10 replies to this topic

[JC Daxion]

Can someone explain to me a couple of things i found during some resent testing but i wonder if there is more to it.

First off, it looks like mrm 10's fire in a single tight cluster like SRM's Is this correct?

Some mechs i have when i load mrm's i only see 10 tube, though other mechs i see 20 tubes like on the misery Will these launchers work the same despite the number of tubes? If so is it because they fire in a second wave? It's hard to see how a 20 in a 10 tube vrs 20 tube slot works, mainly it's hard to find a mech that has that set up.

Larger atm's seam to fire more like the lrm launchers in the stagger but the ATM3's look to be about the same time, again more like an SRM flight than the streams.


I'm mainly interested in how the mrms work/fire with the different launcher sizes though. If anyone an shed some light on this id appreciate it.

[SafeScanner]

mechs have a hardpoint limit for amount of missle tubes that can be put on so for example a locust can mount a 10/15 lrm but its limit is 5 tubes so the lrm will burst 2/3 times until it is empty and reload

Mrm's are not as tight as srms but thats just the scatter range over distance (500m vs 120m) think of range vs damage

i can't really help with Clan atm's but i think they are meant to fire in steams/bursts and distance affects damage

[ScrapIron Prime]

SafeScanner, on 26 September 2021 - 06:57 PM, said:

mechs have a hardpoint limit for amount of missle tubes that can be put on so for example a locust can mount a 10/15 lrm but its limit is 5 tubes so the lrm will burst 2/3 times until it is empty and reload

Which was really funny back in the day when the Raven was first released. The left arm has a NARC missile, which only fires 1 missile, so the developers set the number of tubes on the arm to one. If you put an LRM 10 on the arm, it would indeed fire 10 missiles... one missile at a time. The launcher was about ready to fire again when the last one cleared the tube!

[MyriadDigits]

JC Daxion, on 26 September 2021 - 06:36 PM, said:

Can someone explain to me a couple of things i found during some resent testing but i wonder if there is more to it.

First off, it looks like mrm 10's fire in a single tight cluster like SRM's Is this correct?

Some mechs i have when i load mrm's i only see 10 tube, though other mechs i see 20 tubes like on the misery Will these launchers work the same despite the number of tubes? If so is it because they fire in a second wave? It's hard to see how a 20 in a 10 tube vrs 20 tube slot works, mainly it's hard to find a mech that has that set up.

Larger atm's seam to fire more like the lrm launchers in the stagger but the ATM3's look to be about the same time, again more like an SRM flight than the streams.


I'm mainly interested in how the mrms work/fire with the different launcher sizes though. If anyone an shed some light on this id appreciate it.

MRMs, cLRM, and ATMs are all stagger fire. MRM10s only appear to be volley fire because the volley duration is incredibly short, quite literally a quarter of the volley duration of an MRM40 as the volley duration of MRMs scales linearly with the tube count of the launcher.

As has been said by others though, some mechs are actually limited by the tubes available on the hardpoint, which can force a missile launcher that wouldn't normally stagger fire to stagger fire. AFAIK though this doesn't really effect launchers that already stagger fire in any tangible way if at all.

[caravann]

MRM 10 has less spreading but the MRM40 streaming for longer since there are few tubes who can hold 40

The funny thing about MRM40 is that it can be used to scatter fire because of the delayed shots.

Mrm has no delayed shots. SRMs spreading beyond SRM2. They occupy center iron sight where each missile increase the size of the shot. MRM doesn't work the same way since many tubes can not hold all. MRM40 become a MRM10 shooting 4 times. MRM20 has a good value as it can occupy LRM20 tubes but MRM40 and MRM10 has best tonnage.

The reason why MRM used is because it work like a long range SRM

[Curccu]

caravann, on 26 September 2021 - 11:20 PM, said:

MRM 10 has less spreading but the MRM40 streaming for longer since there are few tubes who can hold 40

The funny thing about MRM40 is that it can be used to scatter fire because of the delayed shots.

Mrm has no delayed shots. SRMs spreading beyond SRM2. They occupy center iron sight where each missile increase the size of the shot. MRM doesn't work the same way since many tubes can not hold all. MRM40 become a MRM10 shooting 4 times. MRM20 has a good value as it can occupy LRM20 tubes but MRM40 and MRM10 has best tonnage.

The reason why MRM used is because it work like a long range SRM

The Inner Sphere now has access to Medium Range Missiles; an entirely new Missile Weapon type unique to the Inner Sphere.
These are unguided, low-damage Missiles catered to medium-range engagements. Unlike SRMs and LRMs, MRM firing patterns act as a 'stream' of Missiles, rather than a single volley of clustered Missiles.


https://mwomercs.com...26-18-jul-2017/

Has nothing to do with launcher tubes... weapon is designed to shoot x amount of missiles in some time, bigger launcher = longer stream.

Edited by Curccu, 27 September 2021 - 02:40 AM.

[caravann]

Curccu, on 27 September 2021 - 02:40 AM, said:

The Inner Sphere now has access to Medium Range Missiles; an entirely new Missile Weapon type unique to the Inner Sphere.
These are unguided, low-damage Missiles catered to medium-range engagements. Unlike SRMs and LRMs, MRM firing patterns act as a 'stream' of Missiles, rather than a single volley of clustered Missiles.


https://mwomercs.com...26-18-jul-2017/

Has nothing to do with launcher tubes... weapon is designed to shoot x amount of missiles in some time, bigger launcher = longer stream.

Maybe in textbook but in the game many tubes increase the spreading, and few reduce the streaming.

Many tubes remove the streaming from missiles and make them hit all at once.

Many tubes is a bad effect in close range because the missiles need to occupy one spot.

A SRM 6 who has to shoot each missile one at a time will hit a single hitbox.
2 missiles will be shot at once and occupy larger amount of space. Chain fire can help with this but is usually only for SRMs.

MRMs are easier in this way that they do not stream like it says in the textbooks. They shoot and hit in a short amount of time like an SRM 6

[Curccu]

caravann, on 27 September 2021 - 04:19 AM, said:

MRMs are easier in this way that they do not stream like it says in the textbooks. They shoot and hit in a short amount of time like an SRM 6

What you mean they don't stream? It literally says they stream in the quote I posted earlier.

[MyriadDigits]

caravann, on 26 September 2021 - 11:20 PM, said:

MRM 10 has less spreading but the MRM40 streaming for longer since there are few tubes who can hold 40

The funny thing about MRM40 is that it can be used to scatter fire because of the delayed shots.

Mrm has no delayed shots. SRMs spreading beyond SRM2. They occupy center iron sight where each missile increase the size of the shot. MRM doesn't work the same way since many tubes can not hold all. MRM40 become a MRM10 shooting 4 times. MRM20 has a good value as it can occupy LRM20 tubes but MRM40 and MRM10 has best tonnage.

The reason why MRM used is because it work like a long range SRM

caravann, on 27 September 2021 - 04:19 AM, said:

Maybe in textbook but in the game many tubes increase the spreading, and few reduce the streaming.

Many tubes remove the streaming from missiles and make them hit all at once.

Many tubes is a bad effect in close range because the missiles need to occupy one spot.

A SRM 6 who has to shoot each missile one at a time will hit a single hitbox.
2 missiles will be shot at once and occupy larger amount of space. Chain fire can help with this but is usually only for SRMs.

MRMs are easier in this way that they do not stream like it says in the textbooks. They shoot and hit in a short amount of time like an SRM 6

Smaller launchers, be they SRM, MRM, ATM, or LRM, have less spread than their larger counterparts because their spread stat is a bigger number, and nothing more. Its also worth mentioning that the missile spread stat is more of a "formation size" stat. Regardless of tube locations or distance, the missiles will always fly into a formation of that size, and then fly straight ahead. This does mean hardpoint spread/tube spread can have an effect how how well the damage is focused but only at really close, practically face-hugging ranges before the missiles have a chance to get in formation.

Also, missiles don't have any sort of interactions with missiles from another launcher. Firing 3SRM2 at the same time will not artificially bloat the spread in any way. Chainfiring 3SRM2 is objectively worse than firing them all at once, and is very likely worse than firing a single SRM6 since an enemy could twist or even simply walk over uneven terrain and spoil your aim while chainfiring.

Streaming missile launchers like MRMs simply don't care about tube count. And yes, they are streaming missiles, as can be seen by the "Volley Delay" and "Duration" numbers they have filled out in Cauldron's patch table, as well as the quote from 2017 saying as much when the weapon was introduced. Its also worth noting here that MRM10 only appears to be frontloaded like an SRM because the Volley Delay is 0.0128, which for firing 10 missiles means it takes about one-eighth of a second to fire the whole volley. MRM40, since it has the same Volley Delay, takes just over half a second to fire all its missiles.

Last thing to say, we aren't talking about "textbooks" or whatever. We're talking patch notes, or other manner of communication either directly from the developers themselves, or the group that is currently advising the developers on balance decisions.

[VeeOt Dragon]

yeah MRMs are supposed to stream out. they did a a buff to them not to long ago that decreased the time it takes for the launcher to fully unload its payload. they used to have stream time almost as long as clan LRMs, made them a pain to keep on target for the full duration of the MRM-40.

[Verilligo]

caravann, on 27 September 2021 - 04:19 AM, said:

Maybe in textbook but in the game many tubes increase the spreading, and few reduce the streaming.

Many tubes remove the streaming from missiles and make them hit all at once.

Many tubes is a bad effect in close range because the missiles need to occupy one spot.

A SRM 6 who has to shoot each missile one at a time will hit a single hitbox.
2 missiles will be shot at once and occupy larger amount of space. Chain fire can help with this but is usually only for SRMs.

MRMs are easier in this way that they do not stream like it says in the textbooks. They shoot and hit in a short amount of time like an SRM 6

Tubes used to matter in terms of having an impact on how missiles worked. As far as I am aware, that is no longer the case. Tube count is purely cosmetic, other than a larger launcher might increase the size of the geometry used to represent it. Now where those tubes are positioned on the mech might matter to "spread" in the sense that two launchers closer together on a mech will have better convergence with each other, but those two terms should not be confused for one another.