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Light Mechs Are ****


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#21 martian

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Posted 01 December 2021 - 09:23 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 01 December 2021 - 04:40 AM, said:

You missed the most important one OP..

Light mechs are too small.


Do you really think that making light 'Mechs much bigger (while keeping their low armor protection) would attract more MWO players to play them?

#22 pbiggz

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Posted 01 December 2021 - 10:17 AM

View Postmartian, on 01 December 2021 - 09:23 AM, said:


Do you really think that making light 'Mechs much bigger (while keeping their low armor protection) would attract more MWO players to play them?


He doesn't. That's the point, he just won't admit it.

#23 martian

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Posted 01 December 2021 - 11:42 AM

View Postpbiggz, on 01 December 2021 - 10:17 AM, said:

He doesn't. That's the point, he just won't admit it.

I guess that you are right.

#24 Duke Falcon

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Posted 01 December 2021 - 11:49 AM

Just a sidenote for the OP's options: There is enough...
So, when you say:

Quote

You missed the most important one OP..

Light mechs are too small.

No, I never miss. Except all my second shots but that's just not count as lights!
Wow, today MRMd two lights into oblivion... F*****g hard to hit them!

Errr I mean, option 9...
Wait!
No, just left it dead and cold...

#25 PocketYoda

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Posted 02 December 2021 - 05:15 AM

View Postmartian, on 01 December 2021 - 09:23 AM, said:


Do you really think that making light 'Mechs much bigger (while keeping their low armor protection) would attract more MWO players to play them?


Yes people would play them no matter what.. And people would still be just as good with them.

#26 Storming Angel

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Posted 02 December 2021 - 05:28 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 02 December 2021 - 05:15 AM, said:

Yes people would play them no matter what.. And people would still be just as good with them.

If they are that good then you should play them more to pad yer stats.

#27 Teenage Mutant Ninja Urbie

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Posted 02 December 2021 - 05:42 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 02 December 2021 - 05:15 AM, said:

Yes people would play them no matter what.. And people would still be just as good with them.


by all means:

put your money where your mouth is and play a Jenner, JennyIIC or Osiris of your choice*, optimised to the teeth or whatever
-and roll everyone else with that thing for the next 4 weeks. then you have public data for everybody to see in jarls, so we all can finally figure out just how OP those frikkin lights are.

otherwise maybe you should change your record, it sounds kinda broken at this point.




*specifically those because of size; or: to hell with it. just impress us with the meanest most broken light you can think of..........

Edited by Teenage Mutant Ninja Urbie, 02 December 2021 - 05:46 AM.


#28 martian

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Posted 02 December 2021 - 06:19 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 02 December 2021 - 05:15 AM, said:

Yes people would play them no matter what.

So do really think that players would be happy with buying and running a lightweight 'Mech (20-35 tons) that would be as big as Assault 'Mech, but armed with five medium lasers and 280 points of armor?


View PostMechaGnome, on 02 December 2021 - 05:15 AM, said:

And people would still be just as good with them.

If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why do they often end the game with the low Match Score?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why is not the queue full of light 'Mechs?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why are both teams often composed of heavy and medium 'Mechs, with one or two token light 'Mechs on both sides?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why am I seeing top players in Blood Asps, Mad Cat Mk. II or Night Gyrs and not in Panthers, Jenners or Cougars?


View PostMechaGnome, on 25 October 2021 - 06:12 AM, said:

I enjoy the slower lights myself Adder, Kitfox and Urbies even Wolfhounds and Panthers somewhat etc.. I just do not have the ping time for fast lights.. i die far too fast..

How often do you actually play your light 'Mechs to test your theory that light 'Mechs are so powerful and easy to play?

#29 ThreeStooges

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Posted 02 December 2021 - 02:42 PM

View PostTeenage Mutant Ninja Urbie, on 02 December 2021 - 05:42 AM, said:


by all means:

put your money where your mouth is and play a Jenner, JennyIIC or Osiris of your choice*, optimised to the teeth or whatever
-and roll everyone else with that thing for the next 4 weeks. then you have public data for everybody to see in jarls, so we all can finally figure out just how OP those frikkin lights are.

otherwise maybe you should change your record, it sounds kinda broken at this point.




*specifically those because of size; or: to hell with it. just impress us with the meanest most broken light you can think of..........


I second this very much. Jenners use to be the de facto light mech even when the commando was added and nearly broke the game with its speed. Jenners are just such trash now even if you made it the only light mech with all 240 or 250 nodes enabled it would still suck balls compared to its closed beta greatness. Then the 20ts came along and replaced most the 35ts bar the 3l with its ecm/stealth.

While I still randomly use my d,f, and oxide they are mostly used as a novelty run on the off chance someone will freak out at seeing such a rare mech they won't shoot it while taking an alpha from it and then one-shot it since the jenners' all have such anemic alphas now. The 3l remains my most used light due to the ecm/stealth. The rest are whenever I feel like derping around.

I got the three main lcts of pb,1e and 3s so they fill the zoom and pew more so than the Jenners use to.

#30 pbiggz

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Posted 02 December 2021 - 03:56 PM

View PostThreeStooges, on 02 December 2021 - 02:42 PM, said:

I second this very much. Jenners use to be the de facto light mech even when the commando was added and nearly broke the game with its speed. Jenners are just such trash now even if you made it the only light mech with all 240 or 250 nodes enabled it would still suck balls compared to its closed beta greatness. Then the 20ts came along and replaced most the 35ts bar the 3l with its ecm/stealth.

While I still randomly use my d,f, and oxide they are mostly used as a novelty run on the off chance someone will freak out at seeing such a rare mech they won't shoot it while taking an alpha from it and then one-shot it since the jenners' all have such anemic alphas now. The 3l remains my most used light due to the ecm/stealth. The rest are whenever I feel like derping around.

I got the three main lcts of pb,1e and 3s so they fill the zoom and pew more so than the Jenners use to.


Its not really true that the 20 tonners replaced the 35 tonners. Some of the 35 tonners are a bit big, but the properly quirked ones are quite formidable. Don't underestimate them.

#31 PocketYoda

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Posted 03 December 2021 - 03:59 AM

View PostTeenage Mutant Ninja Urbie, on 02 December 2021 - 05:42 AM, said:


by all means:

put your money where your mouth is and play a Jenner, JennyIIC or Osiris of your choice*, optimised to the teeth or whatever
-and roll everyone else with that thing for the next 4 weeks. then you have public data for everybody to see in jarls, so we all can finally figure out just how OP those frikkin lights are.

otherwise maybe you should change your record, it sounds kinda broken at this point.




*specifically those because of size; or: to hell with it. just impress us with the meanest most broken light you can think of..........


I don't own any Jenner IIC although i was considering the hero.

#32 PocketYoda

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Posted 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM

View Postmartian, on 02 December 2021 - 06:19 AM, said:

So do really think that players would be happy with buying and running a lightweight 'Mech (20-35 tons) that would be as big as Assault 'Mech, but armed with five medium lasers and 280 points of armor?



If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why do they often end the game with the low Match Score?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why is not the queue full of light 'Mechs?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why are both teams often composed of heavy and medium 'Mechs, with one or two token light 'Mechs on both sides?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP, why am I seeing top players in Blood Asps, Mad Cat Mk. II or Night Gyrs and not in Panthers, Jenners or Cougars?



How often do you actually play your light 'Mechs to test your theory that light 'Mechs are so powerful and easy to play?


Because they play them wrong off "Scouting" to get killed..
Lights were never as big as Assaults in tabletop, They are still smaller than most mediums.
Because big numbers are what this game forces on players and Assaults are the king of big numbers..not team play.
Lights can get the same as mediums and some heavies and Assaults.
Again because this game is mainly solo play lights work best in packs more so than any other mechs..

I play light mechs a lot but not the flimsy ones. I enjoy light mechs a lot just if i need Cbills Assaults do it best.

Edited by MechaGnome, 03 December 2021 - 04:06 AM.


#33 Brauer

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Posted 03 December 2021 - 04:10 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:


Because they play them wrong off "Scouting" to get killed..
Lights were never as big as Assaults in tabletop, They are still smaller than most mediums.
Because big numbers are what this game forces on players and Assaults are the king of big numbers..not team play.
Lights can get the same as mediums and some heavies and Assaults.
Again because this game is mainly solo play lights work best in packs more so than any other mechs..

I play light mechs a lot but not the flimsy ones. I enjoy light mechs a lot just if i need Cbills Assaults do it best.


You claim to play light mechs a lot but there is publicly available data that clearly shows this is incorrect. Not a good look.

Edited by Brauer, 03 December 2021 - 04:11 AM.


#34 martian

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Posted 03 December 2021 - 05:52 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

Because they play them wrong off "Scouting" to get killed..

If Lights are so good, is it even possible to have bad results when piloting them, with all those advantages like "super speed, super damage, un hit able" ?


View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

Lights were never as big as Assaults in tabletop

And yet in MWO you want to make them 2-3 times bigger than they are, i.e. as big as Assault 'Mechs (if not even bigger).


View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

They are still smaller than most mediums.

They are also less armed and less protected than most Mediums.


View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

Because big numbers are what this game forces on players and Assaults are the king of big numbers..not team play.

You described light 'Mechs as the best class of 'Mechs in the game:"they are like miniature gods among mechs? super speed, super damage, un hit able! always the last to die.."


View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

Lights can get the same as mediums and some heavies and Assaults.

So they will be as big as Assault 'Mech, while having only a fraction of Assault 'Mech's firepower and armor? Seriously?


View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

Again because this game is mainly solo play lights work best in packs more so than any other mechs..

But you said that "i know they are so powerful.."

So make up your mind, please. Either they are "so powerful" as Assault 'Mechs or even stronger,
or they are weaker, so they "work best in packs more so than any other mechs.." in order to be successful.


View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

I play light mechs a lot but not the flimsy ones.

Pardon my boldness, but it seems to me that you have not spent too much time piloting light 'Mechs during the last few months.


View PostMechaGnome, on 03 December 2021 - 04:03 AM, said:

I enjoy light mechs a lot just if i need Cbills Assaults do it best.

Why?

As you said, "[light 'Mechs] are like miniature gods among mechs? super speed, super damage, un hit able! always the last to die.."

Just use your light 'Mechs to dish out that "super damage" game after game and you are golden.

Edited by martian, 03 December 2021 - 05:53 AM.


#35 Curccu

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Posted 03 December 2021 - 06:39 AM

View PostBrauer, on 03 December 2021 - 04:10 AM, said:

You claim to play light mechs a lot but there is publicly available data that clearly shows this is incorrect. Not a good look.


Are you claiming that 37 games in lights mechs for whole MWO career isn't a lot?
it can be a bit higher in reality but not a lot.

#36 Brauer

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Posted 03 December 2021 - 09:16 AM

View PostCurccu, on 03 December 2021 - 06:39 AM, said:


Are you claiming that 37 games in lights mechs for whole MWO career isn't a lot?
it can be a bit higher in reality but not a lot.


With 1900+ drops in lights in QP alone (more in FW and lobbies) a DD in light matches played, as well as single digit percentage of matches played, isn't impressing me, even if 37 matches or so feels like a lot to MG. :)

#37 Duke Falcon

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Posted 03 December 2021 - 10:37 AM

When I start this topic and created the "whine" and answer options I not thought thinks would head soooo far...

But I start to see some MWO vs TT misconcept here about the light mechs and the so called (yet epic failed) "metric scale".
In TT lights are not dwarfs with guns but have some dimensions. In MWO lights are, well, small usually albeit some are badly shrunken. I mean the light omnis should be bigger a bit because of, you know, plenty of internal place not filled all the times but ready to accept installed modules. It also works for IS lights, so a Commando could be as large as a medium or lower heavy mech. Why come the metric scale misconcept with the false image that under the mech's armour everything is filled with stuffs. There are plenty and plenty air filled room in any chassis. Afterall techs need to get inside and reach everything...
In case of MechaGnome's opinion to give back the steroids to some lights... Lore-wise that could work. Game-wise, ummm, you see the big trouble to, right? Lights are hard to hit but one could hit them with an alpha. In TT only X% of weapons hit a target even if alpha strike committed. So lights in TT could be larger because there is no way to be fully hit by an alpha. In MWO it often happens that a single alpha eviscerates a light mech frontally. I could kill all lights with a single 80DMG alpha, tested it on the grounds and in matches. In the TT a 80DMG alpha may cause 20-30 real damage on a light.
So, while I admit lights could be a pain in the ***, there is a very good and valid reason they are, how it were said, so small. I have troubles with lights, many times, more so if come in pack. Yet I not say they OP, not say they weaklings, frankly, they need adequate pilot and luck apart from skill.
Bad ping were also mentioned. Sad but true, I rarely use my Mist lynx or Arctic cheetah because they uncontrollable if a single little lag occurs. Currently there is not much cure for that but that is also not the fault of the light mechs.
And I better finish this here and now...

So yeah, this topic went to far and not as it were intented as a mere mock for light-haters... Mea culpa! Deserved the ban-hammer, struck me down! Sooner or later it must have had happen...

#38 martian

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Posted 04 December 2021 - 11:49 PM

View PostDuke Falcon, on 03 December 2021 - 10:37 AM, said:

Yet I not say they OP, not say they weaklings, frankly, they need adequate pilot and luck apart from skill.

They need frequent training in them too, so you do not lose your habits, situational awareness and the "feel for the 'Mech".





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