117 replies to this topic

[HammerMaster]

I love presents I didn't ask for.
LRMs. Situational. Feast or famine.
SSRMs. Also situational. Also screwed by no dead fire coding by our inept overlords.
Am I against this? Yes.
Can they roll back a roll back while we rollback? Doubtful.

[Pillowseller]

It's hard to believe any Cauldron member seriously views SSRM as a better performing weapon than UAC10 or MPL.

I guess this straight nerf is based on principle rather than balance, telling us that crutch/side wheel weapons should not have any real place in game and we should ditch them as soon as possible.

I'm fine with this and somewhat agree. But if this is the case, they should be open about it and mention in their design philosophy.

Edited by Pillowseller, 07 April 2021 - 02:35 PM.

[dario03]

Escef, on 07 April 2021 - 02:20 PM, said:

I have personally witnessed, on multiple occasions, a Locust, a mother-eating Locust, facetank a full spread of 36 Streaks from a Mad Dog and run away. Now, a more robust light like a Firestarter or Arctic Cheetah? Depending on how the RNG treats you and how armor has been allocated, they can actually tank 2 such volleys without any torso armor breeches (they'll still be heavily damaged, though). If you are going to tell me that those mechs can't tank smaller volleys without armor breeches to the torsos than I have to wonder what numbers you are using. On top of this, with Streak damage going down for clan mechs, I don't see a clan streak boat as anything other than a harasser build going forward.

As for shooting them in the butt, well, yeah, a good solid hit from over 18 tons of weapon systems to the hindquarters has every right to gut a light mech. Are you going to tell me a HPPC+PPC, 3xSnPPC, or a double tap from a UAC20 to the bum-bum shouldn't one-shot a light?

Depending on the light and build some would survive that. Not many would survive a non spread double tap of uac20 to just the rct, but hppc+ppc is only 29dmg and was only 25dmg before and soon will be again.

[Remover of Obstacles]

Go to the testing grounds.

Commando still alive after four salvos of four SSRM6s from point blank range.

First three only got through arm armor, not torso or leg armor.

Edited by Remover of Obstacles, 07 April 2021 - 03:08 PM.

[Razorfish]

I didn’t watch the April Dev Vlog, I read the article and as I did I thought the same thing over and over.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

This is yet another nerf to SSRMs to help light mechs.

End of story.

[Remover of Obstacles]

Pillowseller, on 07 April 2021 - 02:31 PM, said:

It's hard to believe any Cauldron member seriously views SSRM as a better performing weapon than UAC10 or MPL.

I guess this straight nerf is based on principle rather than balance, telling us that crutch/side wheel weapons should not have any real place in game and we should ditch them as soon as possible.

I'm fine with this and somewhat agree. But if this is the case, they should be open about it and mention in their design philosophy.

Chalk this up to "Learn how to shoot noobs"?

Haven't they made getting and keeping a lock painful enough?

[HammerMaster]

I think these guys have not been trolled by stealth locusts enough which are too small (scale way off) and nigh invisible on dark maps. Stop trying to help lights by buffing their power over heavies and assaults. What should happen is meds and lights should have a hard % of 80% of queue. With a 10 to 1 "ticket" if you want a heavy. Etc. Rock paper flea is garbage. Heavy/assault % to med/light % has been skewed since jump and THAT is the root of this evil. </p>
I'm also sensing this community runs stealth a lot.

Edited by HammerMaster, 07 April 2021 - 03:25 PM.

[DUMAR]

Never liked SSRM always preferred SRM. Sure they smash lighter mechs because there armor just can't take missises that do that much damage per missiles. But you can still hit lights with SRM with practice and SSRM always feel kind of weak vs heavier mechs

Edited by DUMAR, 08 April 2021 - 08:33 AM.

[Escef]

dario03, on 07 April 2021 - 02:36 PM, said:

Depending on the light and build some would survive that. Not many would survive a non spread double tap of uac20 to just the rct, but hppc+ppc is only 29dmg and was only 25dmg before and soon will be again.

Once you factor in quirks and toughness skills, you're right, a lot of the higher end lights actually could butt-tank some of those hits. I admit, I'm prone to overlooking those complicating factors, which will sometimes skew my analysis a bit.

[Kroete]

They said they will make all weapons near even,
they said they will buff, not nerf,
they said there is no agenda,
they said its not only for the compplayers,
...

[The6thMessenger]

Razorfish, on 07 April 2021 - 03:09 PM, said:

I didn’t watch the April Dev Vlog, I read the article and as I did I thought the same thing over and over.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

This is yet another nerf to SSRMs to help light mechs.

End of story.

Eh well, any weapon is an anti-light considering their paper-thin armor. Problem is that many of those lights heavily rely on speed and size for sustainability that there's skewed effectiveness with homing weapons that nullifies those, and that's why they are the bad guys. It's like Wreck-It Ralph at this point.

I'd rather they just make lights bigger and give them more armor and structure. It pushes towards normalization with weapon effectiveness.

[Remover of Obstacles]

The6thMessenger, on 07 April 2021 - 05:01 PM, said:

Eh well, any weapon is an anti-light considering their paper-thin armor.....

I'd rather they just make lights bigger and give them more armor and structure. It pushes towards normalization with weapon effectiveness.

The lights that get punished by streaks are the ones with locked engines/low engine caps (except those bringing multiple AMS). Maybe every light should be able to equip an AMS.

The lights that can do 148 kph before MASC and have stealth probably still wouldn't bring AMS.

[FupDup]

Remover of Obstacles, on 07 April 2021 - 05:22 PM, said:

The lights that get punished by streaks are the ones with locked engines/low engine caps (except those bringing multiple AMS). Maybe every light should be able to equip an AMS.

The lights that can do 148 kph before MASC and have stealth probably still wouldn't bring AMS.

Every light can equip AMS, but it requires a rather noticeable downgrade to your loadout because of how precious tonnage is on light mechs.

[pattonesque]

for what it's worth there has been a lot of discussion about streaks and how to balance them correctly on the mwocomp discord. this isn't a settled issue by any means

[PocketYoda]

From what i've read of this Cauldron patch i think a lot of them are light pilots so nerfing streaks seems to be an agenda thing as they are bias.. obviously.

Luckily if you can aim srms are better.

DUMAR, on 07 April 2021 - 03:25 PM, said:

Never liked SSRM always preferred SRM. Sure they smash lighter mechs because there armor just can't take missises that do that much damage per missiles. But you can still hit light with SRM with practice and SSRM always feel kind of weak very heavier mechs

Ssrms are terrible, you need tag as well to actually hit any thing with them and if multiple lights turn up with ecm you are screwed.. Srms just need to aim and fire and you are done..

Srm4-6s are ok on assaults if you chain fire a lot.. I prefer 4s as they have a tighter spread.

Edited by Samial, 07 April 2021 - 07:57 PM.

[Dogstar]

What we need for SSRMs is to fire them in the general direction of a mech and they lock on automatically during flight! Obviously they should prioritise targeted mechs over lighter mechs over heavier if you fire at a bunch of mechs but being able to spray them wildly would make up for their terrible weight and hit distribution.

[Remover of Obstacles]

FupDup, on 07 April 2021 - 05:24 PM, said:

Every light can equip AMS, but it requires a rather noticeable downgrade to your loadout because of how precious tonnage is on light mechs.

Many (24?) clan omni lights do not come with AMS hardpoints included.

To be fair, you can buy omnipods from other variants to gain the ability to use AMS.
It is not reasonable to assume a new player would know this and it breaks any set of eight quirks.

[Remover of Obstacles]

Samial, on 07 April 2021 - 07:51 PM, said:

Luckily if you can aim srms are better.

Ssrms are terrible, you need tag as well to actually hit any thing with them and if multiple lights turn up with ecm you are screwed.. Srms just need to aim and fire and you are done..

I think most people agree that the fastest way to kill a light (outside of one shot projectiles) is using IS MPL or IS SRMs. Get artemis or some spread quirks and you can leg or kill lights fast. You can even do 4x SRM6s without triggering the ghost heat penalty unlike 4xSSRM4/6s (+3 heat).

Edited by Remover of Obstacles, 08 April 2021 - 03:55 AM.

[John Bronco]

Razorfish, on 07 April 2021 - 03:09 PM, said:

I didn’t watch the April Dev Vlog, I read the article and as I did I thought the same thing over and over.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

They are doing this to help light mechs.

This is yet another nerf to SSRMs to help light mechs.

End of story.

Makes perfect sense to me to adjust a weapon that is very strong against only a single class.

Lights are already the worst class in the game and boated streaks can easily one shot them.

One shot mechanics are neither fun nor balanced, hence the adjustment.

If you bring a streak boat into a game with the sole intent of finding the one light on the enemy team and blapping them, as I know some of the participants in this thread often do, you may have to put a bit more effort in for that easy kill. Earn it.

[Ignatius Audene]

I dont want this to be a git gut, auto aim op what ever discussion.
I can fully understand, that they want to nerv streaks vs lights! So i am not even arguing the clan changes, since there are buffs in return to change the weapon role (I dont even argue if the changes reach the goal).
Only IS Streaks, which are already not such a big problem for lights, a plain cooldown nerv, with no adjustment makes 0 sense.

I hoped for answer of data( or any one in gulag) about the reasoning.

Edited by Ignatius Audene, 08 April 2021 - 05:39 AM.