls for an all round weapons pack. with the exception of hags none of these would require retrofits.

Edited by LordNothing, 26 January 2021 - 05:10 PM.

[FupDup]

LordNothing, on 26 January 2021 - 04:46 PM, said:

id rather that just be a new weapon. in the last weapon pack is didnt get any new lasers and clan didnt get any new ballistics. so hags+xpulse would be awesome, perhaps also include streak lrms and mmls for an all round weapons pack.

What would Streak LRMs even do, home in on random hitboxes like Streak SRMs instead of center mass like normal LRMs? MWO's missile mechanics make the "Streak" system impossible to translate directly so you'd have to give them some other attribute like spread or tracking to distinguish them, which could easily lead to them being a pure upgrade over normal LRMs.

Streak LRMs (and Improved ATMs) should not make their way into MWO, IMO.

[LordNothing]

FupDup, on 26 January 2021 - 04:49 PM, said:

What would Streak LRMs even do, home in on random hitboxes like Streak SRMs instead of center mass like normal LRMs? MWO's missile mechanics make the "Streak" system impossible to translate directly so you'd have to give them some other attribute like spread or tracking to distinguish them, which could easily lead to them being a pure upgrade over normal LRMs.

Streak LRMs (and Improved ATMs) should not make their way into MWO, IMO.

i figured it would just be a source of novelty. i suppose we could do inferno srms or mech mortars instead.

Edited by LordNothing, 26 January 2021 - 05:18 PM.

[PocketYoda]

Did they nerf Machine guns at some point? Because when piranhas were released they seemed way more powerful than they do now.. I've noticed my machine guns seem to tickle Mechs these days..

No idea if its high ping times or just plain nerfs.

Edited by Samial, 26 January 2021 - 08:16 PM.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

LordNothing, on 26 January 2021 - 04:42 PM, said:

unfortunately they seem to all be on mechs with <= 4 guns.

Of course, if they had more, there would be no reason for a quirk.

Samial, on 26 January 2021 - 08:16 PM, said:

Did they nerf Machine guns at some point? Because when piranhas were released they seemed way more powerful than they do now.. I've noticed my machine guns seem to tickle Mechs these days..

No idea if its high ping times or just plain nerfs.

They did. The spread of Clan MGs was increased by a small increment at some point after the inception of the Piranha.

[The pessimistic optimist]

FupDup, on 26 January 2021 - 04:49 PM, said:

What would Streak LRMs even do, home in on random hitboxes like Streak SRMs instead of center mass like normal LRMs? MWO's missile mechanics make the "Streak" system impossible to translate directly so you'd have to give them some other attribute like spread or tracking to distinguish them, which could easily lead to them being a pure upgrade over normal LRMs.

Streak LRMs (and Improved ATMs) should not make their way into MWO, IMO.

Yea those would be hard to balance leave them out. I do want X pulse upgrade for IS lasers ultra hot but longer range IS pulse lasers. Too hot to boat but would be nice for build that only have few energy hard points

Edited by SirSmokes, 27 January 2021 - 01:22 AM.

[InvictusLee]

Phirannas, cheetas and shadow cats are great mg boats, and that one kingcrab with six hard points but tiny claws, i mean it wrecks but its wicked slow.

Just buy Kodaks and Madcat II's. They are actually great in both speed and dps despite the tonnage.

[LordNothing]

Willard Phule, on 26 January 2021 - 04:47 AM, said:

I'd much rather see Hyper Assault Gauss instead of anything protomech.

why not have both?

[The pessimistic optimist]

Love my3xAC 10 chatphract