71 replies to this topic

[D A T A]

First of all, this is not what the gulag asked, this is not what the community asked, this is just the brain fart of some PGI guy with zero understanding whatsoever of how the game goes.
We (the gulag) litterally did all the dirty job for you, for free, and our post on your community intel gather thread had an abnormous approval, way above everything ealse.
Litterally people with 20 times your competence and understanding of the game spent months in creating the most balanced possible version of this game, and you just picked it and threw it into the garbage.
Arrogance is a bad thing, arrogance + incompetence is a guaranteed ticket for a certain dawnfall.
Every real AAA game company hires top comp players to tell them what to do in terms of game balance, we did that for free, almost everyone agreed with us, and you just decided to put a random PGI guy with zero knowledge of the game to randomly smash buttons on the spreadsheet.




-Gauss was the most overnerfed weapon in the game, it needed a range buff, instead you ended up nerfing it even more: even with 17 damage and cooldown untouched at 5, it would barely be a decent gun. Cooldown nerf = garbage gun becoming even more garbage.
All you needed to do to gauss was a range increase and adapt Lgauss range accordingly.

Gauss can only be a sniping weapon, a sniping weapon needs range, a sniping weapon with no range is like a man with no di*k or a car with no engine

-Lgauss, needed a range increase to match with the gauss range increase, more damage and slower cooldown.

-HGAUSS WTF????!!!! heavygauss now has faster cooldown than regular gauss, did you put Mr Burns army of monkeys to digit these numbers??!!

-PPCs (all of them) they just needed less heat, that's it.
what you did means that:
All the mechs that did not have heat problems, like the ones that were going with 2 ppcs, are actually NERFED
All the mechs that were running 4 ppcs, cerppc, erppcs, and that were having heat problems, are buffed: their dps cap was not given by the cooldown value, but by the amout of heat per second that the DHS were able to dissipate: currently, on a madcat with 4cerppc, the potential full dps at 5 cooldown is way way above the maximum heat per second that those DHS can dissipate, so, on a big boat, the cooldown nerf DOES NOT DECREASE IT'S DPS, because it was unused anyways due to "too much heat" reasons, while the damage per heat buff DOES INCREASE THE DPS TOO. (this is true though only for good players that actually hit their shots)

In the end, the current meta, given by medpulse nascar fast mechs, was meta and remains meta. Cooldown to 7 just makes using ppcs way less forgiving if you miss a shot so for a pug, the current nascar brawl meta will become EVEN MORE META and the sniping stuff, that is currently overnerfed, becomes even more nerfed.

-Lasers: laser vomits were the **** things in this game, cerll, chll and cerml were the ones that needed the most buff, and got left there untouched.
as long as a ppc+dakka combo has the same alphastrike of a laser vomit combo, the laser vomit combo will be useless because the dakka ppc has more range, and more dps too.
Increasing the alpha of the dakka ppc combo will only make laser vomits (that needed a buff) even more ****.
why the hell should i take 2HLL+5cerml if i can do 2cerppc+2cuac10 (deathstrike) or 1cerppc+2ac10+2uac5 (mad cat b or 2cerppc+3uac5 (basp) and have same alpha, but more range, more dps and better damage per heat?

-Mrms changes, good

-masc changes meh, seems decent, but doing what the gulag told you to do would have been more balanced

-AC changes all good besides the ac20 one, that needed to be way higher


In the end, a mediocre patch where 30% is good, but addresses minor irrelevant problems, and 70% (the ppc part) barely does anything and does stuff in a wrong way that noone asked.
As for what really needed a buff, which was gauss and laser vomits, laser vomits were left untouched and gauss was NERFED AGAIN.
[redacted]
LET US HELP YOU FOR FREE FOR THE BENEFIT OF EVERYONE.

EDIT
-Ghost heat.
It is directly dependent from the base value of the heat.
A heat increase without a curve adaptation to compensate = post patch if you trigger ghost heat YOU WILL ******* EXPLODE ONCE AND FOR ALL

Edited by Ekson Valdez, 16 March 2021 - 06:28 AM.

[FupDup]

I disagree with buffing the range on regular Gauss because then the Light Gauss's own range advantage won't ever come into play in most matches, outside of very early potshots on Polar or Alpine. Range isn't something like damage where it's always useful to have more of it. There comes a point when more doesn't do much.

[The pessimistic optimist]

D A T A, on 15 March 2021 - 01:35 PM, said:

First of all, this is not what the gulag asked, this is not what the community asked, this is just the brain fart of some PGI guy with zero understanding whatsoever of how the game goes.
We (the gulag) litterally did all the dirty job for you, for free, and our post on your community intel gather thread had an abnormous approval, way above everything ealse.
Litterally people with 20 times your competence and understanding of the game spent months in creating the most balanced possible version of this game, and you just picked it and threw it into the garbage.
Arrogance is a bad thing, arrogance + incompetence is a guaranteed ticket for a certain dawnfall.
Every real AAA game company hires top comp players to tell them what to do in terms of game balance, we did that for free, almost everyone agreed with us, and you just decided to put a random PGI guy with zero knowledge of the game to randomly smash buttons on the spreadsheet.




-Gauss was the most overnerfed weapon in the game, it needed a range buff, instead you ended up nerfing it even more: even with 17 damage and cooldown untouched at 5, it would barely be a decent gun. Cooldown nerf = garbage gun becoming even more garbage.
All you needed to do to gauss was a range increase.

-Lgauss, needed a range increase to match with the gauss range increase, more damage and slower cooldown.

-PPCs (all of them) they just needed less heat, that's it.
what you did means that:
All the mechs that did not have heat problems, like the ones that were going with 2 ppcs, are actually NERFED
All the mechs that were running 4 ppcs, cerppc, erppcs, and that were having heat problems, are buffed: their dps cap was not given by the cooldown value, but by the amout of heat per second that the DHS were able to dissipate: currently, on a madcat with 4cerppc, the potential full dps at 5 cooldown is way way above the maximum heat per second that those DHS can dissipate, so, on a big boat, the cooldown nerf DOES NOT DECREASE IT'S DPS, because it was unused anyways due to "too much heat" reasons, while the damage per heat buff DOES INCREASE THE DPS TOO. (this is true though only for good players that actually hit their shots)

In the end, the current meta, given by medpulse nascar fast mechs, was meta and remains meta. Cooldown to 7 just makes using ppcs way less forgiving if you miss a shot so for a pug, the current nascar brawl meta will become EVEN MORE META and the sniping stuff, that is currently overnerfed, becomes even more nerfed.

-Lasers: laser vomits were the **** things in this game, cerll, chll and cerml were the ones that needed the most buff, and got left there untouched.
as long as a ppc+dakka combo has the same alphastrike of a laser vomit combo, the laser vomit combo will be useless because the dakka ppc has more range, and more dps too.
Increasing the alpha of the dakka ppc combo will only make laser vomits (that needed a buff) even more ****.
why the hell should i take 2HLL+5cerml if i can do 2cerppc+2cuac10 (deathstrike) or 1cerppc+2ac10+2uac5 (mad cat b or 2cerppc+3uac5 (basp) and have same alpha, but more range, more dps and better damage per heat?

-Mrms changes, good

-masc changes (finally thanks god a nerf to those ******* fleas that were bugging the hit reg by abusing the masc boost)

-AC changes all good besides the ac20 one, that needed to be way higher


In the end, a mediocre patch where 30% is good, but addresses minor irrelevant problems, and 70% (the ppc part) barely does anything and does stuff in a wrong way that noone asked.
As for what really needed a buff, which was gauss and laser vomits, laser vomits were left untouched and gauss was NERFED AGAIN.
I can really do a better job than the i**ot who did this patch, i can do that for free, and in way less time. You are litterally paying a guy to ruin you game and make all your community salty.
JUST GIVE UP, ADMIT YOUR INCOMPETENCE, AND LET US HELP YOU FOR FREE FOR THE BENEFIT OF EVERYONE.

I see the idea you are going for I want to try this out. What I said in the other topic good shots will like the changes and people using PPC as jack of all trade energy AC will not

Edited by SirSmokes, 15 March 2021 - 01:41 PM.

[SpartanShannon]

D A T A, on 15 March 2021 - 01:35 PM, said:

Arrogance is a bad thing, arrogance + incompetence is a guaranteed ticket for a certain dawnfall.

Mirror Mirror, on the wall...

Additional: Yikes

[R Valentine]

FupDup, on 15 March 2021 - 01:38 PM, said:

I disagree with buffing the range on regular Gauss because then the Light Gauss's own range advantage won't ever come into play in most matches, outside of very early potshots on Polar or Alpine. Range isn't something like damage where it's always useful to have more of it. There comes a point when more doesn't do much.

Gauss range is what keeps the weapon system down. It definitely needs more range. At 700M, you are inside of dakka range, only their DPS is better and their weapons fire on command. You have to charge, then deal with the screen shake, then fire, then retreat because of your long CD. The only thing that would give gauss an edge on dakka in certain situations is RANGE. But instead of doing that, PGI made worse every part of gauss rifles that was already bad. So now they're super bad. Welp, GG PGI. Guess the Nightgyr H will collect dust for 3 years until they get back around to nerfing gauss again.

[D A T A]

FupDup, on 15 March 2021 - 01:38 PM, said:

I disagree with buffing the range on regular Gauss because then the Light Gauss's own range advantage won't ever come into play in most matches, outside of very early potshots on Polar or Alpine. Range isn't something like damage where it's always useful to have more of it. There comes a point when more doesn't do much.

gauss can only be a sniping weapon, a siping weapon needs range, a sniping weapon with no range is like [redacted] a car with no engine

Edited by Ekson Valdez, 16 March 2021 - 06:52 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

D A T A, on 15 March 2021 - 01:47 PM, said:

a sniping weapon with no range is like [redacted] a car with no engine

Hahaha best simile of the day

Edited by Ekson Valdez, 16 March 2021 - 06:53 AM.
quote cleanup

[Nightbird]

Only disagree on the MASC change, accel boost was untouched so my flea will be humping legs just fine (still dumb mechanic but w/e at this point)

[Gas Guzzler]

FupDup, on 15 March 2021 - 01:38 PM, said:

I disagree with buffing the range on regular Gauss because then the Light Gauss's own range advantage won't ever come into play in most matches, outside of very early potshots on Polar or Alpine. Range isn't something like damage where it's always useful to have more of it. There comes a point when more doesn't do much.

I actually agree with the OP, because currently Gauss range is well within the range of being
AC2'd, and the rest of dakka still hurts at that range. I think it should reach out further for reasons that have already been stated in this thread.

[Skulligan]

Would probably be a smart idea for them to delay this patch until they can get some things ironed out.

[FupDup]

D A T A, on 15 March 2021 - 01:47 PM, said:

gauss can only be a sniping weapon, a siping weapon needs range, a sniping weapon with no range is like a man with no di*k or a car with no engine

I'm talking about Light Gauss vs. regular Gauss. Light Gauss needs to have more range than regular Gauss, but if regular Gauss shoots too far then the Light Gauss cannot use its range advantage over the regular Gauss and thus it would just be a crappier gun in every way other than tonnage.

[Gas Guzzler]

FupDup, on 15 March 2021 - 01:56 PM, said:

I'm talking about Light Gauss vs. regular Gauss. Light Gauss needs to have more range than regular Gauss, but if regular Gauss shoots too far then the Light Gauss cannot use its range advantage over the regular Gauss and thus it would just be a crappier gun in every way other than tonnage.

Well the additional velocity helps, and there is plenty of times I can hit people at 1200 meters if my weapons could....

[morosis]

D A T A, on 15 March 2021 - 01:35 PM, said:

First of all, this is not what the gulag asked, this is not what the community asked.
We (the gulag) litterally did all the dirty job for you, for free, and our post on your community intel gather thread had an abnormous approval, way above everything ealse.
Litterally people with 20 times your competence and understanding of the game spent months in creating the most balanced possible version of this game, and you just picked it and threw it into the garbage.

my problem with the patch really starts and ends here. this was supposed to be a community-driven patch, and it isn't. i would rather have had mediocre changes in the right direction, in concert with community desires for a better game experience, than just seemingly random changes that nobody asked for (again).

the biggest failure here isnt the changes, its that PGI promised they would listen, and clearly they did not listen.

[D A T A]

FupDup, on 15 March 2021 - 01:56 PM, said:

I'm talking about Light Gauss vs. regular Gauss. Light Gauss needs to have more range than regular Gauss, but if regular Gauss shoots too far then the Light Gauss cannot use its range advantage over the regular Gauss and thus it would just be a crappier gun in every way other than tonnage.

on faction play and comp, there are a lot of places to go where you actually shoot at 1400-1600 but have visual till 2500 meters

range is never too much

[The Lobsters]

Savage Elf, on 15 March 2021 - 01:41 PM, said:

Mirror Mirror, on the wall...

Additional: Yikes

Indeed.

Also, top players have a tendency to balance to entrench a status quo that they play the best at, and miss opportunities to break it. See TheMittani/Goonswarm's bleats about nullsec changes in Eve Online a few years back.

There's a lot of negativity at the top of this page. I'm not that surprised PGI haven't bought it.

[LordBraxton]

This patch sucks. I agree on all accounts except MASC. One again they fix one problem but ignore what its doing to other chassis. Namely the Assaults with MASC, who are already unpopular, just got absolutely **** on by this change.

[Sjorpha]

Agreed, stop winging it and just accept the help that some of the top players are trying to offer you. It's a no brainer really.

[dario03]

The Lobsters, on 15 March 2021 - 03:08 PM, said:

Indeed.

Also, top players have a tendency to balance to entrench a status quo that they play the best at, and miss opportunities to break it. See TheMittani/Goonswarm's bleats about nullsec changes in Eve Online a few years back.

There's a lot of negativity at the top of this page. I'm not that surprised PGI haven't bought it.

You don't need to compare another groups balance proposals for another game. You can see a ton of info on the Gulag proposal here
MWO: Forums - Intel Gathering: Weapons Balance Pass 1 (mwomercs.com)

The largest weapon changes are on weapons that are barely used in comp.

[Stonefalcon]

All these PPC and Gauss changes have achieved is the return of the poptartocalypse. Oh and the fact that 3 PPCs can now headshot any mech, last I checked my AWS-8Q has 6 PPCs, in the hands of a 1% pilot this mech can now kill 2 mechs every 6 seconds. Congrats on reducing TTK Chris.

[East Indy]

Sjorpha, on 15 March 2021 - 03:22 PM, said:

winging it

This is what gets me. Out of left field, like, too-clever-for-you stuff. Can't revise, gotta redesign.